FIX approved!!!!!

Borsig said:

But make no mistake - your car will NEVER be worth more than it is when VW buys it back - ever.

Click to expand...

What portion of your buyback is restitution? '15 owners who keep their cars get that when they get it fixed. Makes it a bit more attractive, I would think.

And if you like the car and want to keep it, resale is less important.

IndigoBlueWagon said:

What portion of your buyback is restitution? '15 owners who keep their cars get that when they get it fixed. Makes it a bit more attractive, I would think.
And if you like the car and want to keep it, resale is less important.

Click to expand...

That's what I'm thinking....Getting a check for about $6000-8000 AND keeping the car, keeping the 50 mpg, and getting a warrenty on most emissions and fuel related items to about 11 years and 150,000 miles removes much of the risks with failing parts on an expensive diesel car....
If you like the car, keeping it might be a great deal, longer term. Sure, it will never be with more than what VW is giving you now..But let's face it...The warrenty coverage that is being given is GREAT. And it says any disagreement will be settled to the consumers benefit.
Starting with a fresh DPF 40-70,000 miles, so if you assume they typically get filled at 150k, you are getting a new part with hopefully en extra year or two of research and technology improvements....And have one less thing to have fail, since its new.
For a bit I was thinking selling made sense....But the fix might be a OK deal.
Getting the $$$ over two years in two stages suck....But if you plan on driving it till thefirst is 10+ years old or untill "the wheels fall off", it's suddenly a great deal.
Maybe VW wants to ensure the last cars chug on and leave a lasting good impression sincecmany folks that keep them will hopefully tell people they love their cars...That's why they kept them. That is free advertising.

cane929 said:

162K miles or 11 years warranty, that is a great selling point on taking the fix over the buyback.

https://www.vwcourtsettlement.com/e...ssions_Modification_Disclosure_Volkswagen.pdf

Click to expand...

I'm VERY happy with the fix details, and I'm very happy I decided to keep the 2015. The details of the extended warranty just kill me:

The emissions system warranty shall cover the following parts or
systems:
- The entire exhaust after treatment system, including the Diesel
Oxidation Catalyst, the Diesel Particulate Filter, the Selective
Catalytic Reduction converter, the dosing injector and other Diesel
Exhaust Fluid system components (heater as well...?), the exhaust flap, and all sensors
and actuators
- The entire fuel system, including fuel pumps, high pressure fuel rail,
fuel injectors, vibration damper, pressure control valve and all
sensors and actuators
- The EGR system, including EGR valves, EGR cooler, EGR filter, EGR
temperature sensor, all related hoses and pipes, and all sensors
and actuators
- The turbocharger, including the turbocharger damper
- The On-Board Diagnostic (OBD) system, including SCR DEF quality
sensor, and any malfunctions detected...

Click to expand...

HOLY CRAP... All the things that worry me about new TDIs are going to be covered. Yeah, definitely keeping the car and driving the wheels off it. One happy consumer, here.

Borsig said:

people with 2015's - dont be stupid. Keep your car if you like it.

But make no mistake - your car will NEVER be worth more than it is when VW buys it back - ever.

My 15 will probably go back at the end of this year. with 70-80K on it, I'll be getting 29,300-29,600. I paid 29K, + the wheels I added, and tax. I'l' be keeping those wheels unless VW pays me for them (they wont).

This illusion that you'll get some outlandish premium for a rare car is flawed. There is probably no more rare CR tdi than a 2015 sportwagen. They were on dealer lots for what, 4-5 months before the stop sale? Less than half a model year.....

Of those cars, manuals, and SEL's with the lighting package are probably the rarest of the rare. Mine is an SEL with lighting package. My car will never be worth more than the nearly 30K VW will be paying me for it. There is zero financial gain to be found from keeping it. None. Youve driven a 'free' car for 2-3 years, likely paying only maintenance and possibly taxes. And I do 25-30K a year.

No one will ever buy my car for 29.5K. Certainly not after the EPA butchers it.

Click to expand...

That's one way to look at it.
My car is 2015 Golf SEL with lighting package. My buyback is roughly 26k. Agree that I wouldn't be able to sell it for that. But they are willing to give me just shy of $7k to keep it. So the value would be about $19k.

I'm not sure I could sell it for that either.

But keeping it with a long warranty for a low cost of operation great car has it's own value to me. Replacing it isn't so easy.

I'll probably go back and forth a half dozen times between now and the time I make my final decision. No reason to rush a decision.
1. Drive until the last minute and turn in for very little depreciation seeing as we get 12.5k miles per year with NO depreciation.
2. Let them fix it and keep the free $7k + $1K they already gave me. And a great extended warranty.

I purchased the upgraded VW 4 year / 100k warranty when I bought the car. Seems it may be redundant but I don't want to cancel until I know what I'm going to do.

I just pulled the trigger on uploading my documents for the FIX. I instantly made my mind up that it was going to be fix or no I'm driving this car until the wheels fall off. I would not have bought it otherwise. And by the time all is said and done - I'm getting just barely over $7000 for the fix (currently at 26,000 miles since Feb 2015). Just not worth doing the buyback - I'd only get about $9000 and still need to go buy a replacement car.

Leeshepard said:

Why is the ad blue refill interval a problem that would require installing a larger tank? If it gets low you go to the nearest auto parts store, get a $12 bottle of it, and pour it in right next to the gas filler. 2 minutes, done. Am I missing something?

Click to expand...

VW wants to be able to sell the car to anybody, even someone who is incapable of performing the simplest task (but somehow still can drive).

I'll bet there are people out there who only go to full service gas stations and literally don't know how the fuel gets in the tank. All they know is when the light turns on, they have to go to the station and hand their credit card to the attendant. You just know there's someone out there like that, and VW doesn't want to scare them off with complicated procedures.

Mike_04GolfTDI said:

VW wants to be able to sell the car to anybody, even someone who is incapable of performing the simplest task (but somehow still can drive).

I'll bet there are people out there who only go to full service gas stations and literally don't know how the fuel gets in the tank. All they know is when the light turns on, they have to go to the station and hand their credit card to the attendant. You just know there's someone out there like that, and VW doesn't want to scare them off with complicated procedures.

Click to expand...

Go to NJ or Oregon where the states don't allow drivers to put GASOLINE into their own cars..... And alot of stations think that applies to diesels as well...

Mike_04GolfTDI said:

VW wants to be able to sell the car to anybody, even someone who is incapable of performing the simplest task (but somehow still can drive).

.

Click to expand...

Driving all started to go downhill in 1915 when Kettering invented the electric starter. Heck, I bet there are people who find it a daunting task to open and close side windows with a hand crank.

Keith63 said:

This confirms what I have said all along. There will not be a fix for the Gen 1's or Gen 2's. Just look what they are having to due to the Gen 3's (2015 models) just to make them compliant. Come the deadline for the fix for Gen 1's and Gen 2's, there won't be one and you will have the following two choices:
1) Keep you TDI and receive nothing ( As in no compensation) or
2) Let VW buyback your TDI for a price much less than those who chose the buyback initially.

Click to expand...

Keith.....I don't think that will happen. In fact, I expect it will be the complete opposite: if no fix is found, VW will INCREASE the buy-back values/offers for the Gen 1 and 2 cars, because the Consent Decree states that, if 85% of the cars are not either bought back or brought into compliance (bolds mine) VW will be subject to much heftier fines.

I'm actually hoping that's the case, because I originally submitted my choice as 'keeping the car' and....as u said if the Gen 3's have to have that massive amount of changes, pretty safe to assume the Gen 2's will not be fixable.

And VW has (also per the Consent Decree) until Jan 17 of this year (less than two weeks from now) to present the preliminary plans for making the Gen 1's and 2's compliant, so...we may be closer than we think to the 'final countdown.'

Give me another 4k-5k on top of the amount already being offered and I will be happy to sell mine back.

Follow thread

The offers are not going to be increased. There would be legal hell to pay if they changed the terms of the deal mid-stream. Ain't gonna happen.

Yup. Wishful thinking.

And isn't the final date the 27th, not the 17th.

GoFaster said:

The offers are not going to be increased. There would be legal hell to pay if they changed the terms of the deal mid-stream. Ain't gonna happen.

Click to expand...

Well, if they can't fix them, then they (VW) are in violation of the consent decree (the deal) mid-stream themselves, which opens up a bunch of other legal ramifications.

What would be the recourse for those of us who indicated 'we wanted our cars fixed' -if they can't fix them? They also 'promised' extended warranties and all other goodies with 'the fix', what happens with VW possibly reneging on that?

Those of us who make up the 15% of the owners who did not immediately sign up for the buy-back...we will make up a much smaller (and much more aggrieved) legal class with not one fraud to bear but two, the second being when we were defrauded when VW suggested a fix + a bunch of other goodies would be possible and available to us...

Read the court paperwork . . . already published, and already discussed to death here . . .

You have all these people who say they are going to turn in their cars at the last moment, taking advantage of their "depreciation free" two years of ownership.

Galo said:

Well, if they can't fix them, then they (VW) are in violation of the consent decree (the deal) mid-stream themselves, which opens up a bunch of other legal ramifications.

What would be the recourse for those of us who indicated 'we wanted our cars fixed' -if they can't fix them? They also 'promised' extended warranties and all other goodies with 'the fix', what happens with VW possibly reneging on that?

Those of us who make up the 15% of the owners who did not immediately sign up for the buy-back...we will make up a much smaller (and much more aggrieved) legal class with not one fraud to bear but two, the second being when we were defrauded when VW suggested a fix + a bunch of other goodies would be possible and available to us...

Click to expand...

You are putting the cart before the horse by assuming there will be no fix/extended warranty for the gen 1 and gen 2 cars. You are always free to take the buyback if you feel like you are getting shafted.

Galo said:

Well, if they can't fix them, then they (VW) are in violation of the consent decree (the deal) mid-stream themselves, which opens up a bunch of other legal ramifications.

What would be the recourse for those of us who indicated 'we wanted our cars fixed' -if they can't fix them? They also 'promised' extended warranties and all other goodies with 'the fix', what happens with VW possibly reneging on that?

Those of us who make up the 15% of the owners who did not immediately sign up for the buy-back...we will make up a much smaller (and much more aggrieved) legal class with not one fraud to bear but two, the second being when we were defrauded when VW suggested a fix + a bunch of other goodies would be possible and available to us...

Click to expand...

VW would not be in violation of the consent decree. They have not promised they will have a fix that the EPA approves and the settlement outlines the consequences if they don't. There is no new fraud

Galo said:

Well, if they can't fix them, then they (VW) are in violation of the consent decree (the deal) mid-stream themselves, which opens up a bunch of other legal ramifications.

Click to expand...

No, they aren't. The deal already contemplates that they won't be able to get a fix approved (for some or all of the affected vehicles). And when you think about it, they can't be in violation for the EPA's refusal to approve their fix.

If VW is unable to get a fix approved for a generation of cars, owners of that generation can sell the cars back under the same terms as everyone else. Or, I think, they have a new opportunity to opt out and bring their own case. That's it; there will be no renegotiating the buyback amounts.

The buyback/"fix" $$$ could increase...

VW has to remove from the roads or fix 85% of the offending TDIs by the end of 2018. If we're getting close to that date and VW is in danger of missing that quota, they may up their $$$ offered for a buyback or fix. There is nothing stopping VW from improving the offer, provided they don't try to incent owners into a "fix" rather than a buyback.

gearheadgrrrl said:

VW has to remove from the roads or fix 85% of the offending TDIs by the end of 2018. If we're getting close to that date and VW is in danger of missing that quota, they may up their $$$ offered for a buyback or fix. There is nothing stopping VW from improving the offer, provided they don't try to incent owners into a "fix" rather than a buyback.

Click to expand...

Yes, but you only have to read this forum to see that there are a lot of people who intend to turn in their cars eventually, but only after they get their full two years of "depreciation free" ownership.

In other words, there will be a lot of people on the last train out of the station.

I wonder how fast this fix will be applied to all the `Stop Sale' 2015 TDIs that are on all the backlots of many dealerships??

How much of a discount will be applied to all these then fixed, `Stop Sale' TDIs?? I personally think they should all be sold with deep discounts for those that want them.

I just submitted my online information with scanned documents, (registration, title, and ID), last Friday.. I'm wondering how long I now have to wait to hear back from VW??

Texas-Rebel said:

I wonder how fast this fix will be applied to all the `Stop Sale' 2015 TDIs that are on all the backlots of many dealerships??

How much of a discount will be applied to all these then fixed, `Stop Sale' TDIs?? I personally think they should all be sold with deep discounts for those that want them.

Click to expand...

If and when sold, they will sell for what people are willing to pay for them. And I doubt they will all get sold on the first day offered.

All the '15s at two local dealers are spoken for. Other dealers have waiting lists for '15s when they are available for sale.

IndigoBlueWagon said:

All the '15s at two local dealers are spoken for. Other dealers have waiting lists for '15s when they are available for sale.

Click to expand...

Makes you wonder what kind of deals those folks are expecting. I'd certainly consider a "new" 2015 car, but the price would have to reflect that it's a two-year-old car. I wonder if the people who have "spoken for" the remaining cars expect the same, or are planning on paying MSRP. The dealers might find that they've sold fewer cars than they expect. Or there might really be that many people willing to pay top dollar for the cars, in which case they can have them.

One dealer is charging MSRP for the cars, they're all taken. Another says "at least $5,100 off" which makes sense. Those are all taken, too. There's a third dealer here that has quite a few TDIs (over 60) but I don't know anyone there so I'm not sure what they're charging or if they have cars available.

If I could find the '15 I want I'd pay MSRP for it. Doesn't matter to me if it's two years old, as long as it's in new condition. By the time I got around to selling it the model year will be irrelevant.

IndigoBlueWagon said:

If I could find the '15 I want I'd pay MSRP for it. Doesn't matter to me if it's two years old, as long as it's in new condition. By the time I got around to selling it the model year will be irrelevant.

Click to expand...

I was wondering if the fuel sitting in them for so long would cause some problems down the road.

I would be interested if the price was right and the "fix" warranty applied which I would think it must as well as the claimed DSG improvements that the software update is supposed to make.

I wouldn't worry about the fuel. I have a B4 in my warehouse now that was last fueled in 2010. Runs fine. And part of the "TDI I want" is no DSG.

I suppose diesel is more stable than gas. I will need a DSG for my wife. I think I may keep my 6sp manual Passat. The new warranty is a motivator but I still have that POBD code popping up time to time. Annoying!!!!

Then do the math on the amount of the fine per car that remains on the road but not in compliance...