MKVI | Vibration under load 75-90mph

I was hoping to get some ideas from the veterans on what could possibly be causing the following:

INFO
CAR: 2011 JSW TDI DSG
MILES: 45,000

PROBLEM
I'm getting a vibration, almost a shuddering up around 75mph. It is more pronounced under load, i.e. flooring the go-pedal up a hill. It's pretty bad but starts to let up around 90mph. Unfortunately I don't know if it's a particular RPM - but I only notice under load (6th gear). My tires are not great, and the rear tires are downright awful but not sure why it would be the tires if it gets worse with load. I should add that I just had all 4 tires ballanced and an allignment done.

The only times I've felt something similar to this was in a V10 Touareg TDI and the Liberty CRD. In both cases it ended up being the fuel filters (in the Touareg it was 2 filters.. because it has one for each 6-cylinder bank ). But those were shuddering and a definite lack of power. I don't think I have a lack of power.

OK... any thoughts or experiences? Other things I should be looking for? THANKS!

PS - I'm due for my service and I will be changing the fuel filter; this weekend or the next one.

We have a customer who had almost exactly the same problem, chased it by replacing a variety of parts including an axle, found it was bad tires. Replace the tires and it'll go away.

I would bet that it s the tires as well.

Yeah... it's the obvious place to start. I've been trying to hold off because I don't know if I want to step up to 18's yet.

pull a switcheroo with a friend.

evolDiesel said:

I was hoping to get some ideas from the veterans on what could possibly be causing the following:

INFO
CAR: 2011 JSW TDI DSG
MILES: 45,000

PROBLEM
I'm getting a vibration, almost a shuddering up around 75mph. It is more pronounced under load, i.e. flooring the go-pedal up a hill. It's pretty bad but starts to let up around 90mph. Unfortunately I don't know if it's a particular RPM - but I only notice under load (6th gear). My tires are not great, and the rear tires are downright awful but not sure why it would be the tires if it gets worse with load. I should add that I just had all 4 tires ballanced and an allignment done.

The only times I've felt something similar to this was in a V10 Touareg TDI and the Liberty CRD. In both cases it ended up being the fuel filters (in the Touareg it was 2 filters.. because it has one for each 6-cylinder bank ). But those were shuddering and a definite lack of power. I don't think I have a lack of power.

OK... any thoughts or experiences? Other things I should be looking for? THANKS!

PS - I'm due for my service and I will be changing the fuel filter; this weekend or the next one.

Click to expand...

Does it always do it at 75 mph or is it intermittent? I was told my axle is starting to "go" and it will need replacing. Sometimes I get vibration. Sometimes I don't. I also have a bit of a side-to-side vibration in the steering wheel when my Mk4 is acting up.

df

Yeah it's right up there around 70-75. There is no vibration before that. Everything feels great otherwise.

Are you running on factory wheels? If you bought aftermarket wheels and the hubs are bigger than factory, you will see that problem at specific speed ranges, usually starting above 60mph. If so, then buy some hub ring adapters on eBay. If you drive at speeds above 80 often, then get aluminum hub rings in stead of composite.

Otherwise, I agree that it's the tires. I have had this exact issue. I was swapping o lot of different wheels. It's always one or the other.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2

Fortunately they are 17" VW Goals.

You guys have convinced me to look at tires first.

I have the same issue going on. It's been 40k since it started, and it hasn't gotten worse, but it hasn't gotten better either.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=365033

I replaced the fuel filter, and it went away for a period of about 500 miles, then came right back. When I was running 18" Huff wheels with low pro tires, it was very bad and the car felt unsafe in certain moments. Could happen in any gear, but more so above 50-60 mph and in 3rd gear or higher, when my foot was deep in the pedal. As soon as I remounted my OE 17" wheels with thicker tires, it got a lot better, but didn't go completely away. Ive driven it since then and just dealt with it, just letting off when I feel it start to shake too much, but it still annoys me to this day. I have a feeling its my DMF starting to act up, but I would like to ride this clutch out as long as possible, then upgrade to a SMF and better clutch when mine goes. I am actually mounting new tires in the next month or so on the 17s and the tire machine and balancer that were used last time were not exactly up to par. I'm going to have my wheels road force balanced at the shop down the street. I will let you know if anything changes with the tire swap, but I still have a feeling its something else.

Wow; interesting. Do you get up high enough to where it goes away or at least gets less prominent? I want to say I get up past 90 and it gets smoother.

And I totally hear you about it feeling unsafe. When its at the worst, and I'm going 80 - it's not very confidence inspiring. My last (2) MKV TDI's had nothing like this. 90, 100, 120... surprisingly smooth all the way through. Those were 5MT's; this is a DSG.

It's interesting that you think it went away for 500 miles after replacing the fuel filter. I'm axious to see what happens when I replace my filter soon.

Thanks for the input.

Also, post #77 - Merritt said it was the fuel filter.

I'm Merritt lol.

With the 18s, mine was really bad at around 65-70 in 3rd or 4th gear, when accelerating hard to pass quickly. I would stay on it, with my steering wheel shaking violently (I wish I could have taken a video, but I suppose that would have been less safe...), and drive through it up to about 85-90 and it would start to taper off. Like I said, I've gotten used to it, but at the expense of running my 17s all year.

I just heard someone else had visited a dealer and the fuel filter ended up fixing it. I had one laying around on the shelf for my next service, so I figured what the hell and changed it 10k early. The difference was night and day. Much smoother acceleration all the way to 5k and 100mph. But it slowly started to come back and was back in full force 500-1000 miles later. At that point, my tires on my 18s were all but gone, so I just put the 17s back on and it got better. Still there but much better.

As I mentioned, my initial thought was a dual mass flywheel issue, because I have heard that is one of the symptoms of impending failure. I don't have any other symptoms though, such as clutch chatter. I will say this, at 99k miles today, I can definitely feel more slop in my drivetrain due to a worn DMF compared to when I picked my car up. On and off throttle in gear is when you feel it the most. It's almost a delayed clunk of the 90 degrees the DMF has to spin before changing directions. You will read all about that here on my vortex post(#46 on that page)that is linked to the thread I posted earlier. I am bassman5066 on TDIClub and MyTurboDiesel, and I am danknugz on VWVortex.

Then after going through what I did with the filter, I started to worry of a fuel delivery issue relating to the high pressure fuel pump. Didn't dig too much deeper into that so far, but its not something I have ruled out and would like to know if I could. My car has no codes, besides the EGR ones related to the exhaust I have on the car, nothing fuel delivery related.

bassman5066 said:

As soon as I remounted my OE 17" wheels with thicker tires, it got a lot better, but didn't go completely away. Ive driven it since then and just dealt with it, just letting off when I feel it start to shake too much, but it still annoys me to this day. I have a feeling its my DMF starting to act up, but I would like to ride this clutch out as long as possible, then upgrade to a SMF and better clutch when mine goes.

Click to expand...

i was actually going to suggest this as well.
a friend has a very similar issue that sounded like it could maybe be motor mounts or bad tires, but ended up being a very worn DMF.

Update:
I did my 45K service this week which included the fuel filter. There was absolutely zero change. I'm growing convinced that I just have bad tires in need of replacing.

You could slow down! Seriously, tire problem is the first place to look. Make sure you have a 4-wheel alignment done when you replace the tires. After that, ball joints/suspension check out.

Slow down? I don't understand

I just had an alignment & wheel balance. But the rears are a lost cause I think.

For me it was tires and a bad rim. They wanted to replace two rims but only one was bad enough that they couldn't get it to form a seal.

I'm just over 40K (probably about 20K on my summer tires - original conti's) and had the same problem. I had a 4 wheel alignment(first one) and it was off just slightly. That didn't resolve the shudder so I went and had my wheel's/tires rebalanced and that did the trick.

Nice - more affirmation

Yeah have them blance the tires on the car! Sounds like an unbalanced situation.

Soundsl like a slightly bent rim. When you have em balanced, have the guy check the rims to see if any of them are bent. If the bent is on the front you will feel it a lot more than if it's on the back where you get more of an oscillating in and out shudder then smooth, then shudder then smooth......etc.... And it only has to be bent a tiny little bit for this to happen.

good luck

I'm experiencing a similar vibration north of 70MPH. Mine is a 2012 Golf TDI 6 speed. Honestly, I've had a vibration issue in this car since new, but I assumed it was just the nature of the diesel engine (they do run quite a bit rougher than petrol engines). However, it has gotten worse as the tires have worn, so maybe I've had a tire issue from the start. The original Continentals have 55,000 on them and will be replaced in a few weeks. I was planning on sticking with Conti since they lasted so well, but switching to their ExtremeContact DWS this time. But maybe I should try something different if there is a known issue with balancing and Conti tires. Any recommendations or thoughts?

Trade cars with me......I never go over 70!!

Donald

I sold my 2011 DSG & picked up a 2011 6MT. So far no shuddering or vibrations in this one (just got done installing rims, tires, springs and 4 wheel alignment). It goes to Stage 2+delete in 4 days.

dhectorg said:

I'm experiencing a similar vibration north of 70MPH...

Click to expand...

I know it's a little dangerous but have you tried driving much past 70, like 90 or higher? I ask because if it comes on at a specific speed and then goes away it has to be rotational and the troubleshooting method is usually: rebalance the tires, get new tires, rims true? wheel bearings, etc. Don't do what I did and convince yourself it's a wheel bearing only to find out it was one tire out of ballance. Also, is it on constant velocity or hard throttle? If hard throttle like 6 gear pulls on the highway then could be shuddering which is usually the fuel filter (at least every diesel for me). Good luck.

dhectorg said:

The original Continentals have 55,000 on them and will be replaced in a few weeks. I was planning on sticking with Conti since they lasted so well, but switching to their ExtremeContact DWS this time. But maybe I should try something different if there is a known issue with balancing and Conti tires. Any recommendations or thoughts?

Click to expand...

I (and many others here) hated the OE Contis -- noisy and harsh. But the DWS's are highly regarded here. You should be happy with those hoops.

evolDiesel said:

I know it's a little dangerous but have you tried driving much past 70, like 90 or higher? I ask because if it comes on at a specific speed and then goes away it has to be rotational and the troubleshooting method is usually: rebalance the tires, get new tires, rims true? wheel bearings, etc. Don't do what I did and convince yourself it's a wheel bearing only to find out it was one tire out of ballance. Also, is it on constant velocity or hard throttle? If hard throttle like 6 gear pulls on the highway then could be shuddering which is usually the fuel filter (at least every diesel for me). Good luck.

Click to expand...

I rarely go over 75, but it's definitely constant from about 68 up. Since I'm due for new tires anyway, I think I'll get those put on and have a road force balance done at the same time, and see where I am after that.

Also, anyone heard about Conti's new ExtremeContact DWS06 tire? I think it just came out a few weeks ago and is the replacement for the current one. A local tire shop quoted me $727 for a set of those (incl RFB). He said it was a promotional price because they're new. It's been so long since I bought tires, I have no idea if that's a deal or not.

dhectorg said:

I rarely go over 75, but it's definitely constant from about 68 up. Since I'm due for new tires anyway, I think I'll get those put on and have a road force balance done at the same time, and see where I am after that.

Also, anyone heard about Conti's new ExtremeContact DWS06 tire? I think it just came out a few weeks ago and is the replacement for the current one. A local tire shop quoted me $727 for a set of those (incl RFB). He said it was a promotional price because they're new. It's been so long since I bought tires, I have no idea if that's a deal or not.

Click to expand...

Judging by the review on tire rack for those tires they seem to be better than the original.

Price sounds about right. I'd say it'd be worth it to get road hazard coverage as well.

My JSW started doing this around 40-50k miles and on 2 sets of tires and a new set of wheels. Finally turned out to be the front end lower control arm bushings(on the rear of the LCA). The stock bushings are really weak and allow the control arm to move in the mount under load and cause the vibration. I replaced with a set of solid LCA bushing from the TTRS/RS3 from Europe. Now it drives butter smooth.

i can second that i had this same issue with my mk6, disappeared after switching to michelin primacy HP's, now those have worn down to almost on the limit, the vibration is coming back but not as harsh as it was before...they've last 20k miles so far so good enough!