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Go Back   TDIClub Forums > TDI Model Specific Discussions Areas > VW Passat Family (NMS and B7) TDIs (2012+)

VW Passat Family (NMS and B7) TDIs (2012+) Discussion area for the 2012+ Passat TDI (North American and rest of world versions versions). The North American model was previously codenamed NMS (New Midsize Sedan) and the version the rest of the world gets is sometimes referred to as B7.

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Old September 30th, 2013, 14:14   #31
Rico567
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Our 510 is completely usable (as updated to v. 4366 per LW). While the unit certainly doesn't respond instantly, it's more than adequate. Some time may be required to familiarize oneself with the touch screen.
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Old September 30th, 2013, 18:52   #32
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Yes, I agree with some here that the new firmware 4366 and map 7963 are a significant improvement over what was delivered with the 2013 Passat TDI SEL. (3696 and 7860)

I also agree there still is room for improvement, hence the subject on this post.

VWoA said this morning that they are aware that owners are having system response delays and issues with the RNS-510. They are especially aware of what I complained about, even with 4366 where the back-up camera often displays the image after I've shifted into Drive to begin my forward motion.

The agent promised me they are working on an improvement for our units. Let's hope it comes out soon. Wouldn’t that be great if they announce a voluntary recall and upgrade us all to hardware version k, and 4396 firmware!

Sadly the woman I spoke to didn't know anything about the V5.2 Map DVDs shipping out to 2013 owners.

She did insist that V6 maps have been available since July. I disagreed, and she said not on the VW parts and accessories page, but direct from NAVTEQ. My local dealer also doesn't have new maps available, and even the NAVTEQ site directs you through a couple other links to the VW page on navigation.com which still indicates we have the latest...

A huge thanks, again, to LokiWolf for helping us make things better! It wasn't that long ago when my biggest concern was limited availability of D2 petro-diesel in Illinois... Thinking I may have voided my warranty was much more troubling than the radio issues.
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Old September 30th, 2013, 19:18   #33
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Originally Posted by eshawger View Post
They are especially aware of what I complained about, even with 4366 where the back-up camera often displays the image after I've shifted into Drive to begin my forward motion.
That is intentional. There is about a 10-15 second delay when you switch to D. It is just in case you are going to click back into R. There is a speed threshold, that ends that delay instantly. Can't remember if it is 5 or 10MPH.


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Old September 30th, 2013, 19:24   #34
eshawger
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That is intentional. There is about a 10-15 second delay when you switch to D. It is just in case you are going to click back into R. There is a speed threshold, that ends that delay instantly. Can't remember if it is 5 or 10MPH.


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Sorry, meant to be more clear. The image doesn't display until about the time I shift into Drive, and it didn't help me back up at all. Yes, when I hit that magic speed the doors lock and the camera turns off and I am back to the normal radio display.
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Old October 1st, 2013, 04:23   #35
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Fine. I actually posted here not about the poor behavior of the RNS510, but about the issues with the "improvement" DVD install process to begin with. That process (after 2 hours) did not successfully complete.
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It is 7.6GB of data to be removed and added back to a relatively slow HDD. It takes a while. Yes, VW failed to mention the ammount of time it would take, or details as to why it was needed. Hence this thread. There are also 2 seperate threads in this section of TDIClub alone discussing the 510, and the 2 most recent of which directly discuss the V5.2(7994) Map Update Disc. I am truly sorry you did not see them, because if you had seen them and read them before your update, you would have been more informed.
This is interesting in the sense that I know VW has documented it. When I purchased my v5 map update a few months ago and read the manual on how to do the update it specifically said that the update process could take 1.5 - 3 hours to complete. I loaded mine on my way into work, starting as I left home, and it took about 2 hours for the update to finish just before arriving at the office. The manual also said that if you stop the update it is supposed to restart where it left off when you start it again.
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Old October 1st, 2013, 10:14   #36
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OK, an update and a few corrections, or clarifications.....

The V5.2M update I received directly from VW included a separate color printed 8.5x11 installation sheet. It did not have any indication of anticipated time length for the update, though it did indicate that if you shut the car down before completion, the installation would resume when you restarted the vehicle. For the record, the update did NOT complete, and for the record, it did NOT resume when the vehicle was restarted. As for 7.6GB being removed and added back to a relatively slow HD, I'm calling BS a bit. Not that LokiWolf is wrong, but that it's simply a weak explanation. Heck, even a drive with the extremely poor performance of an old RLL or MFM drive (we're talking decades old) should be able to handle data transfer FAR FAR FAR FAR FAR in excess of well over two hours.

I apologize in that my search on this forum for whatever reason did not pick up those other threads, as I did search for the V5.2M update. Even beyond that, however, I also think it's simply poor execution on Conti/VW's part. As a very senior tech professional, I find this entire issue to be crazy in 2013.

I dropped the car off at the dealer (who now agrees with my assessment and plans frankly to buy the car back if the update does not significantly improve the situation) yesterday evening. Before doing so, I checked and yes, I am running version 3696 (bought car at beginning of August). Left the DVD package with them, and even they were scratching their head about VW.

I would also echo the backup camera. When I start the car in the morning, it simply takes so long to activate that I'm already driving down the street before it would ever start working - just like what eshawger said. Meaning, open the garage door, get in car, start car, buckle seat belt, check behind me, back out, close garage door, and still no backup camera. That is entirely typical of every single time I start the car after not driving it for more than an hour.

I'm not sure what firmware version the V5.2M disk will result in. As for as getting used to the touch interface, please note that I've not complained about "general usability nuisance" issues such as what was mentioned about having to go through screens of favorites, etc. Only core functionality gaps. In my case, the most absolutely critical functionality (beyond simply locking up) is the fact that the touch screen for phone dialing is effectively unusable. Delays (per digit entry) are often 1-3 seconds per touch. This makes the device absolutely and totally broken for things like passcodes and conference bridges - which are incredibly important to me. As it stands, I must always initiate conference calls from my handset at this point - which is totally useless and voids the safety and convenience factor that I've enjoyed since 2000 with my other vehicles.

I appreciate the information here, but I also think that it's inappropriate to not consider the realities of the situation, as every forum and public venue becomes data points for companies such as VW to use in making product decisions. I'm a huge fan of the engineering that VW put into the TDI "mechanics" and give them great credit, but on the other hand, that in no way gives them a free pass for the obvious and deplorable behavior surrounding the RNS510. Honestly, I didn't even know what an RNS510 was before I bought the car as my expectations and requirements are fairly low, general and have been satisfied by every other large manufacturer for more than a decade. It is not reasonable to support Volkswagen in expecting people seek out forums such as this prior to every purchase in order to find pertinent information about features of their vehicles - that they are advertising.
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Old October 1st, 2013, 10:36   #37
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How do I find out what version my Nav is running? Thanks in advance.
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Old October 1st, 2013, 10:44   #38
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Well, it's certainly obvious that the functions of the RNS-510 are more important to some than to others. For myself, I'm not entirely clear from the OP whether or not I'd benefit from the 5.2 update I suddenly received in the mail yesterday. So far, I'm thinking - no.
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Old October 1st, 2013, 11:08   #39
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Well, it's certainly obvious that the functions of the RNS-510 are more important to some than to others. For myself, I'm not entirely clear from the OP whether or not I'd benefit from the 5.2 update I suddenly received in the mail yesterday. So far, I'm thinking - no.
If you have Map V6(7963), doing the V5.2(7994) will actually put older map data on your Nav. I am pretty sure I can't make it any clearer than that.


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Old October 1st, 2013, 11:10   #40
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How do I find out what version my Nav is running? Thanks in advance.
Press and hold setup until you get a second menu. Press device info. You are looking for firmware version, and map version.


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Old October 1st, 2013, 11:48   #41
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Originally Posted by wmhjr View Post
...As for 7.6GB being removed and added back to a relatively slow HD, I'm calling BS a bit. Not that LokiWolf is wrong, but that it's simply a weak explanation. Heck, even a drive with the extremely poor performance of an old RLL or MFM drive (we're talking decades old) should be able to handle data transfer FAR FAR FAR FAR FAR in excess of well over two hours.
One thing that does impact this performance is that your navi is running while trying to load the data. So the system is not only deleting the data, adding the new but also accessing the DVD to show map information at the same time. Sitting still shouldn't impact this as much, but you never know.

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I would also echo the backup camera. When I start the car in the morning, it simply takes so long to activate that I'm already driving down the street before it would ever start working - just like what eshawger said. Meaning, open the garage door, get in car, start car, buckle seat belt, check behind me, back out, close garage door, and still no backup camera. That is entirely typical of every single time I start the car after not driving it for more than an hour.
I remember seeing a couple comments on this on the site. First, getting and installing LokiWolf's latest firmware will speed up the camera. The second option was to make sure and unlock your car with the FOB prior to getting in. I know you are in a garage but others have experienced that using the FOB to unlock the car seems to start the radio booting up prior to the car starting so the backup camera comes on much faster.
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Old October 1st, 2013, 12:01   #42
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Originally Posted by wmhjr View Post
As for 7.6GB being removed and added back to a relatively slow HD, I'm calling BS a bit. Not that LokiWolf is wrong, but that it's simply a weak explanation. Heck, even a drive with the extremely poor performance of an old RLL or MFM drive (we're talking decades old) should be able to handle data transfer FAR FAR FAR FAR FAR in excess of well over two hours.
It is actually about 3 times that when on the actual RNS510 drive. THe 7.6GB is the compressed size. Part of the delay is the uncompression. I don't disagree it is slow, but it is what it is. I am not saying you should not complain to VW, I am simply here to help you with what I know and can offer.

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I apologize in that my search on this forum for whatever reason did not pick up those other threads, as I did search for the V5.2M update.
Sorry your searches failed.

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Originally Posted by wmhjr View Post
I dropped the car off at the dealer (who now agrees with my assessment and plans frankly to buy the car back if the update does not significantly improve the situation) yesterday evening. Before doing so, I checked and yes, I am running version 3696 (bought car at beginning of August). Left the DVD package with them, and even they were scratching their head about VW.
One more time. The 5.2 DVD is NOT a firmware update. It is a Map update. 4366 is the current firmware for the D-J units, and I know of only 1 dealer that has it, the one I use, because I gave it to them. The firmware is what improves responsiveness.

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I'm not sure what firmware version the V5.2M disk will result in.
It is NOT a firmware update disc, it is a map disc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wmhjr View Post
I appreciate the information here, but I also think that it's inappropriate to not consider the realities of the situation, as every forum and public venue becomes data points for companies such as VW to use in making product decisions.
We have considered them, and moved on. Again, this is NOT to become a complaint thread.

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Originally Posted by wmhjr View Post
I'm a huge fan of the engineering that VW put into the TDI "mechanics" and give them great credit, but on the other hand, that in no way gives them a free pass for the obvious and deplorable behavior surrounding the RNS510. Honestly, I didn't even know what an RNS510 was before I bought the car as my expectations and requirements are fairly low, general and have been satisfied by every other large manufacturer for more than a decade. It is not reasonable to support Volkswagen in expecting people seek out forums such as this prior to every purchase in order to find pertinent information about features of their vehicles - that they are advertising.
I came here and did A LOT of reading before I bought mine. Sorry you did not. The TDI motor alone makes my car worth owning. Since I am stuck with the 510, or pay out the nose for a replacement. I know my dealer has their hands tied, so I went looking for my own resolutions, and I have shared that info with the forums and my dealer.
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Old October 1st, 2013, 12:11   #43
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I appreciate your response, LokiWolf. BTW, I am excruciatingly familiar with what a firmware update is as opposed to a map update. I started an IT career a long time ago, with my first network certs back in the days of ArcNet and Token Ring. Now I run a very very large enterprise. What I was NOT familiar with is what the V5.2M disk was. It is not clearly labeled as either, and I had no idea what was on it. From what you're saying, it's just a map update - which will essentially give me back a unit pretty much like I dropped off. It will apparently NOT update my firmware. Even my searches today on this site are not terrible clear about that but it's what I'm finding.

Based on this, I'll likely be giving the Passat back to VW and getting my money back. I love the TDI, but spend too much time working and that handsfree functionality is simply a critical variable for me - not to mention a state law in many states at this point. Not being able to reliably use that is honestly a deal breaker. I mean, really - this is basic functionality. Shouldn't be a question in this day and age. My impression here is that I'll get the car back with the same 3696 firmware, and the dealer will not be able to change that. I could go outside of VW and the dealer network, but then I've got warranty issues should they still have issues. So, I guess I'm out of luck. Never thought I needed to investigate whether a car could reliably and with reasonable performance handle phone calls. Guess I've been spoiled for the past 13 years.
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Old October 1st, 2013, 12:20   #44
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Originally Posted by TheGrove View Post
One thing that does impact this performance is that your navi is running while trying to load the data. So the system is not only deleting the data, adding the new but also accessing the DVD to show map information at the same time. Sitting still shouldn't impact this as much, but you never know.



I remember seeing a couple comments on this on the site. First, getting and installing LokiWolf's latest firmware will speed up the camera. The second option was to make sure and unlock your car with the FOB prior to getting in. I know you are in a garage but others have experienced that using the FOB to unlock the car seems to start the radio booting up prior to the car starting so the backup camera comes on much faster.
I agree with both comments, but seriously, 3 hours? Really? I know (as Loki mentioned elsewhere) that the data is compressed, but really? I mean REALLY?????? What are they using? Some sort of Compusere or Prodigy technology? Only somewhat jesting.

For the unlock, I don't lock the car at my location. Ever. And while I seriously and really REALLY applaud all the work Loki has done, I'm not comfortable putting a firmware version on outside of warranty considering that I'm very possibly returning the car. I want zero chances of VW trying to say I've done anything wrong whatsoever. If I had owned the car for a year or so and there was no chance of this, then I'd go for the firmware update because after all, the unit is crap as is. However right now I need to stay the course without modifying the unit outside of VW. I am seriously curious as to why VW would decline from making the newer firmware versions available to customers who are clearly suffering from performance issues.

I'll also say that while I REALLY appreciate what LokiWolf is doing, the fact that VW is even making this necessary is despicable, and every person who owns a 510 should feel obligated to call and complain - repeatedly. Perhaps THAT kind of response would put more pressure on them.
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Old October 1st, 2013, 14:54   #45
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For what it's worth, mine got the new FW within 5 days of purchase, and I never looked back. I'm not certain, but I recall LokiWolf saying that he also has the old stuff, so you could always roll back if needed.

Considering that this is not a 'hard' or irreversible change, I don't consider warranty issues of much significance. If all else fails, perhaps another member with the new FW could let you try thiers before you make a decision.

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