ALH New Beetle how much harder to work on than Jetta?

Considering getting one for wife. Are things much harder to get to? Any pluses or minuses to one vs Jetta?

Thanks.

The beetle is a little tighter to get in to work on.to me it’s easier to get in a beetle than a Jetta.

They are tighter in some places but built on a Golf chassis so a lot of parts are interchangeable.

Getting behind the Beetle motor requires removal of some panels/cowling, where as the Golf and Jetta are much more open.

Good part is more plastic body parts means less rust to deal with.
Lots of headroom upfront but not so much in the back.

Jetta will provide seating for 4 people and maybe a small person in the middle back row. Beetle cuts you off at 4 people and the rear passengers should be short or they will hit the back window.

I think it comes down to preference on the styling.

I just bought one for my girlfriend. The trunk area is small compared to a jetta. The interior panels are all plastic and are usually brittle and break if you take stuff apart. The door panel design is trash.

Most parts are interchangeable with a jetta like suspension and engine.

Parts cars are plentiful at the wrecking yards.

Engine compartment is tighter than a jetta especially between the front fans and front of the engine. Stuff is tight to get to but once you've worked on one a little you know what panels/parts to remove, where to put your hands and tools you'll need to reach.

Not bad cars if you need cheap transportation with good MPG

If you're working on the back/firewall side, I'd say you have more room once the drip tray is removed. But as previously stated, the front gets a little like tangled spaghetti where a Jetta has IMHO a more even amount of room albeit not a lot on either side.

If you are serious about one, look at the radiator support and see if it's broken and or been repaired. Do an auto scan with vcds and see what comes up. Haggle them down because it probably needs suspension bushings like almost of the ones for sale that I've seen. And look for zip ties and wood screws holding the headlights in...the tabs break off the ring to remove the headlight assembly and often get some awful solutions for a simple problem.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

WildChild80 said:

If you're working on the back/firewall side, I'd say you have more room once the drip tray is removed. But as previously stated, the front gets a little like tangled spaghetti where a Jetta has IMHO a more even amount of room albeit not a lot on either side.



Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

Click to expand...

I rebuilt the motor in place on my 98 using the Bentley for a Jetta/Golf so I had no idea about that removable parcel tray (at the time). I pulled the head/turbo/intake as one unit and reassembled everything. Tight but doable. The second time the turbo came out I knew better!!! (and had bought a beetle specific Bentley!)

I will add that the timing belts are easier to do on a beetle since the power steering reservoir is mounted next to the battery.

gforce1108 said:

I will add that the timing belts are easier to do on a beetle since the power steering reservoir is mounted next to the battery.

Click to expand...

That's good to know if I ever get my beetle moving again.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

Well I’ve got 4 beetles and two golfs......albeit a little tight in the front sides it wouldn’t be a deal stopper for me.
I will say with the rear seats folded down you can really pack the car just like the golfs.
Plus I like the body shape. Just my .02.

Good to know info. Recently finished a ton of work on my Jetta. Now im gearing up to start working on my beetle. I just got a Bentley manual for the beetle too- should make things smoother than the work on my Jetta...

PB_NB said:

Lots of headroom upfront but not so much in the back...and the rear passengers should be short or they will hit the back window

Click to expand...

I'm around 6' tall, my head will hit the rear glass if I (try) to sit up right. If I slouch a little, it would be perfectly fine for short trips.

As far as servicing goes, some stuff is a little easier, some stuff a little harder, but none of it is especially difficult in my opinion. The cars come apart and go back together pretty easy.

Appreciate you all. Sounds like a fun car to own.

have fun with that alternator, NOT. PITA

Will it not clear on the NB if you remove the A/C compressor (do not detach lines, place on something like a milk crate), remove pax side spider and fan?

I've done the Golfs and Jettas and they all come out the bottom that way. The first one made me swear a lot. The rest? Not so much.

Mongler98 said:

have fun with that alternator, NOT. PITA

Click to expand...

Easy peasy. And for the 4.2hr labor, I'd do them all day long, one after the other. You could circle ALH NBs around the block for alternators, I'd do them happily. Hardest part (and this is doing it "by the book") is taking the headlights out, since so many of those have gotten boogered up by people who should never have touched them. So if you can replace a headlight bulb in one, the rest is disgustingly easy. Just a bunch of Torx screws. I think the problem people often have is that they try and shortcut certain things, and end up fighting themselves and making it so much harder. 20 easy-to-access screws are less of a problem than one that is a royal pain. The NB's front clip comes off SUPER easy. I could do it blindfolded.

oilhammer said:

........................... The NB's front clip comes off SUPER easy. I could do it blindfolded.

Click to expand...

This seems intimidating only the first time, try it, you'll like it.

Heh, unfortunately I have not yet found anyone willing to let me work on their car blindfolded. But I'm up for the challenge... I would, however, need someone to hand me tools. And I will concede I may not be able to get the headlights to slide out without some visual help. That would be the hardest part with or without vision.

Oilhammer, are you saying that the book says to remove the whole front clip (bumper and fenders) to change the alternator on a NB?

Pretty sure that's what Jon Hamilton told me as well, at least that's how he does it.

That’s what he told me as well. Said it’s a 4 hour job.
He told me he tried everything he could to try to do it without removing the clip and it didn’t work or wasn’t worth the extra effort. Don’t recall which.

Hey, even I think the NB font clip comes off easy, and I'm a slow tedious mechanic who'd starve if I tried to make a living at it.

Cheers,

PH

What I have found after owning several Beetles is when the bolts start rusting and the front end needs removing it can cause some frustrations. Once you get past the mindset that an alternator takes some time to change the job is not really that bad. VW's are generally good to work on even the new Beetle. Things like the turbo just need more time to move things out or around and your arm gets a little more grease on it. The worst thing I can think of to tackle is the ABS module stuck in a hole that I can't even pull the plug off or see what I am doing. But there is a way around it as you unbolt things and pull it out.
I find the Beetles have better handling than the others with a wider track, the seats are more comfortable for me (I drive 130 miles a day to feel the difference), and as a tall person I love the head room. I love the temp display when the road is freezing. For all the dumb things VW does, why did they leave this out of every Jetta and Golf I have owned? And why on the Beetle do they make the worst junk plastic for a door handle that breaks off in your hand with normal use or panels that just self destruct? If you can get past that stuff I do love driving the Beetle.

Growler said:

Oilhammer, are you saying that the book says to remove the whole front clip (bumper and fenders) to change the alternator on a NB?

Click to expand...

Yes, and that is why it is 4.2hr book time. Oddly enough, the VERY FIRST training video I ever saw for the NB was removal of the front clip. So I guess I had that etched in my brain before I even laid eyes on one in the flesh let alone drove one or worked on one.

For the record, you *can* get the alternator out another way, but it is a fight, and not worth it. I also have gotten FAR too many NBs in here after other hacks replaced one (I was of course going in to replace it again, with a proper Bosch this time), and found the idiots chopped out the lower section of the lock carrier, and the only thing holding the whole front end together is the radiator.

For the record, and I repeat, the New Beetle's front clip is VERY EASY to take off. Seriously, the hardest part is dealing with the headlights, as anyone who has worked on lots of these knows sometimes they can fight you to come loose, especially if someone has been in there prior who didn't know what they were doing and broke/bent/tweaked/tooefed things.

But once those are out:

Lift the front end (easy)

Take the front wheels off (seriously, if you have trouble with this, stop, and never go near your car with a wrench again)

If equipped, remove the gravel guards (Torx bolts)

Remove the fender liners (Torx screws, cordless driver makes short work of these, and while there are a few of them, exactly NONE of them are hard to access)

Reach in and unplug the LEFT marker lamp.

On cars with an intercooler (so, all the TDIs), you cannot reach the RIGHT marker light, so pop the little orange cover off, then remove the one Phillips screw and remove the lamp and unplug it after it is loose.

If equipped, unplug the fog lamps (the right side on intercooled cars will require reaching through the air inlet duct, but it is pliable rubbery plastic so it gives easily).

Unplug the outside temp sensor in the lower edge of the bumper cover (this is the sensor for the thermometer in the overhead display).

Remove the clips or screws (could be either) along the lower edge of the bumper cover.

Remove all the Torx bolts along the hood opening, one on each side is down in the little foam hood bushing, and the bushing usually stays with the bolt.

At the rear of each fender, in the back, are some little nuts, remove all those on each side.... you can leave the lower ones, as that bracket can stay on the car, and just remove the lower bolt through the bottom of the fender instead (if you have gravel guards, you will have already removed these).

Remove the bolts at the upper inner fender brackets, one straight up, the other slightly towards the rear of the car. Both easy to get straight on.

Remove the little bracket at the forward edge of the fender opening, near where the fender and bumper cover meet. The driver side will be right near the air snorkel. Note the placement of all these screws, as they are not all the same.

Now, everything is "loose", and with a helper, pull the rear of each side of the fenders out and away from the car, so that the inner brackets slide over and off the studs where the nuts you removed a few steps prior were.

Once loose at the rear, you slide the entire front clip, bumper cover AND fenders as an assembly, straight forward and away from the car, tilting it up at the rear once you've cleared the tabs around the headlight buckets. Note how these tabs are arranged before doing this for ease of reassembly. Also take care not to snag the secondary hood release in the bumper cover on the way off.

Try to keep the front end "square" with itself, as it is somewhat bendy and flexy once removed from the car, don't place too much stress on it (this is why two people make it much easier... although I can do it by myself if I have to).

You can set the clip down and it will sit level on the floor away from the car.

NOW you have the entire front end of the car expose. You can inspect the intercooler mountings and the cooler itself for any damage, these get whacked easily.

The front lock carrier assembly (so, the support structure, the radiator, the fans, the condenser, the bumper) are all held on to the body by just a few bolts, one on each side are coming in from the top (this is different than the G/J, which do not have these top ones).

If you temporarily replace two of the lower front ones with extra long M8x1.25 bolts, you can then slide the whole thing forward a couple inches on those bolts. You will only be able to go as far as the radiator hoses, refrigerant lines, hood cable, etc. will let you. But, it will be enough. I clamp a vise grip on to the long bolts behind the lock carrier to hold the assembly out, and then you have PLENTY of room to slide the alternator out.

Only thing of note going back together: make sure the fenders go around the tabs properly at the headlight buckets and that the hood release lever finds its way into the hole in the bumper cover. If something is not lining up properly, then chances are one of those tabs is not in the right spot. It should all fit back together easily.

Clean up and screws/screw holes as necessary, as there may be a combination of old thread locker, road debris, rust, etc. in there and if you try and force something into a hole full of junk you'll mess it up.

And make certain all three slides on the headlight assemblies are lined up when you go in... that can be a little tricky sometimes.

I want to dupe your post over in the How To thread.
Hows this for title-
Front Clip Removal A4 NB (others similar)
Please correct

Ignorance is bliss, I guess. I've never had to remove the clip or a headlight to do the alternator swap. Skipping the electrical disconnection explanation...
Drop the small fan, leave it connected?...yes. Drop the A/C compressor off the bracket and hang it?...yes. Cardboard on the radiator fins? yes. Serp tensioner?...yes.

You have to push the thermostat coolant hose out of the way but not disconnect it.
That is about it...oh, and the lower cover, RH side cover too, of course.

Next time I might try the front clip removal way although, those body torx tend to corrode up if they have never been budged for their entire life span. They sure enough can be a pain when taking off a bumper cover on a BHW Passat. The riv-nut can break loose and spin in the core support.


I'll delete this if I find out that I am forgetting something and over simplifying. It has been about a year or two since I've had to do this job.

I will sing the praises of the New Beetles until my last breath other than the blasted headlights...

This is what I wrote on another thread a while back...

First and foremost, they are profoundly more comfortable. I am a bigger guy and the NB offers more interior space for a driver and front passenger (admittedly not rear) than any car I have EVER sat in. I had a legit 7 foot roommate who refused to ride in my car until I finally forced him to sit in it and he was flabbergasted. He could put his feet straight out and he had headroom.

Secondly, because of the more central seating position they handle better and are arguably more fun to drive. When new this was even more so because all NBs came with at least 16" wheels factory, along with stiffer spring rates than its MKIV brethren. With the aftermarket, this didn't matter as much, but the seating position is still a big deal IMO.

Third, they are cheaper. Because of the stigma, they just don't seem to hold value as well. But hey, better for me

Now I will admit, there are a couple things that are negatives.
1) The headlight buckets are the stuff of nightmares... I am convinced the engineer who designed them was a Sadomasochist.
2) As I mentioned earlier, the rear seating position lacks for leg AND headroom.
3) Tiny luggage space with the rear seat in place (although alternately HUGE luggage space with the rear seat flipped up) which is how I almost always ran mine.
4) Engine compartment is harder to work in than Jetta or Golf (although as Oilhammer and others have noted, once you tackle the frontend removal and learn the joy of the rad support "service position" that goes right out the window.

Just those godforsaken headlight buckets

bigsexyTDI said:

Just those godforsaken headlight buckets

Click to expand...

When I changed my headlights to the aftermarket ones, this all went away. These ones slip in and lock/unlock with ease.

I think of these as one of the best upgrades for the money ~$250 including the LED hi/low headlamps.

PB_NB said:

When I changed my headlights to the aftermarket ones, this all went away. These ones slip in and lock/unlock with ease.
I think of these as one of the best upgrades for the money ~$250 including the LED hi/low headlamps.

Click to expand...

Gotta a link for them?

I went to look for a link and this is the closest that i could find:

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/1998-2005-V...ash=item288c3b4446:g:wBoAAOSwKKZeGCvP&vxp=mtr

They come in different finishes to suit your tastes. The quality seems pretty good, mine still look great after 3 years. The lens are plastic but still appear clear with minimal scratching or yellowing.

I did a bit of soldering to connect little outer led's to the running lights. With my Euro switch I can just run the little lights and fogs with out the low beams as shown in my avatar pic.

I do like the high low function that uses the same bulb. Much better than the split setup that came with the Beetle. They did plug right in and work with my car with the exception of the little led's which I connected.

I also did a "DRL delete" by interrupting the relay circuit from the e-brake. This prevents the low beams from coming on with the lower power of the DRL circuit which may produce some issues with the LED headlamps.

very nice

I agree completely with the suggestion to remove the front clip. I started doing my alternator swap by trying to finagle the damn thing out. After a little frustration and the realization that I'm to picky to bang **** up or bend **** trying to get it out I pulled the front clip and I would never try and do it the other way again.