TDI perf improvements

I've done a search and didn't find much on this, so I'm throwing this out there for the forum. I live in NY where getting your car inspected can be challenging. Inspection is done by state run computer, so there is no getting around things like DPF and EGR tech that i'm aware of.

I'm doing a stage 2 Malone tune tomorrow which will allow me to keep all the pollution crap on the car, but my question is what else could I look at doing which will increase performance and still allow me to keep the stock exhaust, DPF, EGR etc.

Thanks in advance for any recommendations.

Define performance. There is not much more you can do for the engine and still pass inspection, but there are other factors in "performance". If you have a DSG transmission, it can be tuned as well. There are also modifications that will improve handling like suspension, wheels, and tires.
In other words there are many ways in which a vehicle's performance can be enhanced depending on how you define performance. Performance is not measured solely by torque.

Have Fun!

Don

I just put a turbo on my car, kept all my pollution crap.

JSWTDI09 said:

Define performance. There is not much more you can do for the engine and still pass inspection, but there are other factors in "performance". If you have a DSG transmission, it can be tuned as well. There are also modifications that will improve handling like suspension, wheels, and tires.
In other words there are many ways in which a vehicle's performance can be enhanced depending on how you define performance. Performance is not measured solely by torque.

Have Fun!

Don

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Fair enough. I do have the DSG, and am choosing not to do the flash at this time on this for two reasons: 1) Its not required for the stage 2 flash, and 2) Did this on my previous 2013 TDI and for the $1k felt no difference in performance, shifting, etc. it was totally invisible to me. If others have good reason to do it, i'm absolutely open to it, but at this point I'm thinking it's something i'll do down the line if i'm able to take the next step up in perf.

I think the stock suspension is fine for my purposes, and I have aftermarket wheels and rims, so i'm set there.

The performance I'm talking about is engine performance. I'm interested in something quick and not necessarily fast. i'm talking to some shops about options with a turbo that'll work with the stock exhaust, EGR, DPF, but the reason for my post is that I'm sure someone has already gone down the road I'm considering, or heard of someone, and would like to see what others have come up with?

Angus1 said:

I just put a turbo on my car, kept all my pollution crap.

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What did you do specifically, and how did it work out? What kind of gains did you see? (dyno or butt dyno?). I'd be very interested to hear - thanks.

I'm using kerma tdi. I had one of their tunes to start. Made a noticeable difference. I've been running that tune for about a year. Over the weekend I installed a Garrett cr190 turbo,also from kermatdi. I'm waiting for the new tune for the turbo. I haven't put my car on the dyno yet. Again all my emmisions equipment is still present. Kerma will not delete any of it because of the crack down from the feds. I can't say I blame them.

Interesting to learn that about Kerma. Most of the performance shops I'm talking to have tunes for my car, but only if I delete the EGR, dpf, and have an aftermarket exhaust, etc.

Id be interested to learn more about a turbo kit that works with the stock exhaust system and accessories. I know it wont' be as good as the deletes, but i guess beggars can't be choosers.

Looks good, will look into this - thanks for sending!

Kerma kit looks interesting, will give them a call tomorrow for more info.

Two more questions - does anyone else make a turbo and tune kit that works with the stock exhaust system, egr, dpf, etc. and two, is there any way to do the deletes so the sensors still read correctly?

Is anyone else running this Kerma stage 3 kit?

If NY inspection is similar to NH, all they do is read for any ODB codes, which with a proper delete tune from malone and needed hardware, it will pass with flying colors.

One of the reasons i went with malone is to have the ability to delete (even though everything is stock at the moment), where kerma doesn't.

I do believe there is support for the kerma kit with malone tuning but with DPF delete fine tuning is needed to avoid boost creep.

others have installed a GTD1752vrk, a good read

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=475589

Also be aware that there is a known issue with DMF shudder and peak low end torque. Only solution I've heard of is reducing peak low end torque via tune, but with a larger turbo you should be able to pick up more power in the upper end.

Even with the reduced tune to avoid DMF shudder our Passat is pretty quick and within reason for a family saloon highway cruiser.

While not familiar with NH inspection requirements, nothing is easy in NY. We require more than just no codes, but all factory sensors need to show as being active as well - as well as a visual check that there is a cat present, so the only way I can do the delete here is to somehow trick the ecu into believing the egr and dpf sensors are still there and reading normally. I have yet to find anything or anyone that can tell me how to do that, so until I do I’m stuck keeping the egr and dpf systems - but I’d really like to delete them for sure!

This is why I’m currently focusing on Kerma, because they have the only system I’ve come across that’ll work with the stock exhaust. What I’m not clear on, and I hope a call to Kerma will clear it up, is how they are getting the same power increases Malone is getting but without doing all the deletes and using the stock exhaust system? On the surface it intuitively doesn’t make sense, but that means nothing.

I appreciate the input and will check out the included thread - thanks!

We also tune for stock emissions components, deletes are optional. For delete tunes someone would have to force-pass the readiness monitors in order for it to pass emissions testing, we're not willing to do that since you'd be tricking emissions inspectors.

Deletes don't add a substantial amount of power on stock turbos since the turbo is also restrictive, but they help with EGTs considerably. So on a 8 second dyno you might only see around a 5% power/tq increase, but on a track or with sustained aggressive driving they would be two completely different vehicles.

We have no problem tuning for custom built turbo setups, but it'll be up to you to install and diagnose/data log it. The emissions components are quite complex so you'll definitely want to play around with VCDS a fair bit if running larger turbos with them intact to make sure it's all working properly.

Mostly use a dynapack for testing and compare our values to other dynos in the area, stock vehicles and 1/4 mile times. Dynojets can be a bit optimistic at times.

There is a CR190 turbo hybrid out there that increases the compressor wheel to 56mm from 49mm in the same housing. That turbo would be plug and play while keeping emissions in tact. That's where I would start!

I am running all emissions components on mine with a Kerma tune. I like the EGR for warmup and heater output, thought it is used passively.. There is no emission testing where I am at but I see no need to delete anything at all. The car has plenty of torque and good mileage too. It doesn't smoke, nor do I want it to. Most people don't even know it is a diesel.

adjat84th said:

There is a CR190 turbo hybrid out there that increases the compressor wheel to 56mm from 49mm in the same housing. That turbo would be plug and play while keeping emissions in tact. That's where I would start!

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Kerma's kit uses the CR190, but I'm not clear whether it's a hybrid like you've outlined. Good to find out. I've read Xman has something like that.

Velocity111 said:

I've done a search and didn't find much on this, so I'm throwing this out there for the forum. I live in NY where getting your car inspected can be challenging. Inspection is done by state run computer, so there is no getting around things like DPF and EGR tech that i'm aware of.
I'm doing a stage 2 Malone tune tomorrow which will allow me to keep all the pollution crap on the car, but my question is what else could I look at doing which will increase performance and still allow me to keep the stock exhaust, DPF, EGR etc.
Thanks in advance for any recommendations.

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Hey Velocity, I'm interested in doing a performance tune on my new TDI, and not interested in deleting anything, since it's still under VW 2 year warranty.

Any noticeable power and mpg increase? Thanks!