is there a big jump in HP/TQ between gtb2260vk and gtb2565vk?

MAXRPM

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I'm going to try the 49/51 wheel and make 2560vk on a new turbo housing, will install it and if it is laggy and sucks, I'll change and put my old 2260 back in, but what I'm going to get is 50 grams of lighter wheel than stock that I believe is 46/50mm, my guts feeling is that it should spool faster, we'll see hope I'm right,
 

Macradiators.com

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2560 makes no sense for me , but i dont understand much when it comes to turbos.
wrong wrong choice, i would not spend 1 cent for that as it sounds just wrong having the exhaust that big.
Keep it stock , for your target is the best choice.
 

mrchill

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I dont even like spool on the 2260....much less a 2560. I i,agine its good for 3500-5500. And really big numbers...but down low...disappointing and poor mileage.
 

loudspl

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As we know 12mm + HFLOx 0.341 can deliver fuel for approx. 460bhp (NOS result). How much your goal is if you really need 0.460 Nozzles? Do you are satisfied how those nozzles work in normal driving situations?
I would not use 0.460um nozzles for normal city driving situations.

Too much smoke for everyday use at least with a VE, hybrid turbo, and OE pop pressures.
Maybe they would be ok if you set at high pop pressures and reduce fuel in maps but then what is the point for massive nozzles? :)
 

MAXRPM

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as far as I know I haven't seen anybody chiming in on having 2560vk? they probably have 2565vk or tried it, so Mr chill so how do you know 2565vk will behave bad if we haven't seen one on an alh yet? it still puzzles me why speculate on a Turbo that nobody here at the forum has come forward with it? I'm saying this cause I am going to try to be a Guinea pig when builder tries to fit those blades in 2260
 

mrchill

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It takes energy to move a turbine. The larger the wheels and housings, the more energy to move them. Also weight is a factor. Larger turbos, while they make a lot of power...simply cannot have good spool down low with 2 liters worth of exhaust energy. If you are looking for big power...then why not? But you will lose the low range for sure...and part of the middle. And your mileage will suffer. Its possible that some turbos will spool better on an ALH...maybe even this one. But due to the limited architecture of the ALH along with the very low fuel pressure....it will be a challenge to make this turbo spool well under 3 without smoke.
 

MAXRPM

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what attract me is that blades on 49/51 is lighter by 50 grams than stock blades, doing the math it should spool the same or better than stock, we'll see how it goes, I'll give it a try, remember we are talking new generation of blades which equals lighter wheels
 

adamss24

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Physics is physics, you cannot bend the rules. One way to do lighter Cw is by using exotic alloys, to me it seems manufacturers just skim the blades to loose grams. I agree spool on that big turbo will suffer and you will end with smoke on idle due to oil seeping from turbo seals... As mentioned above there is not enough energy in that engine low/midrange to spol that turbo... Gtb2260vk is laggy on a ve engine... I had 2565 on a v6 tdi engine and it was ok but gtb2260vk was better!
 

Macradiators.com

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If it's light it doesnt mean it will spool faster. I also believed that , i was totally wrong :) It takes a lot of gas and work/ knowledge to spool a big turbine.
2260vk stock was your best choice or how Ruben says the gtd2060
 

Yucca

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I think that bigger compressor wheel is main reason for slower boost. It is very rare to upgrade only turbine wheel and keep compressor wheel totally stock.

If problem is turbine wheel, I think that slower response is because of different turbine wheel size or profile, weight have smaller impact of those things.
 
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diffas

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Like yucca said. Upgrading tw sometimes helps spooling up when keep stock cw, but that mostly comes in when cw is quite big compared to tw. Some years ago i did swap tw from gtx2863r and replaced it gt29r series 90trim wheel. Same..64 housing waa machined. Result was quite nice. 300-400rpm better spool and almost 1bar less emp. In vnt world not sure if the case is the same, it should when running high boost levels.
 

MAXRPM

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how about Gtb2265Vklr with ceramic ball bearings, and new generation of wheels ?
 

Devilsfuel

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I am waiting on delivery of a GTB2565VKLR. I expect it will have the same turbine that you guys are speaking off (lightweight, 49/51)

I will report back on driveability, although this will be fitted to a 3.0 CDI rather than the 2 litre
 

Macradiators.com

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on the 3.0 it spools better for sure, i have same turbo (just not BB) and it goes great

on 2.0 it's just sad, you are talking about 400hp of turbo

First of all, you need to set your target HP. Then get the smallest turbo possible to bring you there. Its that simple.

A huge turbo is overkill and useless if you plan on having 250hp.
I am discovering lately that small turbo can deliver plenty of air, enough to burn smokeless lots of fuel.
 

loudspl

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how about Gtb2265Vklr with ceramic ball bearings, and new generation of wheels ?
Maybe good for better transient response, but building inertia of larger wheels is still a problem. Low-rpm response is not great and requesting boost early only causes surge & shortens turbo life. I am running a 6+6 hybrid variant now and low-end response is not good, even with massive fueling.
Over 3.2k rpm is great, but if you want it to be alive under that, look elsewhere

A huge turbo is overkill and useless if you plan on having 250hp.
I am discovering lately that small turbo can deliver plenty of air, enough to burn smokeless lots of fuel.
If the goal is 250+, it's still better to go with larger turbo and have reasonable boost request for shaft speeds that keep it together. Smaller wheels and A/R fix the low-end, but don't expect it to last long requesting high boost if you want big numbers. Really depends what you goal is and how reliable you want this to be
 

Macradiators.com

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stock 2260 is more than enough for 250hp with awesome spool at low rpm and long life. There are crazy ppl outhere that done 330-340hp with 1000C+ egt which is crazy
I think Dragos did 240 on the 2.0 CR with 1756vk on good dyno, with safe limits.
 

MAXRPM

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I got more than 250hp so that is out of question, with gtb2260vk, I know that gtb2260vklr will spool better then gtb2260vk, and will give me more on the top end.
 

3L3M3NT

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Macradiators.com

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I am still not convinced the vklr is worth the money. If you keep it stock maybe you make boost 3-400rpm earlier, but as top end i dont know if there is gain.

I know guys on 2262vk making 2.5 bar @ 2800rpm on PD.

The new gtd is to be explored, there is no data so far, could be great.

For now i will build another 1-2 turbos to explore 2 different goals:

a. street use 2.5bar @3000rpm is the goal and keep it if egt allows till 5000rpm on 2.0 CR

b. bigger version for 3bar @5000rpm to take with me as spare for dyno run.
 

mrchill

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I'm not sure AVD had a setup for the VE as yet. They have is for newer stuff though. Looks interesting...maybe worth calling them if you are set on a huge turbo.
 

MAXRPM

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Google gtb2260vk vs gtb2260vklr and you'll see the results on a lab
 

adamss24

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Actually is a pointless comparison, the vklr will cook the bearings in no time if a boost pipe bursts and fron experience they are not that reliable- the bolts holding the vnt cage are breaking from EGT and vanes hit the turbine wheel on a few ocasions on my mates car-b7 2.0 tdi... It was spooling nice but not reliable in long run. On the other hand i can sacrifice a few hundred rpm's off spool and go with a tried and tested setup: gtb2260vk is far better put together! I have them both in stock and modified trims and even have a monster turbine wheel and 69 ETT 6+6 billet compressor wheel to fit, pointless to be honest as i dont havea an engine capable of driving that sucessfuly!
Next turbo will be large enough to have acceptable egt yet small enough to have decent spool... On a car that i race size is not an issue but on a daily driver smaller is better!
 

Macradiators.com

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If you pop a hose at 2,5 bar its adio vklr :) The test in lab where you see it spools more seconds ..its useless.
You need to compare top power which is given by compressor wheel and turbine wheel.
Ruben has explained that in some thread.
 

Devilsfuel

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From my experience owning a 350 CDI with stock 2260VKLR I can say I can tell a difference in spool against my mates 3.0 tdi A5 with 2260vk, a few hundred rpm but transient response is better. It's not hugely different but we agree response is better low down. Obviously different engines and loads of variables but thought it was worth mentioning.

Does anyone have any info on the so called gen 2 comp wheels ? The marketing blurs says faster spool and potential of greater flow.
 

Macradiators.com

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Greater flow yes and more HP at top end, but i dont think faster spool. I havent seen it after weeks of tests.
What made a difference was the smaller cw.
 
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sam-

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Starting to be afraid using the gtb2060vklr i have, is this really so weak ?
I'm plaining to use it on AFN, wont do any porting on head for the moment maybe only camshaft so i bet max 250hp, should i keep it or move to something else ?
I got a 52mm (56mm extended tip) mfs wheel but i dont think it will be good to install it on the original turbo which is so tiny.
 

MAXRPM

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I really thought that guys that installed 2260vklr were happy and had a reliable turbo, 1st time I read about issues with 2260vklr and they appear to be serious
 

diffas

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If you keep it stock instead ruining with random mods it is probably much more reliable. :)
 

majesty78

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Most turbo issues are not directly related to the turbo itself, except using used/worn out stuff to save a penny (and waste twice the money in the long run)

But in general, abusing and raping the turbos beyond their limits or in bad setups will always cause issues, even with the best turbo available.....
 
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