Q5 3.0 TDI Stage 2 & Deletes -- Smells So Bad -- Strong Odor

PhunkFX

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Joined
May 19, 2011
Location
Hudson Valley, NY
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2014 Audi Q5 TDI S-Line, 2005.5 Jetta TDI (BRM) 6MT (02Q)
***Issues Resolved*** the post and info can be found in post #44 http://forums.tdiclub.com/showpost.php?p=5496217&postcount=44

I'm curious if anyone is willing to sound of on their 3.0 TDI mod status and if you have experienced what I am.

I have an "off-road" S-Line Q5 TDI that is fully deleted, DPF/SCR/Adblue and EGR. I have a stage 2 tune and am curious if it's too rich, or if the super strong exhaust odor is normal for a 3.0 TDI. It is a 2014 with 113k on it. Super clean, no issues known, no MIL or DTCs, and bone dry underneath.

Of course, I did and still do expect some kind of smell, it's deleted, I know, but wooo... I have to drive with the car on recirculate mode or else I smell it coming in through the vents at stops. My ALH, BRM, 2.0CR were all at the same state of modification and I couldn't smell any of those at all like I do this. The Q5 doesn't even roll coal, barely a mist.

My question now becomes, is this normal for this kind of odor for this mod state, or am I experiencing a possible issue or issues. My brainstorm of ideas are stated below:

-Tune is far too rich
-Engine bay / DP exhaust leaks
-Actual Engine issues
-Cowl / Engine bay seal issues
-Clogged rear mufflers
-Lots of residual burn off in intake/head/mufflers (113k)

I'm up for suggestions or think tanking this out. What do you think?
 
Last edited:

Huskies2710

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Chicago
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2016 Audi A6 -- 2008 Mercedes ML 320 CDI
I'm new to this forum, sadly can't help. Interested to see what others have to say. This is my worst nightmare if I were to do this type of deletion when the time comes in a few months. I do not want an overly strong smell nor is rolling coal and option.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
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outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Are there any exhaust leaks? I would check for that first. You may not "hear" anything, since the turbo will chop up most of the noise anyway.

May also make sure the tail pipe is not tweaked or angled wrong.
 

PhunkFX

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Hudson Valley, NY
TDI
2014 Audi Q5 TDI S-Line, 2005.5 Jetta TDI (BRM) 6MT (02Q)
No leaks that I'm aware of. And I have been told that there aren't any by two different mechanics.

These look normal to me.



 

PhunkFX

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Location
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2014 Audi Q5 TDI S-Line, 2005.5 Jetta TDI (BRM) 6MT (02Q)
And thank you for the reply Oilhammer! I always appreciate your comments and advice!
 

PhunkFX

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Hudson Valley, NY
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2014 Audi Q5 TDI S-Line, 2005.5 Jetta TDI (BRM) 6MT (02Q)
That will have to be the next step. It shouldn't be coming in the HVAC regardless of how smell it is from the tail pipes, right?
 

Pittdawg

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Location
Los Angeles
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2014 Audi Q5 TDI
That will have to be the next step. It shouldn't be coming in the HVAC regardless of how smell it is from the tail pipes, right?
Put a Magnaflow catback on like I have to help those nasty exhaust fumes exit more quickly. Not sure if that will actually fix the issue (I still have all emissions equipment installed) but if you are stage 2 you could really benefit from larger diameter piping.
 

CleverUserName

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2014 OZ Cruze CTD & 2010 JSW 6MT & 2017 GMC Canyon CCLB ATX 2.8 Duramax
A Diesel Oxidation Catalyst makes a huge difference in smell. It doesn’t significantly restrict flow either. You could get one installed.
 

PhunkFX

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Joined
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Location
Hudson Valley, NY
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2014 Audi Q5 TDI S-Line, 2005.5 Jetta TDI (BRM) 6MT (02Q)
Hmm... I like both of these ideas. :D Any links or directions you could point me in for each of these?
 

CleverUserName

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2014 OZ Cruze CTD & 2010 JSW 6MT & 2017 GMC Canyon CCLB ATX 2.8 Duramax
Thank you Gents. DOCs seem to be expensive!!
Yeah they are made with precious metals so expensive to manufacture.

If the DOC is gone from your original exhaust, you can try getting a used one from another junkyard TDI. Or a salvaged DOC from a 6.7 Cummins, powerstroke or Duramax May also work. It’s usually the first emissions component after the exhaust leaves the engine.
 

Huskies2710

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 14, 2018
Location
Chicago
TDI
2016 Audi A6 -- 2008 Mercedes ML 320 CDI
I'm curious if anyone is willing to sound of on their 3.0 TDI mod status and if you have experienced what I am.
I have an "off-road" S-Line Q5 TDI that is fully deleted, DPF/SCR/Adblue and EGR. I have a stage 2 tune and am curious if it's too rich, or if the super strong exhaust odor is normal for a 3.0 TDI. It is a 2014 with 113k on it. Super clean, no issues known, no MIL or DTCs, and bone dry underneath.
Of course, I did and still do expect some kind of smell, it's deleted, I know, but wooo... I have to drive with the car on recirculate mode or else I smell it coming in through the vents at stops. My ALH, BRM, 2.0CR were all at the same state of modification and I couldn't smell any of those at all like I do this. The Q5 doesn't even roll coal, barely a mist.
My question now becomes, is this normal for this kind of odor for this mod state, or am I experiencing a possible issue or issues. My brainstorm of ideas are stated below:
-Tune is far too rich
-Engine bay / DP exhaust leaks
-Actual Engine issues
-Cowl / Engine bay seal issues
-Clogged rear mufflers
-Lots of residual burn off in intake/head/mufflers (113k)
I'm up for suggestions or think tanking this out. What do you think?
Out of curiosity how long ago did you have the tune and delete done? Recently and you noticed the smell right away? Or did this just start happening after a while? Might help understand the problem better.

I don't want to do the delete myself if the smell is going to become a nuisance.
 

commedeschatons

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Jan 6, 2019
Location
dtw
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2003 ALH Wagon 5mt, 2016 VW Touareg TDI, 2014 Q5 TDI, 2011 335d Msport, 2009 Q7 TDI
i also have a q5 with rawtek downpipe without diesel catalyst and stage 2 tune, basically what you have (for off road use at my 50 acre opposum ranch) the only difference in my setup is i have a 3'' straight pipe from the downpipe back.

i also wondered the same thing initially. However, i also have no exhaust leaks that can be found and double/triple checked for leaks and no loose connections.
i figured the downpipe was leaking in the engine bay but in the end it turns out not to be the case.

The smell only seems to penetrate into the cabin when its cold out and im warming up the car for a period of time, or at stoplight. When im moving, theres no smell inside of the car. Also, i noticed this is not happening (as bad) when it was warm out. I'm quite sure that you probably dont have an exhaust leak either.

-Tune is far too rich
in my experience the tune is fine. i only see some smoke at wot on like a highway pull or getting on an on ramp. if it was far too rich we should see more soot more frequently.
-Engine bay / DP exhaust leaks
not in my case, checked.
-Actual Engine issues
my engine runs fine.
-Cowl / Engine bay seal issues
i am pretty sure this is not the case or I would smell it when moving
-Clogged rear mufflers
how? this cant push exhaust gas into the cabin. anyways i have no exhaust restrictions and i see the same issue with my q5
-Lots of residual burn off in intake/head/mufflers (113k)
since we both smell specifically diesel fuel smell this should play no part. burning oil/carbon smells completely different. I am at 103k on mine.
I'm up for suggestions or think tanking this out. What do you think?


From what ive gathered, the exhaust gases just accumulates around the car when stopped, even in front, and is sucked into the interior air, which we then smell. in my mind, these seems like the most likely since i exhaust searching the same sources you did and came up dry. This also explains why it is worst in the cold when the air doesn't diffuse away as quickly as in warm air, and why i get nothing in the cabin when moving, at even slow speeds. when i start my car in the morning to warm up and go inside to drink coffee or whatever pretty much the air everywhere can smell like exhaust. that **** even leaks into my house, so it seems like what is happening, and NOT a fault with the car, exhaust system, or manufacturer defect/installation problem.

Personally, i just decided to live with the smell and increased risk of blood/brain/etc. cancer but if i could do it over again i'd buy the catted option instead. from here, it seems like that may be the only option. taking it to a fabricator or exhaust shop to weld in a diesel catalyst could be a good option.
 

PhunkFX

Veteran Member
Joined
May 19, 2011
Location
Hudson Valley, NY
TDI
2014 Audi Q5 TDI S-Line, 2005.5 Jetta TDI (BRM) 6MT (02Q)
Out of curiosity how long ago did you have the tune and delete done? Recently and you noticed the smell right away? Or did this just start happening after a while? Might help understand the problem better.
I don't want to do the delete myself if the smell is going to become a nuisance.
I had the delete and tune completed within 2 weeks of getting the Q5. It had no smells prior (obviously in stock form). The issues were noticed immediately, which was saddening.

Others with the delete state that they do not have such issues of smell coming into the car. When I had the car inspected, we had only the nose/front half of the car in the shop, and after starting, it immediately smelled in the shop, right where we were standing.

We are going to end up (and have been) driving it for a while and seeing if any soot forms around the blocked off EGR ports or where the first gasket meets the DPF delete and downpipe second half. Thank you all for asking.
 

PhunkFX

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Joined
May 19, 2011
Location
Hudson Valley, NY
TDI
2014 Audi Q5 TDI S-Line, 2005.5 Jetta TDI (BRM) 6MT (02Q)
i also have a q5 with rawtek downpipe without diesel catalyst and stage 2 tune, basically what you have (for off road use at my 50 acre opposum ranch) the only difference in my setup is i have a 3'' straight pipe from the downpipe back.
i also wondered the same thing initially. However, i also have no exhaust leaks that can be found and double/triple checked for leaks and no loose connections.
i figured the downpipe was leaking in the engine bay but in the end it turns out not to be the case.
The smell only seems to penetrate into the cabin when its cold out and im warming up the car for a period of time, or at stoplight. When im moving, theres no smell inside of the car. Also, i noticed this is not happening (as bad) when it was warm out. I'm quite sure that you probably dont have an exhaust leak either.
-Tune is far too rich
in my experience the tune is fine. i only see some smoke at wot on like a highway pull or getting on an on ramp. if it was far too rich we should see more soot more frequently.
-Engine bay / DP exhaust leaks
not in my case, checked.
-Actual Engine issues
my engine runs fine.
-Cowl / Engine bay seal issues
i am pretty sure this is not the case or I would smell it when moving
-Clogged rear mufflers
how? this cant push exhaust gas into the cabin. anyways i have no exhaust restrictions and i see the same issue with my q5
-Lots of residual burn off in intake/head/mufflers (113k)
since we both smell specifically diesel fuel smell this should play no part. burning oil/carbon smells completely different. I am at 103k on mine.
I'm up for suggestions or think tanking this out. What do you think?

From what ive gathered, the exhaust gases just accumulates around the car when stopped, even in front, and is sucked into the interior air, which we then smell. in my mind, these seems like the most likely since i exhaust searching the same sources you did and came up dry. This also explains why it is worst in the cold when the air doesn't diffuse away as quickly as in warm air, and why i get nothing in the cabin when moving, at even slow speeds. when i start my car in the morning to warm up and go inside to drink coffee or whatever pretty much the air everywhere can smell like exhaust. that **** even leaks into my house, so it seems like what is happening, and NOT a fault with the car, exhaust system, or manufacturer defect/installation problem.
Personally, i just decided to live with the smell and increased risk of blood/brain/etc. cancer but if i could do it over again i'd buy the catted option instead. from here, it seems like that may be the only option. taking it to a fabricator or exhaust shop to weld in a diesel catalyst could be a good option.
Thank you for your thought out feedback! I appreciate it. We certainly love the vehicle, so we have just been driving it with recirculate enabled in HVAC (each time we get in the vehicle).

We took it on a 7 hour trip from NY to Pittsburgh and it was great, same for the 7 hours back. 33.6mpg, over 550 miles on the tank before we stopped to fill, and that's all going between 79-85mph.

I'll look forward to seeing how and/or if it changes when the weather becomes warm. We are also going to look into seals and gaskets and possible leaks here and there when we can.

I'm curious if it is just the major output of a 3.0 TDI (V6) vs. a 1.9PD or 2.0CR output? Each of those vehicles were fully deleted and there was no smell. And there was RICH tunes on each of those. So, IDK.

I'll keep everyone updated, just incase this is experienced by anyone else as these cars are more affordable and more likely to be purchased and modified. It's all good for searchable content.
 

Pittdawg

Veteran Member
Joined
May 28, 2018
Location
Los Angeles
TDI
2014 Audi Q5 TDI
How does it sound? Any drone from within the car? I know you are not deleted, so I assume it would be much quieter than a full deleted setup.
It is barely louder than stock but certainly deeper; I'm sure it would be much louder with the emissions equipment deleted. I love it as I didn't want loud and no drone whatsoever at any speed/rpm.
 

ameoba

Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2008
Location
Wayzata, MN
TDI
2014 Touareg TDI, 1980 Dasher Diesel wagon (gone), 1982 Rabbit Diesel (also gone)
Ricky - I'm not looking to flame you here, but if you removed all the emissions equipment, how could you NOT expect it to be smelly?

Sure, it shouldn't come through the HVAC system, but it's a very strong odor that is going to find it's way to the cabin air intake quickly when you aren't moving, even if it's all going out the exhaust pipe.

Another thought.... When you deleted the EGR (exhaust gas recirculation), is that venting to air or directed into the pipe? If could just be dumping a small amount into the engine bay somewhere. It wouldn't take a lot.
 

Huskies2710

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Location
Chicago
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2016 Audi A6 -- 2008 Mercedes ML 320 CDI
This new information is very interesting. I will continue to keep following. Thanks for info guys.

Sounds like doing a full delete will result in some smell unless you get the exhaust system updgraded to better handle the fumes?

I live in Chicago so 5 months are cold, the wife will not take kindly to the smell and longer warm up times to get heat into the car on top of it (I believe getting heat in the car is affected by removing EGR/DPF?).

I'm leaning towards the Malon Stage 2 with the Dynamic EGR/Idle setup now while keeping all emissions equipment.
 

da.hs

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SK, Canada
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2010 Golf, DSG, silver (from new). 2010 Audi Q7 (from 2016), 2004 Touareg V10 (from 2018)
Not directly comparable but FWIW:
Golf with Rawtec including cat and resonator is certainly smelly at startup, much as pre-2007 diesels. Backing out of a garage, through its own exhaust, the smell gets into the cabin. It doesn't smoke visibly unless really pushed hard

2004 v10 never had a DPF- its startup is very much worse, especially in the cold. A grey haze....

Once either car is moving (forward!) there's no smell in the cabin.

I'd guess the V6 would be between the two. It's still stock, smells faintly of ammonia. It's likely to be deleted if an expensive problem with the Adblue system arises
 

PhunkFX

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Hudson Valley, NY
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2014 Audi Q5 TDI S-Line, 2005.5 Jetta TDI (BRM) 6MT (02Q)
Ricky - I'm not looking to flame you here, but if you removed all the emissions equipment, how could you NOT expect it to be smelly?
Sure, it shouldn't come through the HVAC system, but it's a very strong odor that is going to find it's way to the cabin air intake quickly when you aren't moving, even if it's all going out the exhaust pipe.
Another thought.... When you deleted the EGR (exhaust gas recirculation), is that venting to air or directed into the pipe? If could just be dumping a small amount into the engine bay somewhere. It wouldn't take a lot.
LOL I totally understand, the fact of the matter is, I've deleted all over types or TDIs, 2.0CR, ALH, PD, and didn't have issues like this, but its all for knowledge. I suppose the 3.0TDI is just a different animal. I understand that, I didn't know if it was or not. Without other people's data and experience, how am I to know if this is how it should or should not be. That is why I ask in this thread. But I totally get you and thank you for the feedback. My Mk4 and Mk5 aren't too smelly, The 2.0CR didn't smell at all, and this one is just wooooo. I'm not sure if it's the high miles and something is off, or this is just how they are.

As far as the EGR, I suspect a leak. It is blocked off in the engine bay and the pipe has been removed. We couldnt find any leaks the last time we checked, I'm hoping some soot will develop so that we can visually pin-point the issue. Again, good thinking and thank you for your thoughts.

R
 

PhunkFX

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Hudson Valley, NY
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2014 Audi Q5 TDI S-Line, 2005.5 Jetta TDI (BRM) 6MT (02Q)
Not directly comparable but FWIW:
Golf with Rawtec including cat and resonator is certainly smelly at startup, much as pre-2007 diesels. Backing out of a garage, through its own exhaust, the smell gets into the cabin. It doesn't smoke visibly unless really pushed hard

2004 v10 never had a DPF- its startup is very much worse, especially in the cold. A grey haze....

Once either car is moving (forward!) there's no smell in the cabin.

I'd guess the V6 would be between the two. It's still stock, smells faintly of ammonia. It's likely to be deleted if an expensive problem with the Adblue system arises
Agreed and good points here. I'm going to keep up with the situation of course, and let you know how this develops over the summer.

I'll keep looking into what it could be, temp, high miles with leaky injectors/reduced efficiency of the turbo. I do get slow to build boost CELs every now and again.

As far as the power difference, it was very noticeable. Like night and day, no tq, vs all the tq lol. I'm sure to get to the bottom of this, even if I have to add a cat or not. I'll keep us all posted.

R
 

baldy

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YVR
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C7 A6
I'm leaning towards the Malon Stage 2 with the Dynamic EGR/Idle setup now while keeping all emissions equipment.
I have the Malone Stage 2 on my A6 without deletes and asked about Dynamic EGR as well. Unfortunately Mark hasn't gotten around to making it for the 3.0 yet as they have been extremely busy.
 

Huskies2710

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Chicago
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2016 Audi A6 -- 2008 Mercedes ML 320 CDI
I have the Malone Stage 2 on my A6 without deletes and asked about Dynamic EGR as well. Unfortunately Mark hasn't gotten around to making it for the 3.0 yet as they have been extremely busy.
Thank you for this information. How are you liking the tune? Are you noticing more or less regens?

Have you thought about getting the delete? It's tempting but I don't want the smell to be an issue when sitting at a stop light and windows down. I can handle it when turning it on. Also, the cold starts might not be the best. Chicago was -22F the past two days.

Also I heard depending what diesel you have it can affect the strength of the smell. Illinois is 20% biodiesel I haven't done enough research to confirm that means less of a smell.

Appreciate any thoughts.....
 

DieselDeeds

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Moved states! : )
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This is good info- thanks guys. I currently have a stage 2 Malone tune on my 2014 Q5 TDI s-line. Feb 21st I’m getting the Rawtek 3” dpf/egr delete (with 1 HF cat) and stage 2+ tune. I’ll post back in this forum to contribute my results. Cheers

Deeds
 

PhunkFX

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2014 Audi Q5 TDI S-Line, 2005.5 Jetta TDI (BRM) 6MT (02Q)
This is good info- thanks guys. I currently have a stage 2 Malone tune on my 2014 Q5 TDI s-line. Feb 21st I’m getting the Rawtek 3” dpf/egr delete (with 1 HF cat) and stage 2+ tune. I’ll post back in this forum to contribute my results. Cheers
Deeds
Yes, I'm definitely interested in hearing your experience.
 

PhunkFX

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2014 Audi Q5 TDI S-Line, 2005.5 Jetta TDI (BRM) 6MT (02Q)
I now see soot on the EGR pipe that comes directly off the turbo. That is surely a leak, and a high pressure leak I think also.

I'll have to investigate more and see what comes of this.
 
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