I’m in a pickle. I need help!!

nickthepick4

Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Location
New York
TDI
97 B4 Passat
I recently had a crack form on my 1997 Passat ignition pump case . And then I found out that the timing belt was moments from breaking, luckily it broke as soon as I pulled into the mechanic. Then I found out that the water pump was shot.

At this point in the car I have a little under in the car then what it’s worth, it has 77,000 miles. I’m contemplating selling that car because it was sitting for 4 years before I started driving the a year ago and a lot of issues are popping up now. Should I sell the car and avoid these issues or keep the car because I know the car has a lot of life left.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Mongler98

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 23, 2011
Location
COLORADO (SE of Denver)
TDI
98 Jetta TDI AHU 1.9L (944 TDI swap in progress) I moved so now i got nothing but an AHU in a garage on a pallet.
If taken care of, normal maintenance and on time, will go for 350K easily and 450K is not unreasonable for a goal with minimal work.
The issue here is not miles, its time. Your timing belt broke due to age, not miles. Its either 5 years or service miles, whatever comes first.
Keep up on it and keep it or face the reality that you wont care for it and sell it.
 

garciapiano

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2018
Location
Southern California
TDI
1997 Jetta TDI (1Z)
These cars don’t respond well to neglect. I’m not going to talk you into dumping thousands into a 20+ year old car, so it’s up to you if you want to salvage it. It might sound like you have a lot of issues but honestly, this stuff is relatively straightforward to fix, aside from the injection pump. But first, think about the cost of your time. If you are not up to working on it yourself, the cost of labor is going to rule out any cost savings of a TDI.

If you continue, do so in a systematic fashion. First things first, dont drive the car until you get these issues diagnosed. What is “shot” on the water pump?

Where is the crack on the pump case? Are you sure it is a crack and not just a leaking seal? I would consider it very abnormal for one of those to crack. If it is on the top of the pump, you are in luck as those parts are replaceable. If elsewhere, I would consider seeking professional help as you need to know what you’re doing to remove/replace the pump.
 
Last edited:

nickthepick4

Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Location
New York
TDI
97 B4 Passat
The shaft in the water pump is wobbly and I have no idea where the leak is on the ignition pump.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

garciapiano

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2018
Location
Southern California
TDI
1997 Jetta TDI (1Z)
The shaft in the water pump is wobbly and I have no idea where the leak is on the ignition pump.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Well, first you need to find out if your engine will even still run after having the timing belt break. When that happens while your engine is running, it is most likely that you bent a valve and the head will need to come off, at the very least.
 

nickthepick4

Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Location
New York
TDI
97 B4 Passat
The engine was not running while the belt broke, I pulled it into the mechanic and he was checking it and it broke. Luckily, he caught it just in time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

jackfolstam

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 14, 2016
Location
CA
TDI
MkI Rabbit ALH swap
Good catch by the mechanic. The water pump isn't that hard to replace, same design since 1975 I think. Just spend the extra $10 and get the nice gasket. The timing belt is pretty easy too. For the water pump my one mistake is accidentally pushing the T bolt out for the belt cover and not knowing it.

Thing is if the car hadn't been driving for a while I'd think about the gaskets; they might be brittle from not being lubricated and leak soon. While changing the timing belt you could also change the intermediate shaft gaskets (pretty easy), camshaft seal (no brainer) and the main seal (pretty involved but best time to replace with timing belt, so next best time is during next timing belt change (60,000m?)).


And does your mechanic have the proper OBDII tool to check and set the timing? Has your mechanic done a timing belt on a similar car before?
 
Last edited:

KLXD

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 22, 2009
Location
Lompoc, CA
TDI
'98, '2 Jettas
Never heard of an injector pump case cracking either. Is that your assumption due to the leak? That was sort of asked but you didn't answer.

How was the guy turning the engine when it broke? Maybe a wrench on the cam or pump? Bad practice but it still shouldn't have broken.

If it was running ok when shut down and the belt indeed broke when he was turning it by hand no internal damage should have been done.

A belt an water pump should cost under 1k. Is it worth it to have a running vehicle for that? I'd think so unless it's in really bad shape.

I wouldn't look at what you have in it and say another thousand puts it over what it's worth. At this point it's scrap. You can have decent vehicle for the price of the fix.
 
Last edited:

nickthepick4

Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Location
New York
TDI
97 B4 Passat
No, my mechanic told me about it after he replaced the seals for the pump. He said that the repair to replace the pump isn’t worth it. I have no idea how he was turning it. I can imagine not to harshly or anything bad because the last time the belt was changed was almost 5 years ago and same with the water pump. The engine was running fine before it shutdown.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

KLXD

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 22, 2009
Location
Lompoc, CA
TDI
'98, '2 Jettas
But the water pump isn't driven by the timing belt.

Does sound fish about it happening to break when it did but it sounds fishy that it would happen to break just while running.

I'm sticking with the theory that he was using a wrench on the cam to turn it. That puts a big load on the belt turning the crank at 2:1 against compression.
 

nickthepick4

Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Location
New York
TDI
97 B4 Passat
The belt broke because my dad changed it at 66,000 then the car sat for 5 years after that. My mechanic told me that in his 52 years as a mechanic, that’s the first time he has seen an ignition pump crack.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

KLXD

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 22, 2009
Location
Lompoc, CA
TDI
'98, '2 Jettas
My mistake, doing multitask stuff at work. Regardless of how the timing belt failed the rest of what I said is still valid. A wrench on the cam would likely snap the snout off, eh?

If it failed while running you're right about the valves. You say it did, he says it didn't. We're getting this second hand.

Turning the engine using the cam won't hurt the cam a bit but it puts a greater load on the belt than it was designed for. It's there to turn the pump and cam at half crankshaft speed not to rotate the crank against compression at twice the speed you're turning the wrench.

If you do it, watch the tensioner as compression builds. You'll see it give due to the added tension. Might even slip. I know the instructions on this site recommend it but that doesn't make it a good practice.

A five year old belt shouldn't have snapped.
 

KLXD

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 22, 2009
Location
Lompoc, CA
TDI
'98, '2 Jettas
Nick, you're still saying the pump cracked. I've never heard of it happening either. I'm cornfused.

If it was cracked why did he replace seals on a busted pump?

If it was just leaky seals that's very common but why the talk of a crack?

If it cracked after he replaced seals he did something wrong.

If it was the plunger inside that cracked that is not unheard of when someone tries to change the head seal on the pump and screws up.
 

nickthepick4

Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Location
New York
TDI
97 B4 Passat
We originally thought the seals were the problem, so he replaced the seals. It was still leaking after he replaced the seals. So we replaced the pump all together


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Top