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Go Back   TDIClub Forums > VW TDI Discussion Areas > Dieselgate - VW Group Emission Scandal

Dieselgate - VW Group Emission Scandal Discussion around the VW Dieselgate Emissions scandal. Details and news updates can be viewed here: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=448336 This forum is a work in progress depending on requirements, usage, etc.

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Old October 2nd, 2017, 10:19   #61
mondomike
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Default my turn with a wrecked car

Hi,
Chiming in very late to this thread, i know...
When at a complete stop in the road, my 2011 TDI was rear-ended by a school bus (!), jamming me into the Range Rover in front of me, thus making the front-end very accordion-like..
the school driver was issued a police citation for causing the accident.
However, the car started and drove onto the bed of the tow truck - so it runs a little.
From this thread, it sounds as though my best actions could be:
- let the insurance company assess the damage (they will very likely claim it is totalled)
- tell the insurance company i want the full, current value of the car (minus salvage), and that i want it brought back to my house
- schedule an appointment with the VW dealer for return (i had already accepted the buyout offer - just was planning to drive it into 2018)
- get full buyback $ from VW
- get full current value $ from insurance company
Does this work?
Thanks
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Old October 2nd, 2017, 13:22   #62
duratitus
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Do you still have a clean title for the car?

VW will have a problem if you bring a salvage title to the buyback if they approved buyback for a clean titled car.
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Old October 2nd, 2017, 14:51   #63
mondomike
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duratitus View Post
Do you still have a clean title for the car?
VW will have a problem if you bring a salvage title to the buyback if they approved buyback for a clean titled car.
Is that established? I have seen comments supporting and dissenting around the salvage title being an issue.

I'm wondering, also, if the physical condition of my car is 'too much' for VW to take back - take a look - thoughts?
thanks

https://photos.app.goo.gl/JwxHmFs90V1FoNW72
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Old October 2nd, 2017, 15:51   #64
PacCoastFwy923
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Not necessarily the aesthetic condition, but the mechanical condition.

I see a big puddle of coolant on the pavement.

The agreement says it must "run under its own power" and true to this, many buyback reps (as reported on this forum) have required an extended engine run or even a drive for a set distance.

I'm betting yours overheats if run continuously?

Others here in similar condition have made minimal repairs to get the cooling system patched together, turning their rejected buyback into a successful buyback.
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Old October 2nd, 2017, 17:59   #65
duratitus
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I took a look at your photo, and can say that I have returned 5-10 cars in the same or worse condition.

However, things are changing, and there are several things to bear in mind.

1. Although VW initially was accepting salvage and rebuilt titled cars without batting an eye, since May 1st, they have put all branded title claims on hold.
- They may still buy a salvage car back, but many of us who have been waiting with branded title claims, think there is a good chance that VW will wait till the last days of the claim period to approve our claims, thereby tying the hands of "Flippers" who would otherwise keep buying salvage cars for the buyback.

2. Whenever I have went to a closing buyback appointment, they have always reviewed the title for any brands. They've never rejected my titles at the buyback appointment, but it has always been the same tilte that was uploaded to the portal weeks before.
- if they approved your claim based on a clean title document, and then you walk in to your appointment with a salvage title, I think they're going to put your claim on hold just like they've done to hundreds of other branded title claims.

3. You will probably need to bring a copy of the accident report along to the closing appointment to prove that the damage was unintentional. They have rejected cars even with clean titles if they think that the damage was caused on purpose. I have not had a problem in this regard, but I always have a copy of the carfax report or accident report with me to show legitimate damages.

4. I've been required to put 5 miles the odometer at buyback appointments with damaged cars to prove that they can indeed run and drive. I've been able to drive that far without engine coolant or a radiator, but it's risky, and you might consider fixing the cooling system before the appointment.

Ultimately, if you take it in with a clean title, the worst thing they can do is tell you what repairs the will need before accepting the car, and reschedule your appointment.
There is a good chance they'll take it as is, just bend the hood strait so it looks good.

I'm 99% sure they'll reject your car, or at a minimum delay your claim for months if you try to take a salvage title to your buyback appointment.
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Old October 2nd, 2017, 20:07   #66
mondomike
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thank you so much, for the extremely useful information!

Quote:
Originally Posted by duratitus View Post
I took a look at your photo, and can say that I have returned 5-10 cars in the same or worse condition.

However, things are changing, and there are several things to bear in mind.

1. Although VW initially was accepting salvage and rebuilt titled cars without batting an eye, since May 1st, they have put all branded title claims on hold.
- They may still buy a salvage car back, but many of us who have been waiting with branded title claims, think there is a good chance that VW will wait till the last days of the claim period to approve our claims, thereby tying the hands of "Flippers" who would otherwise keep buying salvage cars for the buyback.

2. Whenever I have went to a closing buyback appointment, they have always reviewed the title for any brands. They've never rejected my titles at the buyback appointment, but it has always been the same tilte that was uploaded to the portal weeks before.
- if they approved your claim based on a clean title document, and then you walk in to your appointment with a salvage title, I think they're going to put your claim on hold just like they've done to hundreds of other branded title claims.

3. You will probably need to bring a copy of the accident report along to the closing appointment to prove that the damage was unintentional. They have rejected cars even with clean titles if they think that the damage was caused on purpose. I have not had a problem in this regard, but I always have a copy of the carfax report or accident report with me to show legitimate damages.

4. I've been required to put 5 miles the odometer at buyback appointments with damaged cars to prove that they can indeed run and drive. I've been able to drive that far without engine coolant or a radiator, but it's risky, and you might consider fixing the cooling system before the appointment.

Ultimately, if you take it in with a clean title, the worst thing they can do is tell you what repairs the will need before accepting the car, and reschedule your appointment.
There is a good chance they'll take it as is, just bend the hood strait so it looks good.

I'm 99% sure they'll reject your car, or at a minimum delay your claim for months if you try to take a salvage title to your buyback appointment.
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Old October 7th, 2017, 08:55   #67
mondomike
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as a recap: my car was hit from behind (while i was at a complete stop) by a school bus, causing this damage.
It was drivable onto the tow truck bed, but i have no idea how far i could drive it in its current state.
just got off the phone with State Farm.
The estimate to repair the car (2011 Golf TDI)is $10,500.
"Fair Market Value" as assessed by State Farms is $8800.
They were about to mark it "salvage" but i talked them out of it (Illinois law is 9y or older, so it is not mandatory).
But - i could not talk them into giving me $10,500 to repair it - even though i have the letter from VW marking the payback as $19,960.
So - is it worth pursuing the difference in $ any further? My plan from here:
- have the car towed to the body shop
- ask them to patch up the radiator, pull out the hood, and ensure i can run it for at least 5 minutes at the dealer.
- make the appt for buyback - calling VW first, to let them know the current condition (clean title, badly banged up car)
- collect the insurance payout $8800
- move my State Farm insurance to another company because they wouldn't agree to pay out the full $10,500.
Anything i am missing?
thanks
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Old October 7th, 2017, 09:01   #68
bizzle
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No insurance is going to repair a vehicle for more than it's worth so there isn't any point in taking that frustration out on State Farm. If you want to do this ethically, then compromise with State Farm to repair it to operable condition so you can turn it in to VW instead of trying to double dip by taking the fair market value from both State Farm and VW.
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Old October 7th, 2017, 09:22   #69
mondomike
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i'm not sure this is double-dipping - i'm interested to hear thoughts on this.

to me, the fair market value is what i can get for the car - in this case, $19,960.
i'm not asking for $19k from insurance, just the full amount to repair it, as they would do for any other accident claim, where the car wasn't a salvage, and the value (what i could get for the car) was far more than the repair costs.

this is my understanding of insurance coverage: once i receive the $ based on the insurance estimate: at that point, it is up to me to use the $ to repair it or not. in this case, i can use just enough to get it to the dealer. i don't see that as double-dipping - i see that as using my insurance coverage as effectively as possible.
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Old October 7th, 2017, 09:32   #70
bizzle
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Regardless of how you view it, the point is that in all other accident cases if it costs more to repair it then it does to salvage it out at "fair market value" an insurance company isn't going to repair it.

Your car isn't "worth" $19K. VW is paying you an amount above fair market value because of the class action suit. Besides, as it sits, you can't get $19K for your car so that argument isn't going to have much traction with State Farm.

The reason it's double dipping is because, generally, when you salvage a car and the insurance company pays out on it they own the car. In this scenario, you want to keep it.

Some members have posted that they were able to get a totaled payout, keep the car, keep the title from being marked as salvage (which seems borderline fraudulent if not outright--imagine if you were a private buyer and found out someone had managed to take a total car, resell it, while avoiding a branded title).

Your options would seem to be:

selling the car to the insurance company for the salvage price, buying it back from them, and then taking it in to VW.

or

talking State Farm into fixing it enough to drive it in to the turn-in to VW

or

repairing the car out of pocket enough to drive it in to the turn-in to VW.
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Old October 8th, 2017, 04:44   #71
halbert
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Or (what I wish I had done) you can take the insurance settlement, then have your claim reset and take the restitution for a car you no longer have. You may come in a small amount lower than if you didn't have a damaged car...but not by much.

I have a rejected vehicle in my garage that has been there for quite a while. I'm about ready to sell it to a junkyard and then take the restitution and be done with it.
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Old October 8th, 2017, 05:51   #72
DanB36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bizzle View Post
Some members have posted that they were able to get a totaled payout, keep the car, keep the title from being marked as salvage (which seems borderline fraudulent if not outright--imagine if you were a private buyer and found out someone had managed to take a total car, resell it, while avoiding a branded title).
"Some members" like me, who started this thread. And if it were a case of taking a totaled car, doing the minimum possible work to hide the damage, and then selling it to a private party, I'd see your point. But that's not what I did, and that's not what's being suggested in the more recent posts here. The extent of the damage is obvious. And by the terms of the settlement, a title branded after 9/16/15 doesn't affect an owner's eligibility anyway.

At common law, at least, one of the elements of the tort of fraud is that the misrepresentation be material. Under the terms of the settlement VW agreed to, the state of the title isn't material (with exceptions that aren't relevant here). No materiality, no fraud.
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Old October 9th, 2017, 10:24   #73
mondomike
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thanks - the insurance settlement is $8.8k (assuming i get my deductible back)
the restitution is $5.8k.
the value assessed by VW is $13.8k, meaning i will come in $5k lower this way.
my insurance company just told me Illinois law mandates calling the car a total loss, and i can't get it back unless i drop the claim.
so i could try and get it fixed for less than $5k and hope VW still takes it back
or i could contact the insurance company of the bus that hit me and see what they say (in process)
or i could take the settlement and the restitution and call it a day, with $5k less than planned...


Quote:
Originally Posted by halbert View Post
Or (what I wish I had done) you can take the insurance settlement, then have your claim reset and take the restitution for a car you no longer have. You may come in a small amount lower than if you didn't have a damaged car...but not by much.

I have a rejected vehicle in my garage that has been there for quite a while. I'm about ready to sell it to a junkyard and then take the restitution and be done with it.
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