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Go Back   TDIClub Forums > TDI Model Specific Discussions Areas > VW Passat Family (NMS and B7) TDIs (2012+)

VW Passat Family (NMS and B7) TDIs (2012+) Discussion area for the 2012+ Passat TDI (North American and rest of world versions versions). The North American model was previously codenamed NMS (New Midsize Sedan) and the version the rest of the world gets is sometimes referred to as B7.

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Old August 8th, 2015, 22:55   #16
stakeman
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Location: Spring,Tx
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Thanks Russell!! Fellow Texan here! I added the 10K OhM Resistor and it worked like a charm! I called VW of A and got the standard run around. Opted to bypass the trip to the "stealership" and went on my own after having OBDM II confirm my CEL. 2 bucks at radio shack and a couple hours of wrenching and I'm done. It did take about 200 miles for the light to go out after the mod but all and all it worked like a charm! If anyone lives in an area that doesn't get too cold wants a 2 dollar fix just follow this thread!

I popped off the right rear tire removed 5 star drive bolts in the wheel well and 3 bolts that are accessed from below the tank and everything dropped down with no issues. find the black and white wires on the heater side of the quick disconnect. Cut, leaving enough room for the 10K resistor on the disconnect side and solder that sucker in connecting the black and white wires! The remaining wires going to the tank can be shrink wrapped or black taped. Easy as pie! Overall this fix for those in a warmer winter climate cost under 2 bucks and takes about 2 hours max, if your taking your time and can't solder worth a crap like me!

THANK YOU VWRussell for the research and the post!!! You saved me hundreds of dollars!
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Old August 9th, 2015, 08:08   #17
andyrew
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Since I live in Maryland and it CAN get cold up here, I went ahead and replaced the heater as per the original post. Fantastic write-up, thank you. I couldn't have done it without that.

Let me add a few more details that would have helped me when I did it.

-When taking the bumper off, the top screw (at the tight angle) is straight up and down. It's in there but it might be slightly covered by the wheel well cover.

-the bottom screws in the bumper cover - they're torx, not hex took awhile for my helper to figure that one out

-When you have the tank out and you're looking for the arrow - it's not the big arrow on the ring. there is a little tiny arrow on the part you're replacing. You can't see it in docmanny's pic but it's under that vent nipple. It's between that nipple and the brass threaded hole in the pic. make sure its between the hash marks.

-getting the hose off the controller - there is a little white ring that looks like it shoule pop off. it doesn't. squeeze the tabs together HARD and then pull the hose off. should pop right off.

-once the heater cover and big gasket are off, the little tank needs to be rotated and it'll pop right out. it rotates counter-clockwise about a 1/4 inch. it's not hard, it'll just be a little pop and out it'll come.

-when putting the ring back on, get the arrow on the top of the heater element between the hash marks, then get the right TIGHT.

I think that was it. The hardest part for me was getting the little bucket out. took a lot of comparing old to new until i could figure it out.

Thanks docmanny. Great write-up.

andy
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Old August 9th, 2015, 11:51   #18
tdiatlast
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VWRussell: Sending PM.
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Old August 9th, 2015, 18:34   #19
titleist1
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Is the oem sensor in the tank a 10k thermistor or something different? I am getting the 205B code and instead of replacing the whole assembly was interested in replacing just the sensor itself.

Since the 10k resistor fools the system into thinking it is 77*, I figured if I was wiring to those leads anyway I might as well wire in the thermistor that is going to give the correct resistance as temps change.

edit....Never mind...just re-read and comprehension kicked in to understand it IS a 10k thermistor sensor.....
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Last edited by titleist1; August 10th, 2015 at 09:40.
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Old August 10th, 2015, 05:42   #20
jackcmorgan
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: newmarket, ontario
TDI(s): 2012 passat
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Hi,
Just did my adblue heater this weekend and wanted to pass along some tips.
First, the adblue repair kit price seems to have dropped significantly. I got it for $315 CDN from ta dealer here in ontario, canada so it should be much cheaper in the US!
Second, you don't have to remove the bumper. I ended up taking out the 4 screws along the wheel well and one plastic screw holding the lower black part of the bumper to the frame. This gave me some wiggle room to maneuver the tank out. The only difficult bolt to get out is the back right - i needed to use a flex socket adapter to get that one out. This is how the dealerships here in ontario do it as well. What i did was place a trolley jack under the tank to support it while removing the bolts, then used it to lower the tank. I had to lower it a certain amount and then slide towards the front of the car to get it out. I also disconnected all the wires and the fluid line located just in front of the spare tire well (don't use any tools on the fluid line - simply squeeze the plastic circlip with your fingers and then push in and out to remove the line). The car doesn't need to be jacked up at all if you're slim enough to wiggle under the car, but i'd recommend lifting the passenger side a little bit (but not so much that your jack can't reach the tank).
With the wires disconnected you can move the tank to a bench to work on it - much easier than trying to deal with it under the car. I recommend you remove as much of the fluid as possible to make it easier to get the tank back in. I simply poured the fluid out of the filler tube by tipping the tank and put it into a bucket to reuse (this is probably not recommended, but i was careful to keep it clean). I would also recommend wearing goggles so it doesn't splash into your eyes. A better method would be to use an evacuation pump of some sort, but i didn't have one on hand. You should also clean the dirt and dust off the tank so the tank doesn't get contaminated.
To remove the canister part of the heater assembly it needs to be rotated about 15 degrees (can't remember if it's clockwise or counter clockwise). This is tricky to do as there isn't much space to get your fingers in there. I ended up cutting the wires that run from the top of the heater into the canister on the old unit to give me some space.
My kit also came with two replacement large washers for the pump unit. There was one in a separate bag with the small washer for the pump, and there was one already included in the top of the heater assembly - make sure you don't use both!
The service manual recommends capping any DEF lines that you disconnect to prevent particles from entering the system - the kit comes with caps for this purpose - i didn't read this until after i was finished but it's probably a good idea.
It took me about 3 hours, taking my time. I could probably do it in 1.5 hours the second time around, but one hour as suggested by the original poster seems a little optimistic. (unless you have a lift and a friend to assist).
I think that about covers it. If you have any issues feel free to ask.
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Old August 10th, 2015, 05:47   #21
jackcmorgan
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Location: newmarket, ontario
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VWrussell View Post
Hello,
I recently had the Check Engine Light come on with the P205c/P205b fault codes. I did some extensive research because I did not want to spend $475 on a new part to fix this as my Passat just went out of warranty.
The failed temperature sensor is integrated inside the AD Blue Tank and you cannot change this sensor out at the component level. The part number that contains this sensor is 561-198-970.

This temp sensor monitors the temperature of the DEF fluid and if it drops below -11 Degrees Fahrenheit then it activates the heater inside this tank. Since I live in Texas I don't really have to worry about -11 degree temperatures here. There are two ways to fix this issue yourself if you do or do not live in a climate where the weather gets below -11.

before you start, purchase a 10k Ohm Resistor or Automotive grade 10k Ohm Submersible Thermistor, Solder, heatshrink.
Mouser Electronics or eBay are two places to find these components.

Once you have all your parts ready, Here are the steps to take:

Use the jack in your trunk to lift up the rear passenger side until the tire just barely comes off the ground.
Remove all the torx screws that are around the rear fender well.
There should be 5 of them if I'm not mistaken.
Pull out the plastic part of your lower bumper/quarter panel.
Just enough to give you a few extra inches for removing the tank.
The tank is held in place by 3 bolts, remove them and drop the tank down. (Be ready to catch it if it's full of DEF as it will be heavy)
Find the Wire harness that is secured to the filler neck of the tank.
Pins 3 & 4 are the temp sensor wires connected to the failed temp sensor inside the tank. They are purple/yellow and Brown and on the other side of the connector the wire colors are Black & White going into the tank.

Easy Fix option if you're lazy or live in a warm weather climate:

From the other side of the plug, cut the wires that are going into the tank (Black & White wires). Make sure to leave enough slack for the resistor or thermistor.
Solder & heatshrink a 10K ohm resistor or 10k OHM Thermistor to the cut wires still connected to the plug. Make sure that the connections are made back to the computer and not to the tank. Leave the wires from the tank cut off and just use some tape or heat shrink to protect them as they will never be used again.

For Cold Climate Areas:

Take a picture of the tank before you start, ensure you know the position of all the cables, hoses and top pump position.
Remove all the harness, Hoses and Pump from the Top of the tank.
Unscrew the Top of the tank and remove the rubber grommet and plastic circular housing from the tank. The circular housing is locked in, just twist it counter clock wise and it will become detached from the tank.
Find/trace the wires inside the tank that are associated with pins 3 & 4 on the outside of the tank.
Using a Submersible Automotive Grade 10k Ohm thermistor,
Solder/Heatshrink the thermistor to these wires and make sure the probe part of the thermistor is located in the small part of the tank with the other sensors. Some Drilling may be necessary.

As I live in Texas, I did not pursue or try the Cold Climate option I described above.
Also, as I was troubleshooting this issue, I actually drilled a small hole in the plastic and extended the wires so I could access them from my trunk when I was trying to figure out the correct resistor to use.

At the time I was not sure what resistor size to use. After trying different values. I borrowed a friends 2014 TDI and used my meter to find the value VW uses for this component.
The 10k Ohm Resistance reading is equal to 25 degrees Celsius or 77 degrees Fahrenheit. This resistance reading will make the computer think the DEF fluid is at this temperature.

In the pictures attached I show the connections to look for.
(See Links below)

If you don't want to drop the tank, another option is to cut the wires from the connector by the rear wheel and add the resistor or thermistor from there. It also uses pins 3 & 4 on one of the wire harnesses.


Once I added the 10K Ohm resistor, it took me about 4 days of everyday driving before my Check Engine Light went out. I'm not sure of the exact number but the computer needs to go through a certain number of "driving cycles" before it realizes the problem is fixed and the light goes off.


One more thing to note if your adblue tank is full, unplug the harness/hose and dump all the DEF fluid into a large clean container.
This will help out as its very hard to get the tank bolted back into position. Once the nearly empty tank is bolted back in place, just re-fill it as you normally would. I use the small Filler bottle from VW. I have a hole cut out in the bottom of it and use a funnel to re-fill that small bottle. Once its full I push the bottle down to let the DEF enter the tank. Repeat until your full....


I hope this post helps.
No sense in spending close to $500 when you can replace this with a resistor or thermistor that costs less than a dollar. (And an hour or two of your time)


~Russ

Pictures to help you:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2...h/IMG_2307.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2...h/IMG_2305.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2...h/IMG_2303.jpg
This will NOT work if you have P202x errors - just wanted to give everyone a heads up. Moderator, this post should go under another How To article.
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Old August 10th, 2015, 10:39   #22
stakeman
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Spring,Tx
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^^^^^^Actually I codedP202A code: Reductant Tank Heater Control Circuit. ^^^^^^^
I thought for the cost and time involved I'd try it on my issue because it relates to the tank heater and it worked for me. I was coding 202A/B and about a half a tank worth of driving after the install the CEL went out.
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Old August 23rd, 2015, 23:50   #23
Drnknmnky13
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So does part 561-198-970 come with the sensors also? I'm getting a P205C error. Which is sensor shorted to ground. It does sometimes get cold enough here that I don't want to fool the ECU. I'd rather have it work correctly.

Thanks in advance. guys. Great writeups.

EDIT: Yes, Yes it does. In case anyone else was wondering.
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Old August 30th, 2015, 14:57   #24
Drnknmnky13
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Be very careful when putting the reassembled tank back in. I busted the nipple on the control unit (which I believe is the same piece the OP broke). I'm guessing it wont be a cheap part. Probably more than the $375 the dealer would have charged me for the labor to do this entire install. Now I'm also out the use of my vehicle until I get the replacement, and install it. Hopefully without breaking it this time.







Edit: I'm going to try epoxying the plastic nipple back on. Maybe a JB plastic weld. It's such an easy piece to break...I wish they made it more serviceable.
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Old September 12th, 2015, 12:08   #25
DCSC
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Did anybody get the JB Weld to work on the broken nipple on the pump?

Dealer charges $425 wholesale for the pump "repair kit" , which is an entire new pump. ECS has the pump (listed as Toureg pump--same part # as the passat b7 TDi for $379).

Waiting an hour to see if JB Weld plastic will hold and I can avoid using the new pump I bought from the dealer.....


Part #'s: New pump : http://www.ecstuning.com/Search/Site...969/ES2179368/


or heater replacemnt kit: http://www.ecstuning.com/ES2845755/ $235.74
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Last edited by DCSC; September 12th, 2015 at 12:12.
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Old September 12th, 2015, 14:04   #26
DCSC
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Jb Weld didn't work for me, even the Marine kind.


WARNING: Pay attention to the orientation of the heater inside the tank. If rotated improperly, you'll keep breaking the nipple off of the pump.

Back to dealer for pump #2. Now I'm upside down in this project.
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Old September 12th, 2015, 19:17   #27
DCSC
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Don't be a dumb ass like I was. It is super easy to only pull the pass side bumper bolts and remove the tank. However, Spend the extra 10 minutes and take the time to pull the tail lights and the 3 lower bolts under the back of the rear bumper and the 5 other bumper bolts on the opposite side you are working on. You'll have clear vision to place the tank back where you want it, zero resistance and struggle.

Also, look for the super small arrow to clock the heater correctly so that your pump nozzle is aligned properly ( I took a photo of mine and matched it, but mine apparently had been out before).

You can do this in your sleep with these simple steps.





Otherwise, you can buy a new pump repair kit like I did and break it. Then you can buy a second pump, pull the bumper and be done in 10 minutes.
That nozzle is simple fragile, but no big deal if aligned properly and no bumper to wrestle with.
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Last edited by BKmetz; January 4th, 2016 at 23:01. Reason: resized photo
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Old September 13th, 2015, 20:53   #28
Drnknmnky13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DCSC View Post
Did anybody get the JB Weld to work on the broken nipple on the pump?

Dealer charges $425 wholesale for the pump "repair kit" , which is an entire new pump. ECS has the pump (listed as Toureg pump--same part # as the passat b7 TDi for $379).

Waiting an hour to see if JB Weld plastic will hold and I can avoid using the new pump I bought from the dealer.....


Part #'s: New pump : http://www.ecstuning.com/Search/Site...969/ES2179368/


or heater replacemnt kit: http://www.ecstuning.com/ES2845755/ $235.74
That's a GREAT price on the heater replacement kit. That's the cheapest I've seen. That's over half off of ID part's price

It looks like that nipple piece is glued or epoxyed in. I wonder if you could contact the manufacturer and get just the nipple. Drill the old one out and put the super cheap plastic piece in. Saving yourself the $350.
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Old September 23rd, 2015, 11:57   #29
clindt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DCSC View Post
Did anybody get the JB Weld to work on the broken nipple on the pump?

Dealer charges $425 wholesale for the pump "repair kit" , which is an entire new pump. ECS has the pump (listed as Toureg pump--same part # as the passat b7 TDi for $379).

Waiting an hour to see if JB Weld plastic will hold and I can avoid using the new pump I bought from the dealer.....


Part #'s: New pump : http://www.ecstuning.com/Search/Site...969/ES2179368/


or heater replacemnt kit: http://www.ecstuning.com/ES2845755/ $235.74

Will that heater replacement kit work in the Passat? The part numbers are different.
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Old September 23rd, 2015, 21:54   #30
Drnknmnky13
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[QUOTE=clindt;4896679]Will that heater replacement kit work in the Passat? The part numbers are different.[/QUOTE

According to the ECS site the part number above is for the TDI Touareg.

The picture looks dead on like the part for the passat. I'm guessing they are similar, but just different enough. I don't have a touareg so don't know for sure.

It's a great price though if it does fit.
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