Hole in oil pan

Jetta SS · Apr 10, 2019

I hit something in the road last night. Got half a mile down the road then the oil light began flashing. I immediately shut the car down and pulled to the side of the road.

How likely is it my engine is damaged? Or put a new oil pan on and it's good?

Steve Addy · Apr 10, 2019

Jetta SS said:
I hit something in the road last night. Got half a mile down the road then the oil light began flashing. I immediately shut the car down and pulled to the side of the road.
How likely is it my engine is damaged? Or put a new oil pan on and it's good?

That is a nasty hole! Your oil would have been gone in seconds!!

Ditto what was posted above. Since you shut it down that quickly I think you'll be ok. I would order a new pan and gasket and while waiting for it pull the pan and have a look up inside there.

I might pull my glow plugs and rotate engine by hand to see that everything down there is moving as it should. While it would be tough to say for certain that there's no other damage, that is a monster of a hole!

Good luck

Steve

Jetta SS · Apr 10, 2019

Steve Addy said:
That is a nasty hole! Your oil would have been gone in seconds!!

It was metal, whatever it was. Hit it at 70mph and it was a serious impact. There's probably more damage under the car. I still keep full coverage on the car, and am far from home so I left it at the insurance approved shop.

As far as the oil, the whole rear of the car is covered. I bet I left my mark on the road.

Abacus · Apr 10, 2019

Wow, that was nasty, those pans are tough. The turbo takes the hit first due to oil starvation. It looks like the oil left fairly quickly so maybe the turbo will survive but maybe it won’t.

Mongler98 · Apr 10, 2019

A hole like that will drain the oil within about a blink of an eye and the rest of the oil in the engine will be lost withing the next second, well more importantly it will drain as to not let the oil pick up get any feed. The oil pressure sending unit on these cares (and most cars) work at an operating pressure, no pressure and the light comes on. Point is, the moment you hot the thing that did this to the moment you turned off the car, you can just say that the engine did not have any oil pressure, and if it did, it was not enough to guarantee no damage or wear was done.
Seeing as you were going 70mph and you traveled about 1/2 mile like that, you’re spinning at a fairly medium RPM. I would gather that you have suffered minimal to moderate damage mostly to the turbo journal bearing and the crank. The extent of this damage is going to be fairly unknown, could be a tiny bit but the chance that NO damage was done? You would be lucky and I would give you a 10% chance at that.

A few things you can do. Measure the turbo end play and side to side, as long as that’s within spec, I would say its fine.
I would replace the pan, fill with oil, and drive for 10 miles or until warm. Drain the oil and oil filter into a CLEAN and I mean CLEAN pail. While it is draining, take a sample for Blackstone oil testing labs and send them your sample. With the rest of the oil, Dilute the oil once drained with about 1/2 quart of gasoline. Now pour that though 2 layers of coffee filters. Take the oil filter and with a pair of snips, NOT A SAW OR CUT OFF WHEEL, cut off the rolled flare so you can pull the pleats out and inspect. Drain and dilute and filter all the oil in the oil filter separately and inspect the pleats. If NO glitter or metal particles are present, fill her up with some fresh to spec diesel oil and a nice new mobile one, Purolator, Mann Oil filter. And move on with life and just keep an eye on it and do the same procedure next oil change.
If the oil test comes back with high metal content, more than normal, and you had glittery motor oil when drained or you got some metal shavings, don’t drive it until you can have the bearings swapped or whatever the parts are that got worn down. Unless the car is not of much value, you can take the gamble and just keep an eye on it.

Jetta_Pilot · Apr 11, 2019

Jetta SS said:
I hit something in the road last night. Got half a mile down the road then the oil light began flashing. I immediately shut the car down and pulled to the side of the road.
How likely is it my engine is damaged? Or put a new oil pan on and it's good?

Perfect reason to put on an aluminum skid plate for safety and no more holes in the thin oil pan.

turbodieseldyke · Apr 11, 2019

If that was a big sharp chunk of steel he ran over, the skid plate might not have saved him. Super quick thinking saved him.

Jetta SS · Apr 11, 2019

CrazyQuantumMan said:
No oil? No problem!

17 MIN, not bad. Reminds me of the old slick 50 commercials.

Jetta_Pilot said:
Perfect reason to put on an aluminum skid plate for safety and no more holes in the thin oil pan.

You know I was thinking about that afterwards, because I considered getting one of those panzer plates like 15 years ago. It's possible, the only "save" story I've read was at low speed though.

Abacus · Apr 11, 2019

turbodieseldyke said:
If that was a big sharp chunk of steel he ran over, the skid plate might not have saved him. Super quick thinking saved him.

I bet it would have. Those things are very thick and I’ve hit a ton with them and not had so much as a scratch.

turbodieseldyke · Apr 11, 2019

Abacus said:
I bet it would have. Those things are very thick and I’ve hit a ton with them and not had so much as a scratch.

Good to know.

Abacus · Apr 12, 2019

I’ve hit stuff so hard that it honestly rang my ears. I got out to check and could not see any damage. Up here we have solid ice chunks in the roadway during winter and numerous dead animals the rest of the year. It was money well spent.

Tdijarhead · Apr 12, 2019

Ice chunks, dead animals, the ever present freeway road gator, construction debris and of course people that haul trash or firewood and just can’t seem to load it without it falling off.

A skidplate is an indispensable part for these cars, just as essential as a vcds.

oilhammer · Apr 12, 2019

That is one heck of a hit.

Engine/turbo damage aside (only way you'll know is to replace the pan and fill it with oil and see how it does), you may also want to check the three mounting brackets for damage. They can crack if the impact is severe enough.

Hopefully nothing went up and physically damaged the crank or the oil pump/pickup tube.

I had a AZG (2003 2.slo) that was smacked so hard, it not only ripped the bottom of the oil pan clean off, it broke the oil pump off the block, ripped the chain off and mangled the sealing flange and sprockets, broke the mount bracket on the timing belt end of the engine, broke the accessory mount bracket, tore the power steering pump off, broke the pressure line, which pulled so hard on the starter bolt it broke the stud off the end, in addition to breaking the lock carrier, fan shroud, radiator, condenser , etc.

I fixed it up and it survives to this day.

Jetta SS · Apr 12, 2019

Thanks for all the good advice above. I guess I had to learn the hard way on skidplates. Oilhammer, I passed that info on to the shop.

Funny thing is I just got an email today from carfax informing me that my 2014 TDI that I turned in for the buy back is being serviced pre sale on a lot in Springfield, Missouri. It's like they know I toofed this one and might wanna buy the 2014 back.

Steve Addy · Apr 12, 2019

Toofed....hahahaha

I hope your Jetta ends up being ok, in all honesty I would rather have the '98 over the '14 for a variety of reasons.

Just thank God it wasn't a Mk4, now those things are low and vulnerable!

Steve

glenn1179 · Apr 17, 2019

They have also informed me I cannot "buy it back" because I am not a resident of the state where the loss occurred. The only choice I was offered was to withdraw my claim. This sucks.[/QUOTE said:
That is the main reason I don't bother with full coverage anymore. The hassle of insurance under-valuing the car and the nuances of their buy back procedures don't seem to be worth hassle and added expense.

Not being able to buy it back because you're not a resident of the state in which the loss occurred sounds like a total scam. That one might be worth a call to a government office that oversees insurance to confirm that it is true. More hassle, but might be worth it.

After I confirmed the claim that I couldn't buy it back was true, I'd probably withdraw the claim and keep the car. I tend to try to fix them myself and hold on to them forever though.

Abacus · Apr 17, 2019

Do not accept their first offer.

Steve Addy · Apr 17, 2019

Jetta SS said:
So the insurance has decided to declare it a loss. They tell me their Auto Check guide says it's worth $1400, and that I did a respray ($700), new tires($300), TB ($150), and bilsteins ($300) 2 years ago does not increase the value.

They have also informed me I cannot "buy it back" because I am not a resident of the state where the loss occurred.

The only choice I was offered was to withdraw my claim.

This sucks.

That sounds totally bogus. I would call the insurance commissioner for your state and find out if they can do that.

As for dropping full coverage I have considered it since I insure multiple vehicles but it's really not that expensive to have the full coverage, then again if they're not going to pay out or allow a buy-back in a specific situation it's kind of worthless.

I should check with my carrier to see whether they have any stinky fine print like that I need to know of.

As a side note they can say anything they want about what upgrades you've done and whether that adds value, but that doesn't necessarily mean that what they say is true, it's just a tactic employed to try and tell you how this is going to go down.

The one thing you have going in your favor is time. Your insurer will want to wrap this up before month end and at the very least before end of the year. The longer it drags on the more they will be inclined to work with you.

I would fix this and get your car home and then go after the claim with the insurer, if that's something you can do.

Steve

Mongler98 · Apr 18, 2019

Sounds about right. You should read your policy. But still, never take the first offer and the list you have in vale is fairly worthless, I'd take the price and half it at least, but the value of the car is a good bit low

Jetta SS · Apr 18, 2019

2 years ago after the buy back of my '14 I set aside $2k and took care of all maintenance and repairs. Even did the dreaded heater core and vent fix. Since then it's nickel and dimed a couple hundred more in minor things. So in my eyes it was a machine that looked good inside and out. Garaged at home, covered at work. All maintenance up to date, everything in working order. The only major flaw was the EGR leaking a little oil.

It is 21 years old and high mileage though, I probably would only get $1400 if I sold it, guess I was hoping for a little more since it's insurance. My buddy recently had a hail damage loss on his Dodge Dakota. We looked it up on kbb and it showed $4400. He ended up getting $6500 then bought it back for $700.

I'm going to try to get some more out of em. Then keep pursuing buying it back. Maybe I can find the auction it ends up at?

I've still got to get my belongings out. I'm hoping they don't mess with me pulling my system. I've got a 12" sub, amp and new head unit in there.

Jetta SS · Apr 29, 2019

Thanks for all the help on this! After doing a little research and contacting the insurance commissioners office, I called the insurance company. They reviewed the laws and agreed to sell it back.

I also disputed the value, and was able to get a couple hundred more. Ended up buying it back for $300 and towing it 200 miles back home.

So far, I pulled the pan off and inspected. I don't see any contact with the crank or rods. The oil pump took a hit though, pick up tube ripped off and pump has evidence of contact.

I've purchased a new pan and pump. Hope to get it installed soon and see what happens.

oilhammer · Apr 30, 2019

Awesome, keep us posted.

Steve Addy · Apr 30, 2019

Jetta SS said:
Thanks for all the help on this! After doing a little research and contacting the insurance commissioners office, I called the insurance company. They reviewed the laws and agreed to sell it back.

I also disputed the value, and was able to get a couple hundred more. Ended up buying it back for $300 and towing it 200 miles back home.

So far, I pulled the pan off and inspected. I don't see any contact with the crank or rods. The oil pump took a hit though, pick up tube ripped off and pump has evidence of contact.

I've purchased a new pan and pump. Hope to get it installed soon and see what happens.

Like OH said that's awesome, love to hear about the good things that happen and a saved southern TDI is a winner.

Keep posting back about what you find and how it's going.

Steve

Jetta SS · May 1, 2019

New pan & pump installed, I took it on a short test drive, everything sounds good, feels good - seems normal.

The bad - when picking up, I see little pieces of plastic in the old oil pan. - then I notice a plastic baffle in the bottom of the new oil pan box.

I guess I'm going to have to take the pan back off and put this baffle on.

Steve Addy · May 1, 2019

Jetta SS said:
New pan & pump installed, I took it on a short test drive, everything sounds good, feels good - seems normal.

The bad - when picking up, I see little pieces of plastic in the old oil pan. - then I notice a plastic baffle in the bottom of the new oil pan box.

I guess I'm going to have to take the pan back off and put this baffle on.

Yes, good idea to have that installed, prevents starvation on hard corners.

Sounds like you might be back in business. Having to go back and add the baffle is unfortunate but it won't be that big of a problem.

Steve

ToddA1 · May 2, 2019

If it fell off, I’d bet at least 1 clip is broken. I’d recommend buying a new one or find a way to safety wire it back on.

-Todd

Jetta SS · Jun 1, 2019

Well, this is turning out to be an adventure. Salvage title is drag out process here. I think they're actively discouraging it. Everything has to be mailed in and approved, then you wait, and I've been waiting.

The state has told me the insurance has not turned in the title. The insurance has told me the state has rejected the title because accident occurred in another state.

The state also told me my receipt from Cascade parts was no good. That all receipts must be notarized with the VIN # present.

It's been almost 2 months. Been borrowing MIL's vehicle when needed, but It's getting to the point that I may have to raise the white flag and buy something else.

Steve Addy · Jun 4, 2019

Jetta SS said:
Well, this is turning out to be an adventure. Salvage title is drag out process here. I think they're actively discouraging it. Everything has to be mailed in and approved, then you wait, and I've been waiting.

The state has told me the insurance has not turned in the title. The insurance has told me the state has rejected the title because accident occurred in another state.

The state also told me my receipt from Cascade parts was no good. That all receipts must be notarized with the VIN # present.

It's been almost 2 months. Been borrowing MIL's vehicle when needed, but It's getting to the point that I may have to raise the white flag and buy something else.

I'd push back hard on this one, get my state insurance commissioner involved if necessary, *** do they do for the $$ they make anyway, you never hear squat from them, state insurance bureaucracy is just a black hole for tax dollars but yet there's little contribution to tax payers well being.

You can tell the State that the only VIN that applies is yours since the part coming from Cascade was new, so there's no 'donor' vin to note.

This is one of the ridiculous parts of the 'rebuilder' process, that all donors must be identified by VIN and recorded, the State does nothing with all this anyway and if you cornered someone in their office and forced them to tell you exactly this history of a particular vehicle I would venture a guess that they could not. The whole documentation process is meant to discourage someone from doing it, not to protect anyone or really note where crap came from.

It was also a reaction to a problem that developed when IDOT's found themselves behind the curve on situations where people were rebuilding wrecked cars and they had nothing to deal with it, much like most large state organizations.

Push back on this, dig in your heels and don't let this go, they have no legitimate reason to deny you what you want. They will try and do it though because that's their easy answer

Steve

Jetta SS · Jul 18, 2019

Happy to report that my TDI is back on the road as of today. This took slightly over 3 months. The main issue was the collision occurring in another state.

The last guy I talked to at the insurance co said once again, you shouldn't have been allowed to owner retain, but since it's gone this far - I'm going to pull some strings and see what I can get done. Anyway he got it done. Very surprising how, but I'd rather not reveal the details.

I've had to do a lot of calling and hitting roadblocks - this system is set up so that you automatically forfeit your car if it is totaled outside your home state. Before the insurance got it done, I had been up the ladder of both states involved and had been told basically "you're screwed" by both. If this happens again, I will just take the loss. It has not been worth it.

Steve Addy · Jul 18, 2019

It's crazy all this for just a hole in the oil pan, then again since you got insurance involved and that was the kiss of death. Not sure I would have bothered with insurance in this case, oil pans just aren't all that expensive and I'm sure this will probably impact your insurance rates in the future if you stick with the same company. Claims just come back to haunt you in the end.

I wonder what laws specifically forbidding owner retention when the vehicle is in another state? That would be something that most owners would not be aware of and most probably wouldn't like it if they knew.

I feel compelled to contact my Insurance commissioner here in Iowa to find out if this is the case and where the law came from regarding this.

Again glad to hear that you got this all done and are again in possession of the car, even if it was a hassle.

And I don't know what Cascade charged for the oil pan but it seems odd that a replacement oil pan would cause a car to be a total loss. I am not sure who that insurer has working for them but they don't seem all that brilliant.

Steve

Hole in oil pan

Veteran Member

Top Post Dawg

Veteran Member

That helpful B4 guy

Top Post Dawg

Top Post Dawg

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

That helpful B4 guy

Veteran Member

That helpful B4 guy

Top Post Dawg

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor

Veteran Member

Top Post Dawg

Veteran Member

That helpful B4 guy

Top Post Dawg

Top Post Dawg

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor

Top Post Dawg

Veteran Member

Top Post Dawg

Top Post Dawg

Veteran Member

Top Post Dawg

Veteran Member

Top Post Dawg