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General Automotive General automotive discussion. This is intended to be a discussion about other not VW and Diesel cars you may have or interested in.

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Old February 12th, 2020, 13:10   #5281
turbobrick240
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A highly track prepped (except for tires, oddly) Model 3 performance has matched the lap time of a McLaren F1 on a famous Japanese track! :

https://electrek-co.cdn.ampproject.o...1-racetrack%2F

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Old February 12th, 2020, 23:20   #5282
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Latency is really only an issue if you're gaming. Even there Starlink won't be nearly as bad as current options since the satellites will be in a lower orbit of ~210 miles vs ~485 miles for Iridium or ~22,000 miles for Hughes net.

Most satellite internet currently uses geostationary satellites while starlink will be in LEO. The latency with LEO based internet will be SIGNIFICANTLY better.
Apparently you have never done networking in the real world or professionally. Latency *KILLS* throughput in higher speed networks. Even 1 or 2 ms is detrimental, 600 unusable just about across the board, and 30ms only tolerable at slow speeds (such as most internet services) Get to actual high speed networks (10 gigabit and up) as opposed to the crap they peddle to the public, and it's a whole different ball game. 30ms may work for home networks, but not much else, so low altitude sats can help, but ever get close to land based glass . . .

Familiar with the concept of TCP windowing? It's amazingg] how much data can 'sit on the wire' in a high latency network, and with TCP (most things) the ack won't come back to allow more TX until a full round trip has been made. (Even with windowing, there are limits).
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Old February 12th, 2020, 23:42   #5283
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Apparently you have never done networking in the real world or professionally. Latency *KILLS* throughput in higher speed networks. Even 1 or 2 ms is detrimental, 600 unusable just about across the board, and 30ms only tolerable at slow speeds (such as most internet services) Get to actual high speed networks (10 gigabit and up) as opposed to the crap they peddle to the public, and it's a whole different ball game. 30ms may work for home networks, but not much else, so low altitude sats can help, but ever get close to land based glass . . .

Familiar with the concept of TCP windowing? It's amazingg] how much data can 'sit on the wire' in a high latency network, and with TCP (most things) the ack won't come back to allow more TX until a full round trip has been made. (Even with windowing, there are limits).
.... I've used the internet... I've used satellite internet.... I know that I don't care if it takes 300ms or 2ms between clicks for something to happen unless I'm playing an online game. I know the only time I care about latency >1s is when I'm playing a game.

Point is that for most people just using the internet for anything other than gaming 'Starlink' will work just fine.

I guess it's a bit like EVs... there's always going to be that 0.1% use case that something else is better at in a very narrow circumstance
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Old February 13th, 2020, 09:44   #5284
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Starlink should be more than adequate for gaming too. 30 ms latency is typical of what most gamers are currently getting on their high speed internet service. It would really only be slow for something like high frequency algorithm based stock trading where every millisecond matters. Even there it's probably faster than land based fiberoptics or microwave transmission that is going to the other side of the planet.

https://www.tesmanian.com/blogs/tesm...s-this-weekend

https://www.dotcom-tools.com/interne...e-latency.aspx

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Old February 13th, 2020, 10:04   #5285
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And realistically, HFT is done in datacenters that are physically close to the exchanges, where Starlink is irrelevant (its benefits are greatest in lower-density areas).
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Old February 13th, 2020, 15:58   #5286
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In 2017 we bought a 2013 Fiat 500e from a Fiat dealer in PA. It had 9,000 miles and cost $8000, with a Fiat CPO warranty.

It's closing in on 30,000 miles now. In that time it's had a rear wheel bearing replaced under warranty ($150 deductable), I've replaced the tires ($380 for 4 Yokohamas), wiper blades, and the 12v battery. I also changed out the brake fluid in the master cylinder reservoir. Oh and a few refills of the washer fluid. That's it!

This summer I'll look into changing the coolant.

The car gets around 4 miles per kWh, with with our electric rates means about $0.03/mile in energy costs.... so about $600 in electricity. That same miles in the Mk4 Jetta would have cost about $1400 in Diesel.

Thanks,
I appreciate the feedback. Right now a coworker of mine is leaning to get a used EV as commuter vehicle for a 85 mile round trip. Budget is fairly tight, $12000 would be pushing it. I think it will be tight to make it on one charge with a used Kia Soul EV but here at work we have a very few 110 volt outlets that some drivers have been using to recharge while in the office, so there is a possibility.

Thoughts?
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Old February 13th, 2020, 16:43   #5287
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RUG is 1.99 here today
The EV economics don't seem favorable to me
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Old February 13th, 2020, 21:55   #5288
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$1.84 regular and $2.25 diesel here today at QT. Lowest prices I have seen in some time. Better fill up the Suburban and the Beetle.
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Old February 13th, 2020, 22:24   #5289
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I appreciate the feedback. Right now a coworker of mine is leaning to get a used EV as commuter vehicle for a 85 mile round trip. Budget is fairly tight, $12000 would be pushing it. I think it will be tight to make it on one charge with a used Kia Soul EV but here at work we have a very few 110 volt outlets that some drivers have been using to recharge while in the office, so there is a possibility.

Thoughts?
I think your co-worker would be better served by a used Chevy Volt for that commute. I don't think a gen 1 Kia Soul EV would make 85 miles. It would be very taxing on the battery if it could. The only way I could see that working is if at least several hours of charging at work is guaranteed every day. A Chevy Bolt would be good too, but they start at around $20k these days.
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Old February 13th, 2020, 22:38   #5290
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I appreciate the feedback. Right now a coworker of mine is leaning to get a used EV as commuter vehicle for a 85 mile round trip... I think it will be tight to make it on one charge with a used Kia Soul EV but here at work we have a very few 110 volt outlets that some drivers have been using to recharge while in the office, so there is a possibility.
Thoughts?
110V to get 45miles worth of charge....unless you're putting in 12hr days, I don't think that's gonna work. And if the charging is only a "maybe"....and then if it's cold and wet so you need heat in the car....

Be prepared to find a charging station on the way home each day.

Last thing you want after (or during) a long day at work is stressing over whether or not you're gonna be able to coax the car all the way home.
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Old February 14th, 2020, 06:19   #5291
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RUG is 1.99 here today
The EV economics don't seem favorable to me
With a 35 mpg gasser, that gives a cost of $0.057/mile. More than double an EV.

-J
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Old February 14th, 2020, 07:12   #5292
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I'm in the same boat here with a 80 mile round trip daily. But then I also work at a Chevy/VW dealer with L2 chargers and one I think is DC fast charge. But then I have to figure out a charging solution at home.

Have been looking at eGolfs, but trying to hit the sweet spot of a payment that is same or off sets my fuel bill. Currently a 1.8T A/T MkIV. Currently $160/mo for gas. (410 miles @ just under 30mpg and prefers super over RUG with 193k miles on it).

Just missed a 2015 limited for $8700, and most of the rest regionally are >$12K.

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Old February 14th, 2020, 07:20   #5293
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But people already own their current cars. They would have to buy an EV for way more money. I bought my 2015 Beetle new in 2017 and it is paid for. It would take forever to recoup that money with that fuel cost difference. I bought the 2002 Suburban for $1200 cash. Even though it is a gas sucker you would never recoup the difference. If you have to own a $30k and up new car, then maybe you are right, it would be better. For the majority of people who drive cheap cars and use cheap fuel it makes no sense at all.

Almost nothing EV available locally for $10k or less except old Leaf's. Not having one of those.
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Old February 14th, 2020, 07:34   #5294
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110V to get 45miles worth of charge....unless you're putting in 12hr days, I don't think that's gonna work. And if the charging is only a "maybe"....and then if it's cold and wet so you need heat in the car....

Be prepared to find a charging station on the way home each day.

Last thing you want after (or during) a long day at work is stressing over whether or not you're gonna be able to coax the car all the way home.
Yes I understand it is close so a Volt might be a better choice in this situation/budget as turbobrick240 suggests.

It would have been very useful to be able to rent or loan a Kia Soul EV and test it out in this route. Charge it fully at home. Drive 43 miles to work, charge it using 110 volt plug for 8 hours and drive back home. Do this for five days and record results.

I do not think this is a possibility in our area (SE Texas). Years ago I used to see some Nissan Leaf cars around but lately not. In fact I cannot recall seeing even a few budget EVs around. 'Budget' as in being able to buy them used (three year old) around $12K or so.
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Old February 14th, 2020, 08:32   #5295
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There could be a million, and the latency of the long haulup and back will still be a problem. TCP/IP just does not run well on high latency connections . . .
Starlink isn't your grandmother's satellite internet. With low Earth orbit satellites, laser sat-to-sat communication and ground links to bounce the signal, latency should be similar or better to fiber in most situations.

Here's a great video simulating Starlink's latency.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m05abdGSOxY
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