Severe Internal Engine Damage

Hello folks, it's been a good long while since I have posted anything as I have had a great run with 4 TDIs up til this point.
History - bought a fixed 2013 Audi Q7 with 50K miles in Feb 2018.
Had a full year of zero issues with this vehicle. First week of Feb 2019 the check engine light comes on and stays on. I take it to the dealer for the first time, there were 5 faults, biggest being EGR valve failure and AdBlue tank failure (so got a new one for free). It took a full 2 weeks to fix everything (let's not talk about how I came and picked up the vehicle that was "fixed" after a week and on the drive home the check engine light came on again, so I turned around and brought it back... for the next week of repairs, anyway).
So 13 days after picking up the vehicle, I pull out of my garage (keeps the car around 50 deg F) into 26 deg F temps and about a half mile from my home I start hearing a strange flapping noise that sounds like a bad loud pickup truck starting up but I realize it's coming from me, it sounds like a body panel is loose and flapping in the wind. Get to the light on my road with no indicators of anything wrong with engine or oil or coolant. As soon as I come to a stop the whole car starts shaking violently like the engine has lost it's mounts. Pull out onto the road as there is no shoulder on our road, trying to get to a parking lot, get up to 40 mph (on a 55 mph road in morning rush) and then all dies. No acceleration, no electricity, no power steering.
Get a tow to the dealership that morning as the car will not restart and isn't driveable.
Takes them a week to come back to me with that there is severe internal damage to the engine. I can not get any more details from them. Can only assume that they are trying to cover their rear ends and make sure it isn't from something they did less than 2 weeks prior.
Going on week #2 with less than adequate information about what is happening to my "new to me" car.
Anyone else have a similar experience? Really, I am just nervous that I'm going to have to hire a lawyer to get anything from them. Thanks in advance for anyone else's experiences with a dead fixed TDI engine.....

I expect that this will be covered by the warranty from the diesel emissions scandal, that was my reasoning for posting here.

Where would you suggest?

Thanks!

You'll get a new engine from VW. They should also provide you with a free loaner vehicle until it's fixed.

Trolls are abound

Zawurah said:

Trolls are abound

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What is your deal? I’m trying to get some real feedback and you’re being a troll. Thanks a bunch.

Update: they are talking to Audi but waiting on callbacks is slow going. They did note our aftermarket K&N air filter.... just waiting for them to say that’s what caused the engine failure.

JettaChic04 said:

They did note our aftermarket K&N air filter.... just waiting for them to say that’s what caused the engine failure.

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You are screwed. I wish you had hung around here more during your time of ownership, saw the other horror stories associated with running with the K&N.

I wouldn't say she's SOL yet. If VW won't cover the engine damage because a non-OEM air filter was used, OP can go after non-OEM air filter manufacturer.

These stories are heartbreaking. OP: I wish you luck, I didn’t mean to be flippant earlier, but I am pretty sure Audi Corporate will refuse to pay on account of the filter. Getting help from K&N under their “guarantee” will not be the least bit easy.

Another takeaway that readers should get from this thread: if your vehicle starts acting noticeably unusually, with weird sounds, or shudders, etc, STOP driving and turn off your engine. Do not try to get to the next exit. Coast to the shoulder if you can. If you have no shoulder just turn on your hazards. If other vehicles are a danger to you get out of the vehicle and get to safety. If your vehicle is stuck on the road and a danger to others, use a flashlight (your phone has one) and try to use it to create safety for oncoming drivers.

About the only time this advice should be changed is the circumstances of being on the interstate at night or in bodily danger if unable to drive. In that case, keep moving as SLOWLY as is practicable until the first place you can safely stop and cut off the engine.

JettaChic04, wow. The dealership should tell you more than just "internal engine damage". There needs to be a cause. And although I have heard of the over oiled K&N covering MAF resistors in oil and throwing off the computer, it sounds like the dealership may have changed the oil (and forgot to refill) or left a coolant plug in the cooling lines causing the engine to overheat (i've actually had this happen to me before).

Both of the aforementioned cases I have witnessed first hand. Dealer forgetting to put the oil filter on correctly and it spewing all over the driveway and a plastic cooling plug in the water pump (so it wouldn't leak while they were fixing it) but leaving it there with the hose on again.

Do you remember if your car was overheating or had oil pressure? Common sense says if there was oil pressure and cooling available, the engine would have been protected from "major damage", even if the K&N was over oiling the MAF.

Ouch. Did you install the K&N? Is it one of the drop in types, or a cone type filter?

ToBiN said:

JettaChic04, wow. The dealership should tell you more than just "internal engine damage". There needs to be a cause. And although I have heard of the over oiled K&N covering MAF resistors in oil and throwing off the computer, it sounds like the dealership may have changed the oil (and forgot to refill) or left a coolant plug in the cooling lines causing the engine to overheat (i've actually had this happen to me before).



Both of the aforementioned cases I have witnessed first hand. Dealer forgetting to put the oil filter on correctly and it spewing all over the driveway and a plastic cooling plug in the water pump (so it wouldn't leak while they were fixing it) but leaving it there with the hose on again.



Do you remember if your car was overheating or had oil pressure? Common sense says if there was oil pressure and cooling available, the engine would have been protected from "major damage", even if the K&N was over oiling the MAF.

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Remember OP drove the car home and had it 13 days, presumably using it almost daily, during that time. Then this catastrophe happened just after starting. Suspicions always run rampant but it will be very hard to argue a line of fault stemming from the dealer.

Under normal conditions, the dieselgate extended warranty would be her saving grace but here’s the K&N filter, which has been used as a pretext, successfully, before by VW/Audi to avoid responsibility.

I don’t know why folks insist on using those things...

Thank you all for your inputs. We have used K&Ns for decades at this point with no issues (including for 7 years in my Touareg with this same engine). Anyway, I don’t look forward to anything going forward with this if they come back and blame a thrown rod (don’t know what it is but just for example) on an air filter. Also, the way I read the settlement warranty there isn’t a stipulation about only using OEM or really anything like that so to me, I’d think they’d have to prove the air filter caused the issue not just write it off because we have a non-OEM filter.
I’ll update when I find out more. Shockingly (not), my husband was able to get more from the service manager than I was....

Mythdoc said:

Remember OP drove the car home and had it 13 days, presumably using it almost daily, during that time. Then this catastrophe happened just after starting. Suspicions always run rampant but it will be very hard to argue a line of fault stemming from the dealer.

Under normal conditions, the dieselgate extended warranty would be her saving grace but here’s the K&N filter, which has been used as a pretext, successfully, before by VW/Audi to avoid responsibility.

I don’t know why folks insist on using those things...

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Normally you’d be correct about daily driving but actually I’d only driven it 2 of those 13 days which will be reflected in the mileage when I picked up the car and then when it was dropped off. Husband was out of town so I was using his bmw 328d most days for the superior fuel economy.

Good luck. Hopefully that doesn't wind up being a multi thousand dollar air filter. Live and learn.

JettaChic04 said:

Also, the way I read the settlement warranty there isn’t a stipulation about only using OEM or really anything like that so to me, I’d think they’d have to prove the air filter caused the issue not just write it off because we have a non-OEM filter.

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Your use in other cars for whatever length of time will have no bearing here and may be bad news for those if you bring them up. Unfortunately all they have to do is refuse at this point and it will be up to you to prove it didn't have a part in the destruction. Much more difficult task. Hope for the best and contact the class action attorneys if needed to see if they will help. I doubt they will want to get involved in this though.

JettaChic04 said:

Hello folks, it's been a good long while since I have posted anything as I have had a great run with 4 TDIs up til this point.
History - bought a fixed 2013 Audi Q7 with 50K miles in Feb 2018.
Had a full year of zero issues with this vehicle. First week of Feb 2019 the check engine light comes on and stays on. I take it to the dealer for the first time, there were 5 faults, biggest being EGR valve failure and AdBlue tank failure (so got a new one for free). It took a full 2 weeks to fix everything (let's not talk about how I came and picked up the vehicle that was "fixed" after a week and on the drive home the check engine light came on again, so I turned around and brought it back... for the next week of repairs, anyway).
So 13 days after picking up the vehicle, I pull out of my garage (keeps the car around 50 deg F) into 26 deg F temps and about a half mile from my home I start hearing a strange flapping noise that sounds like a bad loud pickup truck starting up but I realize it's coming from me, it sounds like a body panel is loose and flapping in the wind. Get to the light on my road with no indicators of anything wrong with engine or oil or coolant. As soon as I come to a stop the whole car starts shaking violently like the engine has lost it's mounts. Pull out onto the road as there is no shoulder on our road, trying to get to a parking lot, get up to 40 mph (on a 55 mph road in morning rush) and then all dies. No acceleration, no electricity, no power steering.
Get a tow to the dealership that morning as the car will not restart and isn't driveable.
Takes them a week to come back to me with that there is severe internal damage to the engine. I can not get any more details from them. Can only assume that they are trying to cover their rear ends and make sure it isn't from something they did less than 2 weeks prior.
Going on week #2 with less than adequate information about what is happening to my "new to me" car.
Anyone else have a similar experience? Really, I am just nervous that I'm going to have to hire a lawyer to get anything from them. Thanks in advance for anyone else's experiences with a dead fixed TDI engine.....

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Ouch. Sorry to hear. We had a similar experience with our MB ML350 Bluetec which I discovered, from the MB forums (after we purchased it, of course), had an occasional habit of blowing engines with little or no warning. Ours threw a rod through the oil pan at 70mph on the highway, turning the vehicle into a very expensive 5200lb doorstop. We had driven it the day before 150 miles at speeds of 80-100mph without incident. Ironically we replaced it with the Q7 due to not wanting another exploded Mercedes, and being steered away from used BMW diesels by our mechanic. Also given the relatively good track record of the 3.0 TDI plus my favorable experience with TDIs in years past, whose engines were tough as a bag of hammers. Even with a non-standard filter it would appear that the warranty provision indicating that any ambiguities are to be resolved in favor of the owner should give you leverage; i.e the burden of proof should dictate that it is incumbent on the dealer to prove that the filter caused the catastrophic engine failure, and not on you to prove that it didn't. In every court in the U.S., ambiguities in contracts of adhesion (such as the dieselgate warranty) are generously construed in favor of the adhering party to the contract (i.e. you).

IDK what similar experiences others have had citing this provision of the warranty; clearly the dealer doesn't want to be on the hook for an overhaul or a rebuilt engine, so it may take some persuasion, but it does seem like a well-written letter citing any relevant case law regarding similar warranty provisions could go a long way in encouraging Audi/the dealer to sing a different tune. I don't have as detailed mechanical knowledge as others so can't comment as to this, but it strikes me as more than coincidental that you just got the car back from the dealer, who didn't fix it correctly the first time, and then she blows. What work did the dealer do on the mechanicals when you took it back for week #2 of repairs? Given the cost (we were quoted $27k for a new Bluetec engine and $12k-$13k for a good used or rebuilt one) this seems worth pursuing. As another owner of an '013 low mileage Q7, I hope you will provide updates. Good luck!

GREAT news!

Found out Friday morning that we are getting a new engine from Audi. It will take a month to arrive from Germany and then "quite awhile" to take apart the front end and rebuild. BUT, I will not have a beautiful brick sitting in my driveway so, that is some GREAT news.
Thank you all for your input, glad most of you were wrong about Audi and the air filter issue, sorry to anyone who hasn't had my experience/luck with the same.
Hope this post helps someone who may experience a similar engine failure.

That is great news. It would be nice to find out what failed and what they believe called it if you are able to get that information. Are they providing a loaner until it is fixed?

I’m very glad to have been wrong about the air filter issue. A best possible result under the circumstances.

JettaChic04 said:

Found out Friday morning that we are getting a new engine from Audi. It will take a month to arrive from Germany and then "quite awhile" to take apart the front end and rebuild. BUT, I will not have a beautiful brick sitting in my driveway so, that is some GREAT news.
Thank you all for your input, glad most of you were wrong about Audi and the air filter issue, sorry to anyone who hasn't had my experience/luck with the same.
Hope this post helps someone who may experience a similar engine failure.

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AWESOME! So glad to hear.

Glad its going to work out and get fixed!

May I suggest doubling down......go get yourself a few Powerball tickets before the big drawing tomorrow night.