What's a "Loose wastegate clamp" and why should it cost $2000 to fix?

nhdoc

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Try not to roll your eyes, but my car went in for a PPI for its buyer at our local stealer. One of the tech's notes was "found loose clamp around wastegate for turbo" and recommended new turbo for $1,922 :rolleyes:

The SA says there is no remedy for this other than a whole new turbocharger.

Can anyone direct me to the clamp they think the dealer is describing and tell me if it can be tightened?

They were poking around because they felt the car had turbo lag. It does actually have some lag, which is because I have modded the MAF (by twsting) to counter the plugged EGR actuator hose. Of course they never found that the EGR wasn't working or that the MAF was twisted - instead they chose to recommend a new turbo.
 

Ski in NC

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A 2001 jetta tdi does not have a wastegate. Might point that out to the SA. It does have a vnt actuator, and most of that can be serviced without replacing the turbo. It can also be tested easily.
 

FlyTDI Guy

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Ski in NC said:
A 2001 jetta tdi does not have a wastegate. Might point that out to the SA. It does have a vnt actuator, and most of that can be serviced without replacing the turbo. It can also be tested easily.
x2... the ALH motor does not even have a wastegate. The mechanic mis-described the problem. Doesn't inspire a lot of confidence in their diagnosis.
 

nhdoc

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I'll admit my familiarity with the VW diesel is limited but I also thought it did not have a wastegate...but I didn't want to start an argument with the SA because my experience has been they just B.S. their way around answering any question directly.

Is there some clamp that they would think could be loose on the turbo itself which isn't serviceable and would required replacement of the entire assembly to remedy?
 

nhdoc

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I just called the SA and he says "the tech insists the car has a wastegate and that is the clamp that is loose" I explained that on a variable vane turbo there is no wastegate but he kept insisting they all have a wastegate. I assume there is some problem with terminology since I also was taught that a variable turbo doesn't have a wastegate but maybe they are trying to describe some connection that these have but which isn't actually a wastegate.
 

nhdoc

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The thing is there's nothing wrong with the car...I just want to prove to my prospective buyer that he shouldn't be concerned that our local stealer recommends a $2000 repair for something that "ain't broke"...or worse yet, something the car doesn't even have!

As I said, they were trying to find an explanation for some turbo lag, which I know the car has and why. I didn't want to tell them that I modified the MAF and disconnected the EGR because that would just give them an excuse to raise more issues...but I found it interesting that what they say they found wrong isn't even on this car.

My experience is on Mercedes diesels, which do have fixed vane turbos and wastegates. When he first mentioned the wastegate I was like "hmmmm I don't think this car has one" in my head, but you hate to tell someone that they don't know what they are talking about unless you're sure. Now, I'm sure they don't know what they are talking about.

So, if you want to go to a dealer who thinks the ALH engine's VNT turbo has a wastegate, go to Tulley VW in Nashua.

FWIW they also said they would fail its safety inspection because of compressed front strut mounts! What a load.
 
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aja8888

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If it wee me that lost a sale because of a moron mechanic at a dealer, I would hunt down the dealership owner and have a face to face with him before I sent the flaming letter to VWOA.
 

nhdoc

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aja8888 said:
If it wee me that lost a sale because of a moron mechanic at a dealer, I would hunt down the dealership owner and have a face to face with him before I sent the flaming letter to VWOA.
The guy who is interested in my car has driven it and likes it...if he lets the morons at the dealership scare him off I'll be able to sell it to someone else. I'm a straight shooter and offered to take the car to anyone he wanted for a PPI - he chose the dealer and I told him "they always find something to fix, ALWAYS, so keep that in mind."

The fact that their list was limited to this issue, the parking brake which needed adjustment, worn sway bar links and bushings and worn strut mounts is truly a testimony to how sound the car is after nearly 10 years and 160K miles.

I expected the sway bar and strut mount issue and knew the parking brake isn't perfect but never dreamed they would recommend a new turbo, but it does go to show that some dealers have unmitigated nerve.

You'll probably not be shocked to learn they quoted well over $700 for the sway bar and strut mount work. More than double what a local VW-only indy quoted to do the same job and about $650 more than the parts cost for a few hours work.
 
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greengeeker

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nhdoc said:
The thing is there's nothing wrong with the car...I just want to prove to my prospective buyer that he shouldn't be concerned that our local stealer recommends a $2000 repair for something that "ain't broke"...or worse yet, something the car doesn't even have!

As I said, they were trying to find an explanation for some turbo lag, which I know the car has and why. I didn't want to tell them that I modified the MAF and disconnected the EGR because that would just give them an excuse to raise more issues...but I found it interesting that what they say they found wrong isn't even on this car.

My experience is on Mercedes diesels, which do have fixed vane turbos and wastegates. When he first mentioned the wastegate I was like "hmmmm I don't think this car has one" in my head, but you hate to tell someone that they don't know what they are talking about unless you're sure. Now, I'm sure they don't know what they are talking about.

So, if you want to go to a dealer who thinks the ALH engine's VNT turbo has a wastegate, go to Tulley VW in Nashua.

FWIW they also said they would fail its safety inspection because of compressed front strut mounts! What a load.
All those observations and they still didn't notice your lack of EGR equip. Hilarious.
 

Yreka

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RT1 said:
What's a "Loose wastegate clamp"...? An opportunity to make MONEY!


Make sure to have them replace the muffler bearings since they will have it apart.

Will save the labor if they decide to go out somewhere down the road. :cool:
 

nhdoc

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Yreka said:
Make sure to have them replace the muffler bearings since they will have it apart.

Will save the labor if they decide to go out somewhere down the road. :cool:
I also had them drain and replace the turn signal fluid, adjust the headlight cams and quiet down that squeaky nut behind the wheel (oh, wait, that's me!).
 

UFO

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If you are trying to sell the car, why not restore the EGR function and tighten any loose clamps? In my experience, the EGR operation on TDIs improves the driveability, and your "lag" should go away. And the prospective buyer won't have any doubt. If it's not too late for this one, you may not have the issue with the next.
 

manual_tranny

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nhdoc said:
You'll probably not be shocked to learn they quoted well over $700 for the sway bar and strut mount work. More than double what a local VW-only indy quoted to do the same job and about $650 more than the parts cost for a few hours work.
It is not a few hours of work. I'm not even a competent mechanic, and I could replace your strut mounts and sway bar bushings in less than 2 hours.... this counts the time I spend looking for tools I'm so bad at keeping track of. (probably half the time of any job)
 

nhdoc

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UFO said:
If you are trying to sell the car, why not restore the EGR function and tighten any loose clamps? In my experience, the EGR operation on TDIs improves the driveability, and your "lag" should go away. And the prospective buyer won't have any doubt. If it's not too late for this one, you may not have the issue with the next.
EGR doesn't do anything but clog up the intake with crud. Prior to my mods the car would throw a code for excess flow in the EGR system about every two weeks but since I modded it I have eliminated the CEL and overall fuel mileage is unchanged. The only downside is some minor lag which I could probably eliminate if I tweaked the MAF a little.
 
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btcost

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When I see you Saturday we can check the VNT. and run some logs with vag-com. like actual vs request boost.

the VNT "could" be tired. but I doubt it.

What MAF mod did you do??
 

nhdoc

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btcost said:
When I see you Saturday we can check the VNT. and run some logs with vag-com. like actual vs request boost.

the VNT "could" be tired. but I doubt it.

What MAF mod did you do??
Hi Brian,

I twisted it after plugging the EGR vacuum hose and tuned it to about an 11 reading on the scangauge at idle.

For kicks I just reversed it (takes 10 minutes) and replaced the EGR vacuum hose with a new one. Power curve is back to normal and I'll drive it around like this now to see if it throws a code. MAF readings at idle are between 13-14 on the scangauge, which is a little high, but may not be high enough for an CEL.

This is just one of those mods I tried out to see if I could stop the CEL and also prevent the intake from gunking up, but it is probably overkill and everything else is functioning as normal since I have tested the actuator and the EGR valve itself.

I think the tech was just looking for something to explain the laggy power curve and so decided a $2000 turbo would fix it.
 
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Honeydew

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I bet putting the EGR and MAF back to stock will help the wastegate clamp issue resolve itself, almost like it never existed at all.:p
 

btcost

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drive like that for the rest of the week. we will play around with it on saturday.

I'll bring my mity-vac too. but I bet your vnt is fine
 

nhdoc

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btcost said:
drive like that for the rest of the week. we will play around with it on saturday.

I'll bring my mity-vac too. but I bet your vnt is fine
Sounds good. I'll ask the guy who is buying the car if he wants to come along on Saturday too. It might be interesting for him to meet a bunch of dieselheads who know these cars better than the lunkheads at the dealership.
 

btcost

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good idea!

I hope he comes!

I'll pm you the address now.
 

nhdoc

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I was reading the Bentley manual last night and I will say they do use the term wastegate to describe components on the 1.9 TDI and PD engine's turbocharger.

I think the confusion is because in the VW world of factory authorized dealer service the entire turbocharger (including the VNT actuator) is a single, replacement unit and non-serviceable. They don't look inside and don't care how it works. Whether the actuator engages the variable fins or a wastegate "door" isn't important to their tech, it serves the same function; to regulate boost. So, I believe that their techs are trained to call the VNT system a "wastegate" even though technically it is not one. That would be consistent with the Bentley terminology and explains why they were so adamant about the fact that the car has a wastegate. You can't educate them about something they have been "trained" to by the factory - even if they are technically incorrect.

Having said that I still don't know what clamp they are describing as being "loose"...but I will look under there later and see if I can figure out what they were looking at.
 

aja8888

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It's been said here a thousand times that the VW dealer tech's don't "fix" the problem, but they just replace "parts" until the problem goes away (or not).
 

adamant628

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What gauge are you using on scangauge, or did you make an Xgauge?

nhdoc said:
Hi Brian,

I twisted it after plugging the EGR vacuum hose and tuned it to about an 11 reading on the scangauge at idle.

For kicks I just reversed it (takes 10 minutes) and replaced the EGR vacuum hose with a new one. Power curve is back to normal and I'll drive it around like this now to see if it throws a code. MAF readings at idle are between 13-14 on the scangauge, which is a little high, but may not be high enough for an CEL.

This is just one of those mods I tried out to see if I could stop the CEL and also prevent the intake from gunking up, but it is probably overkill and everything else is functioning as normal since I have tested the actuator and the EGR valve itself.

I think the tech was just looking for something to explain the laggy power curve and so decided a $2000 turbo would fix it.
 

FlyTDI Guy

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Having played around w/the "MAF Twist" mod, I don't see any value to it. IMO, you want to show as much air as possible passing by the MAF to keep fueling up. By turning it, all you're doing is simulating a clogged intake or weak turbo.
 
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