www.tdiclub.com

Economy - Longevity - Performance
The #1 Source of TDI Information on the Web!
Forums Articles Links Meets
Orders TDI Club Cards TDIFest 2016 Gone, but not forgotten VAG-Com List Unit Conversions TDIClub Chat Thank You

Order your TDIClub merchandise and help support TDIClub


Go Back   TDIClub Forums > VW TDI Discussion Areas > TDI Conversions

TDI Conversions Discussions on converting non TDIs into TDIS. More general items can be answered better in other sections. This is ideal for issues that don't have an overlap and are very special to swaping engines.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old September 11th, 2019, 15:22   #46
QuickTD
Veteran Member
Default

Use the original cluster, it already matches the keys. Pull it apart and install the diesel guage faces and modify the eeprom in the cluster to rescale the tach. You cannot adapt "used" key transponders to a new cluster. Modifying the immo/key data is possible but it requires better tools than you have...

Delete the immo in the ECU with via OBD using vag commander and you're all done.

EDIT- And in your mystery wiring connector #2 is either for the anti shudder valve, or the CCV heater. Most likely the former since most european vehicles did not have a CCV heater. It's more of a scandinavia and north america thing.

#4 is for the N75 valve

Last edited by QuickTD; September 11th, 2019 at 16:55. Reason: Added more info
QuickTD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 11th, 2019, 21:58   #47
Koehn
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Vancouver, BC
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by QuickTD View Post
Use the original cluster, it already matches the keys. Pull it apart and install the diesel guage faces and modify the eeprom in the cluster to rescale the tach. You cannot adapt "used" key transponders to a new cluster. Modifying the immo/key data is possible but it requires better tools than you have...

Delete the immo in the ECU with via OBD using vag commander and you're all done.

EDIT- And in your mystery wiring connector #2 is either for the anti shudder valve, or the CCV heater. Most likely the former since most european vehicles did not have a CCV heater. It's more of a scandinavia and north america thing.

#4 is for the N75 valve
Haha yeah, when I saw an image of someone else's engine bay, I realized I'd run the cables wrong and that I had mistakenly hooked up the wrong connector to the N75 (3 identical connectors on a single lead seems like poor design).

I just dug out the old EGR/anti-shudder and it only has connections for vacuum lines, nothing electrical. So I guess it might be for the CCV heater. That still leaves one connector unaccounted for (I can't remember the wire colours off-hand), but I think it might be for a fuel temperature sensor. I noticed in a VCDS auto-scan Code P1163 "Fuel Temp Sensor (G62) Open or Short to Plus - Intermittent". These are both things I never knew existed in a vehicle

I was looking into getting some ID48 capsules to adapt to the new system (if I can pair the ECU to the cluster's IMMO ID following the VCDS write-up for swapping an ECU). That would be nice, because I'd still have an immobilizer, but it is something else to buy.

I've also got a thread going on NefMoto seeking information about how to write my 1.8T IMMO ID to the diesel cluster and ECU.


I don't mind pulling apart the cluster and swapping the faces, my old one is in better shape anyways! That said, I was hoping to keep the immobilizer. As far as rescaling the tach I found (this) video but I got a bit confused by all the steps he took. At first, I had no idea why his needle was hanging just below 1000rpm, but then I realized that he was checking the needle position for idle. I think the only part that's necessary is to change the first two columns in offset 330 to 78 & 10 respectively (I just checked my tdi cluster dump and that's what those values are there).

So the steps would just be:
  1. Read EEprom (encrypted)
  2. Save a clean backup
  3. Modify the first two values in offset 330 (addresses 00 & 01) to 78 & 10
  4. Write Eeprom (encrypted)
  5. Done!

That leaves me with figuring out how to delete the immo from the ecu with Vag Commander. For that I've found (this) video. There is an "immo off" button available after reading the ecu EEprom but I think that just gets ignored. So the jist of the video is that the value in offset 1B0 column 1 (00) needs to be changed to 60, and the value in offset 1D0 column 15 (0E) also needs to be changed to 60. Checking my ecu dump, both values are currently 73.

The steps for that would be:
  1. Connection Type K-Line
  2. ECU Type (VAG-EDC15x)
  3. Read EEPROM
  4. Save a clean backup
  5. Modify value in offset 1B0 address 00 to 60
  6. Modify value in offset 1D0 address 0E to 60
  7. Write EEPROM
  8. Done!

If that all looks good, then I'll give that a shot tomorrow!
Koehn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old September 12th, 2019, 03:54   #48
QuickTD
Veteran Member
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Koehn View Post
I just dug out the old EGR/anti-shudder and it only has connections for vacuum lines, nothing electrical.
The plug goes to the vacuum solenoid that operates the anti shudder valve. I doubt that you have a CCV heater, the wires would be red/white-brown if you did. The fuel temp sensor is located in the return line just after it exits the tandem pump. All electronically managed diesels have one. It is used to calculate fuel density.

Quote:
I was looking into getting some ID48 capsules to adapt to the new system (if I can pair the ECU to the cluster's IMMO ID following the VCDS write-up for swapping an ECU). That would be nice, because I'd still have an immobilizer, but it is something else to buy.

I've also got a thread going on NefMoto seeking information about how to write my 1.8T IMMO ID to the diesel cluster and ECU.
Do not mess around with the cluster eeprom in this fashion with Chinese tools. You will brick it. You cannot edit the immo values directly. The data is encrypted by the cluster itself as it is written, and is unique to the cluster. The only way to modify values in the immo portion of the eeprom is via the normal adaptation/key learning processes. Since your north American cluster/ecu and European cluster/ecu are different immo versions, this will be impossible.


Quote:
So the steps would just be:
  1. Read EEprom (encrypted)
  2. Save a clean backup
  3. Modify the first two values in offset 330 (addresses 00 & 01) to 78 & 10
  4. Write Eeprom (encrypted)
  5. Done!
Correct

Quote:
That leaves me with figuring out how to delete the immo from the ecu with Vag Commander. For that I've found (this) video. There is an "immo off" button available after reading the ecu EEprom but I think that just gets ignored. So the jist of the video is that the value in offset 1B0 column 1 (00) needs to be changed to 60, and the value in offset 1D0 column 15 (0E) also needs to be changed to 60. Checking my ecu dump, both values are currently 73.

The steps for that would be:
  1. Connection Type K-Line
  2. ECU Type (VAG-EDC15x)
  3. Read EEPROM
  4. Save a clean backup
  5. Modify value in offset 1B0 address 00 to 60
  6. Modify value in offset 1D0 address 0E to 60
  7. Write EEPROM
  8. Done!

If that all looks good, then I'll give that a shot tomorrow!
Just use the immo off button, it usually works just fine.

Last edited by QuickTD; September 13th, 2019 at 03:39.
QuickTD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 12th, 2019, 21:16   #49
Koehn
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Vancouver, BC
Default

Just gave the vacuum system a closer look, and you're absolutely right. When I recieved the engine from Frans, the vac lines were just bundled on top of the engine and I didn't even realize both my N18 and N239 valves were missing. Because I deleted the EGR with a racepipe and simplified the vac lines, it also doesn't matter. Nice to finally know why I had two extra connectors!

It's been absolutely dumping rain all day, so I couldn't get out there to test my hand at the recoding again. But I appreciate you walking me through it and confirming these steps! This whole process and been difficult at times but I love how much I've learned through it all

Also, I pretty much murdered my battery last time, so I'll be sure to disconnect my glowplug relay next time

Rainy days do give me time to work on my brake upgrade though. Still prepping everything for paint. But at least I've got all the parts in now. Test fit the rotors and front calipers my old knuckles (they're handy for something!) and it looks like I'll have to get 1/16" (~1.6mm) machined off the inside of the mounting ears. That measurement seems inline with what others had to do with the V70R rotors as well, so now I just have to find a local machinist!





The gap to the guide pin is approximately 1/8" while the guide pin on the opposite side of the caliper was just touching the rotor, so if I get 1/16" machined off the inside of the ears, it should be centred
Koehn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old September 12th, 2019, 21:49   #50
Koehn
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Vancouver, BC
Default

Loading up those photos of the new brakes made me realize that I jumped straight into cluster troubleshooting and never posted the progress I made on the chassis!



The left tank is my A4 one, the right tank is from the S4 (same part # as the TDI). The S4 tank fit perfectly and allowed the TDI intercooler to sit well on it's bracket without bumping into anything. I did have to swap the windscreen pump from my A4 one to the S4 tank because I needed it to output to two lines instead of one. I assume the S4 just has a T-fitting further up the line



With the intercooler mounted, I made short work of the rest of the front end. I had an A/C o-ring kit from FCP Euro that was allegedly compatible with my car. Some of the o-rings on the lines I'd disconnected were really loose so I tried to find replacements. The bag had tons of o-rings and yet I still couldn't fine a good match for some of them. Going into the project I already didn't have a working A/C system and when I dismantled it, I found out why. All the Freon had already leaked out. Hopefully the o-rings I replaced will fix that!

On Sunday, I chopped up my rusty gasoline intermediate pipe to make a quick dump pipe for testing. The flange matched the diesel cat-pipe, but the angles are different so you can't just use the 1.8T pipe as-is. It's been a few years since I welded last, and I'm definitely no fabricator, but I had fun making it! I'll try to get an install picture of it later, it's decently ghetto and I chopped it level to the bottom of the trans crossmember.





For the wiring I went to my local european car wrecker (a place I frequent too often) and they let me chop out the body-harness connectors from a B7 (no B6's around) free-of-charge. So I de-pinned them all with my cheap amazon tools and now I had more than I needed!



At least that's what I thought, turns out the pin I had to add to connector T10 (black) was different! The T17 has three sizes of pins: small single-sided latch, medium double-sided latch, and big-double sided latch. The T10 has two sizes (IRCC) small double-sided latch and medium double-sided latch. So back to the wrecker to chop a connector out of a B5.

Left is the small T17 pin, right is the small T10 pin



After reading this thread (clicky) about wheel alignment on Audizine. I tried to scoot my rear subframe back as I didn't like how close the wheels were to the front of the wheel wells. With the rear end back on jackstands I loosened the mounting bolts and dropped the subframe about 1/2" all around. Even with the help of a Wonder Bar prying between the front mount and the car frame, we were only able to shift it back 3/8" on either side. The thread mentions people moving it and checking then moving it some more, but I had to hang on the bar while my dad tightened the bolts to get it to stay back. I'm still not all that happy with the wheel positioning, but I'm not sure what else I can do. The eccentric bolts for toe on both sides of the car are also completely maxxed out (pushing the front of the wheel out and back) but it still doesn't seem like enough.

I think the subframe was still loose when this photo was taken



To finish, I've added engine oil (only one 505.01 rated oil around) and water (G12 coolant to be flushed in later). I installed the front axles yesterday. Turns out both front wheel bearings are shot, so I have replacements on the way (those are surprisingly pricey). Once those are swapped in, the S4 rear brakes are painted and installed, the rear camber and front tie-rods are adjusted, power steering fluid is added (ended up with Pentosin CHF 202 at the recomendation of people on Audizine), aaaaand the immobilizer work is finished... then I might be able to drive it

Maybe
Koehn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old September 18th, 2019, 21:17   #51
Koehn
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Vancouver, BC
Default

Good news bad news! Basically just lots of news. (Sorry for the lack of pictures)

To start, I tried to pair the ECU to the diesel cluster and that one failed with the error "Key Not OK" (not 100% on the actual message but that was essentially the point). So I think if I did get the immo pills I still might be able to get that to work, but as it is currently with my existing keys, they won't pair. So I did exactly what QuickTD advised: recoded the tachometer, swapped faceplates, and deleted the immobilizer in the ECU with VAG-Commander.

With that done, and the fluids topped up, fuel filter replaced and about 20 seconds of cranking... it started! IT ACTUALLY STARTED ! I was sooooo stoked but knew she wasn't done yet. Before she could be road worthy I still needed to replace the front wheel bearings and finish up my S4 rear brake upgrade so that I could replace my frozen rear caliper.

Since I upgraded the rears and I'm working on the front big brake kit, I decided painting the calipers and carriers would be a good idea and it'd be much more convenient while they still weren't mounted. Despite really wanting to go with dark blue I got swayed over to yellow, so I picked up some VHT caliper paint and clear coat. Without boring you with the detailed process, I'll just say I'm not impressed. Right out the oven I could tell the paint didn't cure that well. It even seemed to have liquified in some areas and was easily wiped off to bare metal with a dry finger. The paint also chips off basically anytime someone glances at them. They look nice from far, but they're far from good. For the Brembo's I'm heavily considering my powdercoat options...

Wheel bearings went in smooth enough now that I'm well acquainted with the front suspension. Torqued up the new axle nuts (wow that takes some force!), and took her off the jackstands. It was time for the maiden voyage.

She fired right up this time nice and easy! The driving experience around the block was... interesting .The power steering pump groaned a ton as it churned through the air bubbles. The front brakes were grinding against the rusty rotors. The engine was loud, smooth and ran clean. But, there was a wheel-speed based ticking from the front end that had me concerned. After coming around the corner, popping the charge-air pipe (still waiting for the clip) and rolling a huge cloud of coal behind, I stopped for a checkup and found a power steering leak that was easy to fix.

Took a few more rides in the neighborhood, going real easy. Happy to report the brakes smoothed out and are nice and firm. Got the front end back up and tried to better fill the power steering system; basically just turning from lock to lock and adding fluid as the bubbles came out. I think that's almost dialed in as it only groans at full lock now (which I'm pretty sure it always did that).

The only real issue now is that speed-based clicking . By the end of my testing I think it had faded away when driving in a straight line, but when coasting into corners it reeeeally ramped up and could be felt in the cabin. I suppose it could be the front cv's binding, but I had absolutely no issues with them before the swap and they literally sat in a dry shed all summer until I installed them last week. Boots weren't torn at all and they looked good. Hopefully I'll figure it out quick, driving a motorcycle to work in the summer is fine, but it's getting wetter out each day!

EDIT: To add, I put the car back up on all 4 jackstands, and ran it in gear and there wasn't any clunking. Not with the wheels straight ahead or at either lock. So it's only when acutlaly driving/the suspension is loaded

Last edited by Koehn; September 18th, 2019 at 21:27.
Koehn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2019, 04:19   #52
Growler
Got Soot Vendor
 
Growler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Millersport, Ohio
Default

Congratulations on getting it moving under its own power. now to figure out the clicking noises.
__________________
~Aaron~

Schmutz 2015 GSW S DSG
Schnurren 2001 Golf 2 door.
Growler is online now   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2019, 10:33   #53
Koehn
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Vancouver, BC
Default

Thanks Growler! Still really excited by that despite the issues.

I've found this (clicky) thread on Audizine, and post #6 mentions the subframe pinch welds coming loose. The fix is basically just to weld the two pieces together which isn't bad. I feel like my symptoms are a little different, but because the noise goes away when the car is on jackstands, I think it might be my issue. Hoping to check today after work if the rainclouds stay away!
Koehn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old September 20th, 2019, 07:49   #54
Koehn
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Vancouver, BC
Default

Got the front end back up and checked the subframe and halfshafts. Subframe looks perfectly fine, with tight seams all around. I noticed the right side halfshaft had some lateral play, so with the wheels up on blocks and the suspension loaded, I could easily shift the axle toward the wheel and toward the transmission enough for it to make some noise when it stopped in each direction. I'm assuming this is not intended movement. The left side halfshaft moved as well, but it's almost an imperceptible amount. It can only be felt, not seen or heard.

So, I started shopping for axles and reading people's thoughts on the current offerings. Raxles seem to get the highest praise, but it'd be $800 CAD to do both sides or $470 for just one. At this point I'm not sure if both of my axles are toast so that seems like a tough buy. Germanautoparts, ECSTuning, FCPEuro, etc. all carry GKN replacements which is the OEM, so people like those. They also have a lot of much cheaper options (<$100 each) but it's hard to find a glowing review for any of them. I called up my local Audi dealer just for kicks, $560 per axle and they're apparently on backorder until at least November . Safe to say that's not happening!

Lordco has Cardone-brand axles for about $100 each. Reviews online seem negative, but I decided to push my luck. I bought two, but I'll put just the passenger side one in and then I'll test it. If the noise is reduced, but not gone, I'll try the driver's side. If that fixes it but it craps out in a month or two, then I'll just get the Raxles and move on with my life. Won't be able to work on the car at all this weekend, so now we wait

As much as I hoped it wasn't the halfshafts making this noise, it'll be a much easier fix if it is! Otherwise I'll have to keep hunting
Koehn is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
'01 Audi A4 1.8T quattro TDI Conversion GoremanX TDI Conversions 564 January 12th, 2019 18:10
Starter for a Audi A4 TDI Quattro swap with 1.8t M/T A4-TDI TDI 101 1 November 22nd, 2014 18:23
04 Audi a4 Quattro 1.8t Nashville, Tn mac11 TDI Cars for Sale/Wanted 1 July 17th, 2013 19:47
96 TDI into A4 1.8t Quattro Steve777 TDI Conversions 1 March 20th, 2007 10:16
FS: 00 Audi A4 Avant 1.8T Quattro in VT VTJC Private TDI Items for Sale/Wanted 4 June 28th, 2002 08:08


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:40.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright - TDIClub Online LTD - 2017
Contact Us | Privacy Statement | Forum Rules | Disclaimer
TDIClub Online Ltd (TDIClub.com) is not affiliated with the VWoA or VWAG and is supported by contributions from viewers like you.
© 1996 - 2017, All Rights Reserved
Page generated in 0.14763 seconds with 12 queries
[Output: 110.41 Kb. compressed to 97.05 Kb. by saving 13.36 Kb. (12.10%)]