Heartbreak! Hallmark: All TDIs are delayed until summer '08

DieselOx

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Location
Spokane, WA
TDI
2003 Jetta Sedan 5sp 342,000mi
Well hey, at this rate, I'll be able to afford one by the time they actually get here. I'd never sell the one I have, but I wouldn't mind replacing my Honda van with a TDI wagon. Hondas are great, but they just feel cheap. Funny how I prefer a broken* solid feeling car to a robust cheap feeling one. Marketing gone haywire, and me reacting like the good consumer I am, with my reptilian brain, not my educated one.

*(by broken I mean all the VW's cheap plastic interior bits, which ironically feel more robust and expensive when they work than all the same parts of my 3 year older Honda, which has had nothing ever break, inside or out, mechanical or otherwise)
 

DwightC

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 29, 2007
Location
Emporia, Kansas
TDI
2003 Golf GLS TDI, 5M
I got tired of waiting on a Sportwagen.

I'll tell you what I did after reading Mr. Halmarks, announcement....

Ive had my eye on a super nice, 2003 4 dr Golf TDI for a couple of days I saw on a Honda dealer lot. But when I read that memo, I immediately bought it. What a car. I absolutely love this thing!

When the Sportwagen comes out, I'll get one of those, too.

dwight
 

no-blue-screen

TDI Nut
Joined
Feb 9, 2006
Location
Maryland
TDI
TDI
I am a little disappointed that they won't be available in April, but I think it is great that VW caught the problem and wants to make it right before launch. All too many times car makers don't do this and we are stuck with problematic vehciles. Honestly, I would rather wait until 2009 if that is what it takes to get a relaible and durable product. VW doesn't want a repeat of the powerstroke issues (flames from tail pipe IIRC). For the sake of clean diesel technology moving forward, VW needs to put out a quality and reliable product for consumers...because if they can't people are going to say 'VW has been making dieesels for years and years....if they can't make a reliable diesel, then nobody can' (even though it may not be true). Launching a problematic diesel product would really hurt the US diesel market as a whole....many people out there still want to beleive that diesels are dirty, stinky, loud, and unreliable....releasing a flawed product will only add fuel to that fire....when what we really need is water to put it out once and for all.
 

Lug_Nut

TDIClub Enthusiast, Pre-Forum Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 20, 1998
Location
Sterling, Massachusetts. USA
TDI
idi: 1988 Bolens DGT1700H, the other oil burner: 1967 Saab Sonett II two stroke
Harvieux said:
Yea but, pull one of those Toyota's/Honda's up next to your VW, open and slam the door of each and then take an asprin and call me in the morning. ;) Later!
Toyonda door handles don't have roll pins that fall out rendering the release disconnected from the outside handle. I'll wager that in a random pool of 100 1996 Camry and Accord there will be far fewer non-functional exterior door handles than on the same size pool of 1996 Passat. The Asian door will at least open to be able to slam shut.
Toyonda doors aren't designed such that snow melt accumulates in the catch mechanism where it refreezes and creates the nearly legendary "door bonk" syndrome. Try that same pool of mid-late 90's sedans in the winter. Not only will more Asian doors open, but more will actually shut.

Sorry, Leonard, but choosing doors as weapon of choice in this VW vs. the world duel was a mistake.
 

drshaws

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 10, 2000
Location
Ipswich, MA
TDI
2014 JSW TDI 6MT
I 2nd what oilhammer said a ways back in the post - sadly with this delay, the real kinks won't be worked out until way later in the product cycle. Part of goodness of my '98 was at least a small sense most of the A3 kinks were smoothed out by that time.

Sadly, I may just have to go find an old Benz oil burner - I was hoping that by 9/2009 (when my lease on my Jeep is up) the initial demand surge would weaken a bit. If they keep pushing things back, 9/2009 may be the initial launch!
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Lug_Nut said:
Toyonda door handles don't have roll pins that fall out rendering the release disconnected from the outside handle. I'll wager that in a random pool of 100 1996 Camry and Accord there will be far fewer non-functional exterior door handles than on the same size pool of 1996 Passat. The Asian door will at least open to be able to slam shut.
Toyonda doors aren't designed such that snow melt accumulates in the catch mechanism where it refreezes and creates the nearly legendary "door bonk" syndrome. Try that same pool of mid-late 90's sedans in the winter. Not only will more Asian doors open, but more will actually shut.

Sorry, Leonard, but choosing doors as weapon of choice in this VW vs. the world duel was a mistake.
Are you for real? You have any idea how many broken outer AND inner door handles break on Camrys and Corollas? I replace about 20 of these a YEAR! Far more than any Volkswagen door handles! Dealer stocks a bunch of them, and they are usually color coded, which means they have to stock a LOT of part numbers!!! :rolleyes: We just had TWO white 4th gen Camry broken outer door handles THIS WEEK! :cool:
 

Chasee

Self-Exiled SPV, Deactivated Account
Joined
Mar 31, 2004
Sport Wagen pushed to Sept '08

Sitting at my VW dealership waiting for them to fix some loose connections. They just got an alert that the TDI Sport Wagen was pushed from April to September. Interesting as they already had several deposits on file for them.
 

PlaneCrazy

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 3, 2000
Location
Province of Quebec, Canada
TDI
Gone...
DieselOx said:
Well hey, at this rate, I'll be able to afford one by the time they actually get here. I'd never sell the one I have, but I wouldn't mind replacing my Honda van with a TDI wagon. Hondas are great, but they just feel cheap. Funny how I prefer a broken* solid feeling car to a robust cheap feeling one. Marketing gone haywire, and me reacting like the good consumer I am, with my reptilian brain, not my educated one.
Hondas are great in their first 5 years of ownership. We gave our '98 Odyssey van to our son. I agree with the "cheap" comment. Ours is also seriously rusted, with the tailgate perforated in three places (poor design: holes drilled and "Odyssey" badge riveted into the holes, and rear wiper mounted in the metal rather than the glass); the rest of the car has serious rust on it. Plus we have tossed in nearly $5000 in repairs this year. The vehicle has 200k on it.

However our VWs are not only solid, they are rarely broken. Our Passat TDI has finally suffered its first problem in 138k km: the driver's window won't open. But it was the door that was replaced after being sideswiped by an out-of-control car, so hardly the car's fault. Our late Jetta TDI wagon's only problems were self-inflicted. My current ride, B6 2.0T, is also reliable so far. Oil consumption seems a bit high (liter per 4000 km) but our Passat TDI had this as well until broken in.
 

Chasee

Self-Exiled SPV, Deactivated Account
Joined
Mar 31, 2004
I'm sitting at my dealer now. He said he just got, this AM, another alert that it will be September.
 

1998993C2S

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 19, 2006
Location
Georgia & Colorado
TDI
2006.5 Jetta Pkg2 DSG Navi
DwightC, nice move on the '03 Golf TGI!


It's tough being in the car business and (Hallmark decision) if it were easy, everyone would be in it. Now, with the TDI delayed product forecast, is the investment conversation with the NA-VW dealership principal any easier? You know the conversation I'm talking about. It's the conversation where VWoA insists that capitol is spent remodeling the dealership, such a new building, service departments, etc.

Tough world the car business…. look, over there, another Toyota Scion/Nissan/KIA/brand X/Honda and all the rest has just been sold!
 
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Jibeho

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2006
Location
Grasonville, MD
TDI
2015 Golf
I rented a new Toyota Yaris diesel in October in France. Drove it about 800 miles and was getting 55MPG. Later I rented a Skoda Fabia 12V in England that got 38MPG. As far as fit and finish I liked the Yaris better.

One other note the Yaris was a dog. I read somewhere that the diesel was 90HP but my NB would beat the paints off it.
 

gxe94

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 9, 2006
Toyota/Honda Door Handles

I think a lot of the broken door handles are the result of break-ins and not the part failing from normal use. Toyota Camry's rank close to the top in the list of most frequently stolen cars. I don't recall where VW falls in that ranking.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
gxe94 said:
I think a lot of the broken door handles are the result of break-ins and not the part failing from normal use. Toyota Camry's rank close to the top in the list of most frequently stolen cars. I don't recall where VW falls in that ranking.
No, they break in normal use. VERY common, has been for years.
 

twigless

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2007
Location
Florida
TDI
2000 Golf GLS TDI 5-speed, 2002 Jetta GLS TDI auto (wife's)
tiguando said:
According to VW's chief designer they are working on the New Beetle 2 to be released around 2010.
Well, I'm referring to news I heard at VW training back around May this year. As it was described to me (Beetle replacement): "shorter, sportier, retro, and in your rear-view it looks like a Porsche" (not verbatim, but nearly). To me, this is explicitly a Karmann Ghia. Of course, they can't call it that, because neither Karmann nor Ghia will likely be associated with it. Still, that's the effect. Maybe they will call it a "Beetle 2", but it won't be a Beetle.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Wasn't there a Scirocco concept recently that looked very much like a modern interpretation of a Corrado?
 

DieselOx

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Location
Spokane, WA
TDI
2003 Jetta Sedan 5sp 342,000mi
PlaneCrazy said:
Plus we have tossed in nearly $5000 in repairs this year. The vehicle has 200k on it.
Intereting. We only have 118k on our 97 Odyssey, and so far we love it for it's convenience and utility, but hate the mileage (half the TDI's). I guess we just got lucky with the rust and lack of repairs, but maybe it's just a matter of time. Really haven't had a single problem since we got it 4.5 years and 65k miles ago (We are careful to get all the scheduled maintenace done on time).
 

PlaneCrazy

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 3, 2000
Location
Province of Quebec, Canada
TDI
Gone...
That was 200k km not miles. This year: front brakes, complete exhaust, tie rods, water pump, ignition switch, timing belt, ABS sensor, O2 sensor, and those are the ones I can remember. We live in the rust belt, and on a dirt road. The big issue with the tailgate is the wiper mounting. Grit gets under the flange, it rubs away the paint as it works over the bumps, and then the next thing you know rust and perforation.
 

DieselOx

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Location
Spokane, WA
TDI
2003 Jetta Sedan 5sp 342,000mi
[sorry to get this far off topic, last one I promise]

PlaneC, sorry about your problems. I'm hoping the dirt road had something to do with it, except for the TB (necessary) and the ignition sw (ours replaced under recall). I also have the advantage of a US EPA mandated settlement with Honda to fix anything emissions related for something like 150k miles or 14 years. If I ever fail a smog test or get a MIL before then, they fix it free; and they threw in a free tune up before 125k miles as part of the deal. I have it in writing, lucky me.
 

frugality

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Sep 19, 2003
Location
Spring Lake, Michigan
TDI
none, 2016 GTI
twigless said:
Well, I'm referring to news I heard at VW training back around May this year. As it was described to me (Beetle replacement): "shorter, sportier, retro, and in your rear-view it looks like a Porsche" (not verbatim, but nearly). To me, this is explicitly a Karmann Ghia. Of course, they can't call it that, because neither Karmann nor Ghia will likely be associated with it. Still, that's the effect. Maybe they will call it a "Beetle 2", but it won't be a Beetle.
I wonder if they're going to give the Beetle more a style more along the lines of the Porsche 356 Speedster, at least up front.
 

mavapa

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 29, 2000
Location
rome, ga
TDI
2001 golf
I always thought the new Beetle would have looked great if it had been chopped, so it resembled an Audi TT.

Re Al Gore and air pollution - you're barking up the wrong tree. Gore's current campaign is about global warming, and that has to do with CO2 emissions, which diesels are relatively good at because of their relatively miserly fuel use.
 

Elsinore

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 27, 2004
Location
SW WI
TDI
2005 Jetta Wagon TDI
brucep said:
I work for the largest computer company in the world and can relate to this all too well. All too often somone sets an unrealistic delivery date to satisfy the beancounters or stockholders
Unfortunately this is all too common. I used to work for the largest company in the world. The CEO (for some reason one of the most celebrated in the world) decided to take orders online for a product that we had just started developing. We were only constructing the 2nd of 10 prototypes!
 

Harvieux

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Aug 15, 1998
Location
Whittier,CA-USA
TDI
06 A5 Pkg.2 w/navi & ASEP
Lug_Nut said:
Toyonda door handles don't have roll pins that fall out rendering the release disconnected from the outside handle. I'll wager that in a random pool of 100 1996 Camry and Accord there will be far fewer non-functional exterior door handles than on the same size pool of 1996 Passat. The Asian door will at least open to be able to slam shut.
Toyonda doors aren't designed such that snow melt accumulates in the catch mechanism where it refreezes and creates the nearly legendary "door bonk" syndrome. Try that same pool of mid-late 90's sedans in the winter. Not only will more Asian doors open, but more will actually shut.

Sorry, Leonard, but choosing doors as weapon of choice in this VW vs. the world duel was a mistake.
Jonathan, Jonathan, Jonathan, my good old friend. FWIW, I wasn't referring to the B4's, which I refer to as dinosaur poop here over 10 years later. However, if you want to use a B4 as an example, try this. Pull the Toyonda up next to your B4, open the door, place both hands on top of the door and pull yourself up by putting all your weight on the open door. Then shut the door. Now, try that on the Toyonda and shut the door. What's that? The door won't shut because the hinges are bent on both the Toy. & Honda? Any questions?. ;) Later!
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Hey! My dinosaur poop is still going after 350k miles! No rust, paint still shines, and all my doors open! Er, well, sometimes they all open... :eek:
 

ltcjmramos

Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2007
Location
Half Moon Bay, CA
TDI
'12 Jetta SportWagen TDI DSG
OK, I'm a noob to VW having bought an '05 Passat TDI just a few months ago. My wife and I have been planning on getting a new Passat TDI wagon when we learned as of now there are no plans to bring it in. So, we decided to look at the Jetta TDI when it cam available in April.

With the above news, we've switched over to a Ford Escape Hybrid or Toyota Highlander Hybrid. However, I just got off the phone with VW USA Customer Service, and they say the '09 Jetta TDI will be available May '08 with order spec sheets available first quarter of '08.

Is VW like all the other vaporware dealers?
 

RichC

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 14, 2002
Location
Cincinnati, OH
TDI
Others: 82 MB 300D Turbodiesel & 2010 BMW X5 35D
Look at the bright side ... the resale value of all existing TDI should remain strong.
 

twigless

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2007
Location
Florida
TDI
2000 Golf GLS TDI 5-speed, 2002 Jetta GLS TDI auto (wife's)
mavapa said:
I always thought the new Beetle would have looked great if it had been chopped, so it resembled an Audi TT.
Wasn't it the same design team who worked on both the Beetle and TT? The TT is kinda a chopped Beetle.
 

bhtooefr

TDIClub Enthusiast, ToofTek Inventor
Joined
Oct 16, 2005
Location
Newark, OH
TDI
None
Myself, I suspect VWoA might not be bringing us a Jetta TDI at all.

I think this is a repeat of the 97 Golf and 98 Passat incidents.
 

Gettin50MPGs

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2004
Dodoma said:
I don't understand why VW has a problem in getting these so called clean diesels in US when the same cars are being available in Europe. ..
I theorize Big Oil and car manufactures in the US are in bed together and neither one of them care enough because they'll be on state welfare if they fall apart.
 
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