Anyone gone from a TDI to a TSI?

Finally headed toward my buyback date (2015 Golf TDI) and I'm still waffling on my replacement vehicle. I'm definitely going new (want the 6 year warranty) and the debate is between the 2018 Golf SE or a 2018 GTI SE.

Test drove the Golf and it was nice, but of course the GTI had more zip ~ felt more like what I'm used to from my current drive. Bottom line cost between the two is a hefty chunk of change and much as I'd love the GTI, I don't know that I can justify it. I just wonder if moving from my TDI to a TSI is going to feel like a significant step down. Any voices of experience? Thank you!

~ Colleen

jplrk said:

Finally headed toward my buyback date (2015 Golf TDI) and I'm still waffling on my replacement vehicle. I'm definitely going new (want the 6 year warranty) and the debate is between the 2018 Golf SE or a 2018 GTI SE.

Test drove the Golf and it was nice, but of course the GTI had more zip ~ felt more like what I'm used to from my current drive. Bottom line cost between the two is a hefty chunk of change and much as I'd love the GTI, I don't know that I can justify it. I just wonder if moving from my TDI to a TSI is going to feel like a significant step down. Any voices of experience? Thank you!

Click to expand...

I just got a 2017 Passat TSI SE to replace my Jetta TDI. Haven't driven it much, but yes, there's a noticeable difference. But most of the difference is between 0 - 15 mph. The TSI is actually faster 0-60, but it doesn't start pulling until it gets rolling a little. The TDI jumps off the line.



All in all, I think I'll get used to it quickly.

If all you're looking for is more power, get the Golf. It can be tuned if you want more power.

If you want better handling, better brakes and more power, get the GTI if you can swing it. I'd even look for a used 2016-2017 GTI.

After my buy back (09 Jetta) I bought a 2016 Golf 1.8T TSI SEL. two years ago. It was a cpo with 7500 miles on it I am satisfied with peppy engine. Have about 25000 miles on it now

Thanks for the replies so far. Goes without saying that I'd like better handling & brakes in addition to power. Just a matter of anteing up another seven grand for it.

I'm kinda sorta wishing I'd never had my TDI: you don't miss what you don't know, and all that jazz. But it sounds like the TSI is worthy in its own right and I imagine (hope) I'd adjust to it in short order.

Just wish the Golf came in Dark Iron Blue. Once I saw one in person, I was smitten. Not that car color is the be-all, end-all. Just sayin', lol...

~ C.

I went with a 2017 Passat SE TSI. I wasn't a fan of it.. we still have the car, but I told my wife to keep it, then went and got a 2015 Passat TDI SEL.


It’s much faster off the line, but it’s hard to get good mpg’s, unless you truly baby it. My worst tank of having a lead foot is still probably better than my best tank on the TSI.

The 2017 TSI does have a lot more safety features.

Keep your diesel. Seriously, the EA888 gas engines are not good in the long run. Our shop is always dealing with them. There isn't a day that goes by that I do not have at least one of those turds here with something wrong with it.

I might consider the 1.4L turbo gas as an alternative. At least it avoids much of the junky parts the 1.8L and 2.0L engines have. And it seems to be reasonably frugal, too. Supposed to be available in the Golf in 2019.

Tsi

We sold our GTI and bought an '18 Golf TSI and love it. It has good power, cornering and gets low 30s. For today's poor roads I like the suspension and the dual-clutch trans is super. I have been looking at the software upgrade for more power, but love the car even as it is. I'm not a fan of all the complex driver controls.

oilhammer said:

Keep your diesel. Seriously, the EA888 gas engines are not good in the long run. Our shop is always dealing with them. There isn't a day that goes by that I do not have at least one of those turds here with something wrong with it.

I might consider the 1.4L turbo gas as an alternative. At least it avoids much of the junky parts the 1.8L and 2.0L engines have. And it seems to be reasonably frugal, too. Supposed to be available in the Golf in 2019.

Click to expand...

LALALALALALAL all those issues were solved in EA888.3!!!

<puts his head in the sand>

I wish that were true, but I've already sent about five of these back to the dealer for water pumps leaking under warranty at their 20k service.

It's crazy. I mean, I know Volkswagen was late to the whole water cooling thing, but sheesh... it's been 45 years or so. A water pump shouldn't be that big of a challenge.

And technically it isn't the water pump itself, but the housing, that they insist on making out of that phenolic plastic polymer whatever the heck it is. It distorts, then no longer can hold the rubber seal in place, and the seal just herniates right out the side of it. They all fail the exact same way. And it isn't like they don't know about it. They cannot possibly NOT know about it.

Oh, and after a welcome absence, they've brought back one of the best MIL contributors of all VAGdom: SECONDARY AIR INJECTION! The result of TSBs already, and lots of empty wallets over the years! $700 air pump! Yep! $300 combi-valve! You betcha! Buried it some hard to get at location? Well of course, why not?

And now, coming to you this past couple years: CHRONIC EVAPORATIVE EMISSIONS SYSTEM FAILURES! You know it's bad when the dealer STOCKS three of the leak detection pumps, and when you call to get one, they tell you they've already used them all that day. Have to keep one of those here on the shelf now.

Good news is, they finally issued a recall for the rando-fail fuel pump control modules. Because, you know, people just do not like their cars randomly stalling for no reason in the middle of the road.

jplrk said:

Finally headed toward my buyback date (2015 Golf TDI) and I'm still waffling on my replacement vehicle. I'm definitely going new (want the 6 year warranty) and the debate is between the 2018 Golf SE or a 2018 GTI SE.
Test drove the Golf and it was nice, but of course the GTI had more zip ~ felt more like what I'm used to from my current drive. Bottom line cost between the two is a hefty chunk of change and much as I'd love the GTI, I don't know that I can justify it. I just wonder if moving from my TDI to a TSI is going to feel like a significant step down. Any voices of experience? Thank you!
~ Colleen

Click to expand...

Prob the biggest thing you'll notice is the lack of DSG on the Golf where the GTI has it. That torque converter is somewhat deceiving in power delivery.

Biggest thing I had to get used to is the double downshifts on our Alltrack (DSG), it loves to get to 1100-1300 rpms on the flat ground at speeds between 30-45, but soon as the 1.8t meets a hill, it grabs two gears and needs to be 2-2,500rpm to make it up. If you're in rolling hills, that DSG is shiftier than a coke head at a policeman's ball.

I would second looking at a an '18 (with the 6 yr warranty) as it'll be the last year of the 1.8t for the standard golf.

As for GTI vs Golf, the GTI S has larger brakes maybe stiffer springs and sways. But, beyond that they are pretty darn close and any go fast/handling bits of the GTI can slide onto the Golf, think GTI take offs (except front struts as the GTI has 55mm vs Golf 50mm).

oilhammer said:

I wish that were true, but I've already sent about five of these back to the dealer for water pumps leaking under warranty at their 20k service.
It's crazy. I mean, I know Volkswagen was late to the whole water cooling thing, but sheesh... it's been 45 years or so. A water pump shouldn't be that big of a challenge.

Click to expand...

wheeew, I'm at 23K glad I dodged that bullet

I've got a 1.4. Sadly lacking in low end even compared to my '98. It's much better once it get rolling, though.

Maybe would be less noticeable with the auto?

I've driven both manual and automatic Jetta 1.4L, I'd take the manual any day, and I am not saying that just because I prefer manual transmissions. It just seems much more able to keep the engine in its happy RPM range. The automatics are, as you'd expect, far too upshift happy which means they have to downshift constantly if any sort of load (like a bug hitting the windshield) is placed upon them.

The 1.4L won't win any races, but for those of us that drive hundreds of thousands of miles in 90hp ALHs, we wonder why a car like a Golf would ever need a "standard" 170hp 1.8L engine anyway.

But for me, durability and longevity trump tire smoking performance any day anyway. Nothing looks impressive on a tow truck.

If they have decided we are forbidden from having any diesels ever again, the 1.4L is at least pretty close to the old VE and PDs, and plenty adequate for most people.

Don't the 2.0 TSI engines also get you a pretty much guaranteed carbon cleaning bill every 50k miles or so as well? I dumped my 2012 GTI in part because the engine just seemed to fragile. Timing chain tensioners, intake issues, water pumps, etc. I decided that I didn't feel like owning one out of those engines out of warranty. But it gave me zero problems in the year that I owned it and I had a blast driving it!

That 1.4 TSI engine is great. If I were to get a Jetta I would get one with the 1.4 engine. It’s not the quickest but it can still get up and go. I could also get great mileage with it when I had it as a rental. I was able to get 42 mpg going 80mph on the interstate with about 30 minutes in stop and go traffic. I really liked that engine. It’s too bad the Jetta is a bit small for my needs, otherwise I would probably get one and that would be an engine that might make me not miss my TDI.

KITEWAGON said:

Don't the 2.0 TSI engines also get you a pretty much guaranteed carbon cleaning bill every 50k miles or so as well? I dumped my 2012 GTI in part because the engine just seemed to fragile. Timing chain tensioners, intake issues, water pumps, etc. I decided that I didn't feel like owning one out of those engines out of warranty. But it gave me zero problems in the year that I owned it and I had a blast driving it!

Click to expand...

Yes, intake port gunking is a chronic problem. And VAG engines seem several orders of magnitude worse than any other brand I know of, even though any GDI engine can get this way.

What sucks is, the newer EA888 engines already have the intake runners made for a port injected fuel rail. Even if they were not going to run dual injection, it would be nice to have easily accessible ports for a decarb tool. Because the normal process doesn't seem to be very effective, and you end up having to R&R the intake anyway. Which on these, in itself is a pain, due to the way the injectors want to stick in the head (the are supposed to slide out with the rail, intake, harness, etc. in one nice neat chunk... they rarely ever do, and I should know, I've had about 1000 of the damn things off...).

The rear main seal is the other biblical example of dumbassery in design. Seriously, Volkswagen should find that guy, and beat him senseless.

In today's world who makes a reliable drive train? Some day I may need another car.

Keeping the diesel is off the table; already made that decision. Leaning right now toward the Golf, even though it feels a little "meh" compared to my TDI (and the GTI). Price tag between the two is just too big to ignore, though. Btw this is an automatic. Loved driving a manual years ago. Now, not so much ~ especially when traversing the traffic nightmare that is the Puget Sound corridor.

~ Colleen

jplrk said:

Keeping the diesel is off the table; already made that decision. Leaning right now toward the Golf, even though it feels a little "meh" compared to my TDI (and the GTI). Price tag between the two is just too big to ignore, though. Btw this is an automatic. Loved driving a manual years ago. Now, not so much ~ especially when traversing the traffic nightmare that is the Puget Sound corridor.
~ Colleen

Click to expand...

I'm in the same situation. Turning in my 12 Golf with 125k in December for ~$21k and looking at a 2016 Golf TSI 1.8T. I liked it. Not as much as my TDI but I think that was more transmission than engine. You just need to remap your driving habits to use revs over torque. I use the paddle shifters all the time which helps. My DSG is my first auto and I miss my manuals but not during my long, traffic heavy commute. I will also miss the 500+ miles per tank of fuel. Another advantage of the 1.8T over the 2.0T in the GTI is regular gas in the 1.8T vs. premium for the GTI. You can make up some of the difference from the TDI mileage there.
Good luck!

cyclopropene said:

I'm in the same situation. Turning in my 12 Golf with 125k in December for ~$21k and looking at a 2016 Golf TSI 1.8T. I liked it. Not as much as my TDI but I think that was more transmission than engine. You just need to remap your driving habits to use revs over torque. I use the paddle shifters all the time which helps. My DSG is my first auto and I miss my manuals but not during my long, traffic heavy commute. I will also miss the 500+ miles per tank of fuel. Another advantage of the 1.8T over the 2.0T in the GTI is regular gas in the 1.8T vs. premium for the GTI. You can make up some of the difference from the TDI mileage there.
Good luck!

Click to expand...

Thanks! I'll be curious to know what you end up with. Given my indecision, I pushed my buyback date out another few weeks. If nothing else, it'll save me from putting a couple of 500+ mile-drives this month on my new wheels.
~ Colleen

LOL Oilhammer! Good posting karma to you today.

truman said:

In today's world who makes a reliable drive train? Some day I may need another car.

Click to expand...

Toyota still does.

The Nissan Leaf has been fantastic since they fixed the early battery problems. Lots of people also swear by the Chevy Volt.

We have a ton of Ford hybrids in our fleet, and they have been great.

flargabarg said:

Toyota still does.
The Nissan Leaf has been fantastic since they fixed the early battery problems. Lots of people also swear by the Chevy Volt.
We have a ton of Ford hybrids in our fleet, and they have been great.

Click to expand...

Yes, Toyota's GR V6 is great:





Always fun when the steel sleeve slides down the aluminum block and gets romantic with the crankshaft. That makes a neat sound, let me tell ya.

Fantastic!

Anyone else wanna chime in on the question at hand?

KITEWAGON said:

Don't the 2.0 TSI engines also get you a pretty much guaranteed carbon cleaning bill every 50k miles or so as well? I dumped my 2012 GTI in part because the engine just seemed to fragile. Timing chain tensioners, intake issues, water pumps, etc. I decided that I didn't feel like owning one out of those engines out of warranty. But it gave me zero problems in the year that I owned it and I had a blast driving it!

Click to expand...

As for carbon build up same thing could be said with TDIs, how many AHLs needed the blow torch method of decarboning up EGR valves? VW improved the design and how much intake gunk is there on CR TDIs?

IMHO the jury is out on the EA888 gen 3 and carbon cleaning but compared to a gen2 they seem to be an improvement. I'm hoping to get to 100K before I have to worry about it, and I'll gladly eat my words if I need it before then.

oilhammer said:

Yes, Toyota's GR V6 is great:


Always fun when the steel sleeve slides down the aluminum block and gets romantic with the crankshaft. That makes a neat sound, let me tell ya.
Fantastic!

Click to expand...

At least you didn't disagree with me about Ford!

I swapped my 2009 TDI JSW for an end of year 2017 GSW with the 1.8 and 4motion. I was going to keep the 09, but over three months sitting in the dealer lot waiting for them to fix the fix soured my affection for the car.


performance seems the same, and with the cost difference in fuel, it costs about the same per mile.


I do have to say i would have hesitated if I had seen oilhammer's thoughts before the purchase. but now I just have to watch it, keep it properly lubricated, and hope for the best.



I thought I smelled coolant the other day, and the level seems down a bit. just going over 20,000 miles.

Smashed Ixnay said:

That 1.4 TSI engine is great......I was able to get 42 mpg going 80mph on the interstate with about 30 minutes in stop and go traffic..... that would be an engine that might make me not miss my TDI.

Click to expand...

Ixnay, I sure agree.

Buyback $$$ enabled me to put a '17 Jetta 1.4 turbo/5M in my garage (and $10k in my tax free bond fund).

Fuelly.com calc's 39.3 for 14,000 miles of 70city/30 hwy...............

No complaints from the sailor.


ez sends

truman said:

In today's world who makes a reliable drive train? Some day I may need another car.

Click to expand...

You can't just apply a blanket statement to all powertrains that any manufacturer produces. They all have specific good ones, and they all have duds. Sometimes a specific engine or transmission starts out being a dud but gets fixed, sometimes it starts out good but then they screw it up, and internal design changes are something you will never know about. I gave up trying to figure it out long ago.