www.tdiclub.com

Economy - Longevity - Performance
The #1 Source of TDI Information on the Web!
Forums Articles Links Meets
Orders TDI Club Cards TDIFest 2016 Gone, but not forgotten VAG-Com List Unit Conversions TDIClub Chat Thank You




Go Back   TDIClub Forums > TDI Model Specific Discussions Areas > VW MKIV-A4 TDIs (VE and PD)

VW MKIV-A4 TDIs (VE and PD) This is a general discussion about A4/MkIV Jetta (99.5-~2005), Golf(99.5-2006), and New Beetle(98-2006). Both VE and PD engines are covered here.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old January 12th, 2018, 22:27   #1
turbotorq
Veteran Member
 
turbotorq's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Kingston, ON
TDI(s): 04 Jetta TDI
Fuel Economy: 45ish
Default Oil pan heater stuck to PD150 oil cooler for warm up

After my frost heater element fried, I was thinking of trying something slightly different & cheaper to help warm up my TDI. Recently I upgraded my oil cooler to the much larger PD150 style, I believe it's the same as the 4 motion Passat tdi oil cooler.

Before buying another frost heater for my BEW, I thought I would order a $20 250w oil pan heater ( stick on type) for my oil cooler, I'm hoping leaving it plugged in for a few hours would circulate my warm coolant the same as a frost heater. I'm not expecting it to work even 50% as well, just thought it would be interesting to try.

Can someone chime in who understands more about the coolant circulation system?

Btw I'm not trying to heat my oil here. I have another stick on heater on my oil pan. Trying to get some cheap, head heat.

Thanks
__________________
VNT17;PD150injectors;PD150intake;PD150oilcooler Tune;IMMOdelete;EGRdelete;ASVdelete w/RacePipe;KoniYellows;Frostheater;Erectonomy;DRL Disabled;HID's;VAGCOM
turbotorq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 13th, 2018, 11:33   #2
wonneber
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Monroe, NY, USA
Default

I could not see how coolant would flow with the thermostat closed.
The heater core might get some flow.
No option for a block heater.
Personally I feel the internal oil pan heater would be the best option.
Just my 2 cents.
wonneber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 13th, 2018, 11:39   #3
turbotorq
Veteran Member
 
turbotorq's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Kingston, ON
TDI(s): 04 Jetta TDI
Fuel Economy: 45ish
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wonneber View Post
I could not see how coolant would flow with the thermostat closed.
The heater core might get some flow.
No option for a block heater.
Personally I feel the internal oil pan heater would be the best option.
Just my 2 cents.
How does the thermostat open with the frost heater?
__________________
VNT17;PD150injectors;PD150intake;PD150oilcooler Tune;IMMOdelete;EGRdelete;ASVdelete w/RacePipe;KoniYellows;Frostheater;Erectonomy;DRL Disabled;HID's;VAGCOM
turbotorq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 13th, 2018, 11:42   #4
BobnOH
not-a-mechanic
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: central Ohio
Fuel Economy: 50/45/35
Default

I don't believe there is oil in the oil cooler at rest. Would heat the coolant a tad.
Anything warm under the hood will help some
BobnOH is online now   Reply With Quote
Old January 13th, 2018, 11:43   #5
turbotorq
Veteran Member
 
turbotorq's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Kingston, ON
TDI(s): 04 Jetta TDI
Fuel Economy: 45ish
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobnOH View Post
I don't believe there is oil in the oil cooler at rest. Would heat the coolant a tad.
Anything warm under the hood will help some
Hey Bob not trying to heat the oil, I have a stick on heater on the oil pan for that. Trying to heat the coolant in the same manor as a frost heater. Just externally at a different location.
__________________
VNT17;PD150injectors;PD150intake;PD150oilcooler Tune;IMMOdelete;EGRdelete;ASVdelete w/RacePipe;KoniYellows;Frostheater;Erectonomy;DRL Disabled;HID's;VAGCOM
turbotorq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 13th, 2018, 19:25   #6
wonneber
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Monroe, NY, USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by turbotorq View Post
How does the thermostat open with the frost heater?
That's my point, I don't thick it does open and the coolant shouldn't be able to circulate.
wonneber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 13th, 2018, 19:37   #7
jayb79
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Exeter,NH
Default

I would try a lower radiator hose heater, they are less than $40 and would be more effective than the stick on pad.
https://www.amazon.com/Kats-16600-Lo...ype=automotive
__________________
01Golf(385k), 2013 Mustang V6 28-30 summer mpg, 2016 F150 RCSB 2WD 2.7L ecoboost.
jayb79 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 13th, 2018, 21:01   #8
turbotorq
Veteran Member
 
turbotorq's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Kingston, ON
TDI(s): 04 Jetta TDI
Fuel Economy: 45ish
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wonneber View Post
That's my point, I don't thick it does open and the coolant shouldn't be able to circulate.

I don't understand. Why does a frost heater work then
__________________
VNT17;PD150injectors;PD150intake;PD150oilcooler Tune;IMMOdelete;EGRdelete;ASVdelete w/RacePipe;KoniYellows;Frostheater;Erectonomy;DRL Disabled;HID's;VAGCOM
turbotorq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 13th, 2018, 23:45   #9
jimbote
 
jimbote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: spiral arm, milky way (aka central NC)
Fuel Economy: golf=38-43mpg...tacoma tdi=29-33mpg
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by turbotorq View Post
I don't understand. Why does a frost heater work then
the thermostat only controls coolant flow to the radiator... the rest of the system, block, head, oil cooler, heater core, and all the hoses aside from the upper and lower radiator hoses get warm coolant circulated ... on very cold days with the heater going, the thermstat may not open much at all
__________________
'You know what? This is a business.' So, now, I just keep my mouth shut and pet my chihuahuas." Mickey Rourke

Last edited by jimbote; January 14th, 2018 at 06:01.
jimbote is online now   Reply With Quote
Old January 14th, 2018, 04:51   #10
turbocharged798
Veteran Member
 
turbocharged798's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Ellenville, NY
Fuel Economy: 40-50mpg
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jayb79 View Post
I would try a lower radiator hose heater, they are less than $40 and would be more effective than the stick on pad.
https://www.amazon.com/Kats-16600-Lo...ype=automotive
Won't work on a TDI because the thermostat is in the lower hose.
__________________
99.5 Black Jetta TDI; DLC1019 nozzles, G60/VR6, ASV .5mm pistons, EGR delete, ASR/EDL, bilstein TCs MFA cluster.. Beater car. 365K miles and climbing.
99.5 Red Jetta TDI. Saved from the crusher. 270K
04 Jetta TDI .MFA cluster, reverse light mod, bilstein TCs 200K.
turbocharged798 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 14th, 2018, 05:20   #11
jayb79
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Exeter,NH
Default

Wouldn't heating the water in the hose open the thermostat?
__________________
01Golf(385k), 2013 Mustang V6 28-30 summer mpg, 2016 F150 RCSB 2WD 2.7L ecoboost.
jayb79 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 14th, 2018, 05:41   #12
jimbote
 
jimbote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: spiral arm, milky way (aka central NC)
Fuel Economy: golf=38-43mpg...tacoma tdi=29-33mpg
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jayb79 View Post
Wouldn't heating the water in the hose open the thermostat?
no, the coolant would have to reach around 180 f and only if it reached that temp on the block side of the t stat ...
__________________
'You know what? This is a business.' So, now, I just keep my mouth shut and pet my chihuahuas." Mickey Rourke
jimbote is online now   Reply With Quote
Old January 14th, 2018, 05:57   #13
jimbote
 
jimbote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: spiral arm, milky way (aka central NC)
Fuel Economy: golf=38-43mpg...tacoma tdi=29-33mpg
Default

the zerostart style heaters work well because they heat everything except the radiator... heating a rad hose is kind of self defeating because it's attached directly to the main powertrain heat exchanger (radiator) and much of the energy input will be lost
turbotorq: the coolant will be heatsd by directly heating the oil cooler but will only have passive convection of the coolant, which may be plenty in your case
__________________
'You know what? This is a business.' So, now, I just keep my mouth shut and pet my chihuahuas." Mickey Rourke

Last edited by jimbote; January 14th, 2018 at 06:06.
jimbote is online now   Reply With Quote
Old January 14th, 2018, 12:55   #14
turbotorq
Veteran Member
 
turbotorq's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Kingston, ON
TDI(s): 04 Jetta TDI
Fuel Economy: 45ish
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimbote View Post
the zerostart style heaters work well because they heat everything except the radiator... heating a rad hose is kind of self defeating because it's attached directly to the main powertrain heat exchanger (radiator) and much of the energy input will be lost
turbotorq: the coolant will be heatsd by directly heating the oil cooler but will only have passive convection of the coolant, which may be plenty in your case

Ok thanks I'll try it and report back. It may be a cheap option for those not wanting a frost heater
__________________
VNT17;PD150injectors;PD150intake;PD150oilcooler Tune;IMMOdelete;EGRdelete;ASVdelete w/RacePipe;KoniYellows;Frostheater;Erectonomy;DRL Disabled;HID's;VAGCOM
turbotorq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 14th, 2018, 13:30   #15
Steve Addy
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Iowa
TDI(s): 97 Mk3
Default

I have oil pan pad heater, 400 watt I think. It does a decent job on the oil and indirectly on the engine coolant too. Sometimes after a couple 2-3 hours the engine GP light goes out right away.

It's thin enough to fit under the oil pan cover and I have it on a timer so it comes on by itself.

Steve

__________________
97 Jetta TDI, 90 B3V TDI, 92 MB 300SD

You didn't poison the coffee, did you? Not anymore than I usually do.
Steve Addy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Oil pan stuck on! yseent VW MKIV-A4 TDIs (VE and PD) 7 April 20th, 2012 19:48
PD150 Oil cooler & Frost Heater Milage King TDI Power Enhancements 1 December 5th, 2011 20:57
PD150 Oil cooler and Frost heater Milage King VW MKIV-A4 TDIs (VE and PD) 0 November 23rd, 2011 05:49
PD150 oil cooler TDIwestfalia Private TDI Items for Sale/Wanted 2 May 27th, 2011 10:57
Engine Block / Oil Pan Heater Saves Fuel, Warm-up Time, and Wear & Tear Turbo Steve TDI Fuel Economy 44 February 19th, 2000 00:27


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:27.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright - TDIClub Online LTD - 2017
Contact Us | Privacy Statement | Forum Rules | Disclaimer
TDIClub Online Ltd (TDIClub.com) is not affiliated with the VWoA or VWAG and is supported by contributions from viewers like you.
1996 - 2017, All Rights Reserved
Page generated in 0.17535 seconds with 13 queries
[Output: 132.99 Kb. compressed to 110.90 Kb. by saving 22.09 Kb. (16.61%)]