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General Automotive General automotive discussion. This is intended to be a discussion about other not VW and Diesel cars you may have or interested in.

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Old March 20th, 2017, 06:24   #2116
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Ford stretched the 3.6 Peugeot/Ford-designed Jaguar/Land Rover V8 diesel to a 4.4 for the F-150, then cancelled it, back then.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 07:48   #2117
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Eh, no, a Volt can only do about 430 EPA range on a full charge and full tank, so getting into the 700 mile club would take hypermiling. It's got a small tank, and doesn't get amazing mileage.
In any case, overfilling tanks, as rotarykid suggests, can cause severe damage to emissions control systems on gassers.
The Volt's range works perfectly with my bladder's range.
The Volt's and the plug in Prii's EVAP systems are not the same as a standard gasser. The cars won't release the fuel door until they are ready to receive fuel and even at that, they have a window in which to fill up. I wouldn't mess with trying to top them off.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 07:56   #2118
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How many people actually use a diesel to do the Denver-KC or Denver-SLC run?
While I'm not driving anywhere out of or into Denver, I am driving from Charlotte to South Bend, In at least quarterly. Have to play grandpa! That's just over 700 miles each way. I try to stop every hour to at least use the restroom and stretch my legs. It's as much for comfort as for safety. Most stops are less than 10 minutes. I typically try to refuel around 500 miles on the JSW. Next trip, we will be taking the Canyon and pulling a trailer. Then refuel stops will be every 300 miles.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 08:24   #2119
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Yeah, I mean, my Miata works fine with my bladder range, and that's doing good to get much over 300 miles - ostensibly I can push to around 380, but past 300, the range anxiety starts kicking in. Every other stop was usually for fuel in that car (I don't roadtrip in it any more, the cabin is way too damn noisy on the freeway). I'd also align meals with the Miata's range - refueling stops were also where I'd grab a bite to eat, and I prefer to do that out of the car. So, a refueling stop, I'd usually lose 20-30 minutes - fuel, bathroom, food - or more if I specifically chose somewhere with an interesting restaurant, not just a truck stop/service plaza. That would get a Tesla enough range to make it to the next bathroom break, which is usually on the order of 3-5 minutes (so those would be slower).

But, I'm just saying that a Volt's not doing 700 miles on a tank, you'll have to stop to put more PUG or RUG (depending on generation) in it. That stop isn't an undue burden, and it's a useful opportunity to stretch one's legs anyway, but it is going to happen.

In any case, in the Prius, I aim for about 500-600 miles per tank on a roadtrip - I can go deeper into the tank, but why push it? That usually translates to every 3rd or 4th stop being for fuel. Food gets desynchronized with fuel stops there, usually. (My last road trip, I was getting under 500 mile tanks, and fueling every 2nd or 3rd stop (instead going longer on some stops), but that was partially because a lot of it was on the New York Thruway and was at the mercy of when a service plaza was available, and partially because I wasn't getting amazing mileage.)
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The really cool ToofTek made "Emperor's Clothes" injector fork risers only worked until someone pointed out that there wasn't any thing there.

Last edited by bhtooefr; March 20th, 2017 at 08:26.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 10:04   #2120
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I'd rather not get into the politics of tax credits, big oil, the environment, or the whims of the great pumpkin. If incentives for EV's disappear, there's nothing that anyone on this board can do about it. EV Incentives are available to everyone (in the US), if you choose not to drive an EV, because you're taking a political stand, or you drive 500 miles per day,...that's a choice I can respect, but respect goes both ways.

I found a 60 amp L2 charger at a local campus that's on a route I take to see a regular customer. The spot has always been open, and supplies nearly 9kW to my battery. I'll bring my laptop to catch up on work, grab lunch or a coffee, and charge up for a couple of hours for "free". I know some people may think I'm gaming the system, or that I'm somehow doing something terribly unfair to everyone else. The reality is, this privilege is available to everyone. The campus cafeteria gets my business. We both win.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 14:19   #2121
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I don't think anyone is recommending attempting to use a low-range BEV for interstate travel through the western mountains. That would be ridiculous at best, and likely impossible due to a lack of charging infrastructure (aside from campgrounds and Tesla Superchargers).
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Old March 20th, 2017, 15:20   #2122
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I don't think anyone is recommending attempting to use a low-range BEV for interstate travel through the western mountains. That would be ridiculous at best, and likely impossible due to a lack of charging infrastructure (aside from campgrounds and Tesla Superchargers).
The above is why many people would rather have one vehicle that can go to all places with the minimum of annoyances (or appropriate infrastructure). From an economic standpoint, that's the best solution. This is where the ICE/hybrid vehicles shine. And our country has been built out to accommodate it.

From a personal standpoint, I have no need or desire to purchase an electric car. It would be a special purpose vehicle for us and we don't need (or want) the additional cost, even if it saves a few bucks on fuel.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 16:58   #2123
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I'd rather not get into the politics of tax credits, big oil, the environment, or the whims of the great pumpkin. If incentives for EV's disappear, there's nothing that anyone on this board can do about it. EV Incentives are available to everyone (in the US), if you choose not to drive an EV, because you're taking a political stand, or you drive 500 miles per day,...that's a choice I can respect, but respect goes both ways.

I found a 60 amp L2 charger at a local campus that's on a route I take to see a regular customer. The spot has always been open, and supplies nearly 9kW to my battery. I'll bring my laptop to catch up on work, grab lunch or a coffee, and charge up for a couple of hours for "free". I know some people may think I'm gaming the system, or that I'm somehow doing something terribly unfair to everyone else. The reality is, this privilege is available to everyone. The campus cafeteria gets my business. We both win.
Sounds good to me.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 17:13   #2124
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While I'm not driving anywhere out of or into Denver, I am driving from Charlotte to South Bend, In at least quarterly. Have to play grandpa! That's just over 700 miles each way.

I try to stop every hour to at least use the restroom and stretch my legs. It's as much for comfort as for safety. Most stops are less than 10 minutes.

I typically try to refuel around 500 miles on the JSW. Next trip, we will be taking the Canyon and pulling a trailer. Then refuel stops will be every 300 miles.

Sounds great! Glad you get to see your family like this as often as you want to....I know that drive well,....

Over the years I have many times made the drive from the Charlotte area up to the Ann Arbor, Detroit & Windsor Ont area on one fuel stop at the end of the drive in my A2 Jetta Ds & TDs(~650 mile per tank range on a max fill)......

How long does that drive take you? If memory serves with one stop for fuel at the end it could be done in 10-11 1/2 hours....

Over the years I have made drives all across that region of Ohio, Indiana, Michigan, Illinois, & Ontario there are good high speed freeways that can safely & comfortably sustain 75-80mph for the entire drive.....

And in today's traffic with 70 posted across the region these are normal observable averages, speeds that for the most part are allowed during good weather in light traffic times....

I am wondering what effect Michigan's coming 75 interstate/65 two lane posted will have on other states legislatures, on whether this will soon become the posted limit across the region again...Ohio has several times in recent years tried to push speeds allowed to 75, we will see if they are successful this time now that pear pressures are now about to be applied from Michigan's change in speed law soon going into effect....

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Old March 20th, 2017, 17:19   #2125
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Typically it's about 12 hours. The closer to South Bend, you either have to give up toll roads or drive extra miles. We've think the best route is cross country from South Bend through Fort Wayne down the Columbus.

She turns one in a few days, so we've got to make the effort to see the very fast changes.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 18:01   #2126
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Unlike a similar distances across the great plains from my own observations these southern to midwestern US & to Canada drives can easily accommodate as many stops as you wish to have along your journey, day & night....

Fuel is always available, cell phones always work 24h/7d over these midwestern US & Canadian drives.....

And a 10-12 hour drive is not a problem if that is as far as you have to go.....

It seems that some making argument here have no comprehension of the empty western US that many of us must cross with regularity!

FACT!~ In much of the west there are No airports, hours are required of driving with no services of any type to get fuel or food at night, cell phones do not work with city plans,

(You need to know that cell phones do not work out here unless you can find a roaming signal! On a city plan every minute is $$$ when there is a roaming signal....

And there are many miles with no cell signal what-so-ever available even in roaming....

Many carries loose signal on their network at the edge of the metro areas, so for the next 8-10 hours most of time your phone will not work!)

there are only long hundred's of miles of rural ribbons of empty two lane highways....

Western US region drives across the plains can sometimes go on for hundreds of miles at night where there is not a place open to fuel up at along highways that cross southern or central CO into Kansas or Nebraska.

Consider that Even if you start early in the day you will end up driving at night while all services are closed during some of it....

And Wyoming, Nebraska, Montana, & Utah is even worse, after ~10pm in summer, 8-9 pm in winter while crossing some of it's big empties off of the interstates.....

Two lane highways are today across the region posted @ 65-75, pretty much as fast as you feel safe after midnight once normal routine patrols end for the day .....

So if you crash, breakdown or run our of fuel you are going to be there on the side of the road likely for a while before someone finds you since traffic is light and police are not routinely out on these roads after 10-11 pm until 5-6 am at the earliest(*unless they are out on a call or during a weather emergency)....

In Colorado US 34, 36 & 50 along with I-25 south of Pueblo, I-70 & I-76 are all pretty much after ~11pm unpatrolled until ~5-6 am when patrols begin again in the morning, so running out of fuel here is also a really bad idea outside of the summer heavier travel months when traffic is less sparse overnight....

Take into account that nothing is open after ~10pm summer/8-9pm winter, cell phones do not work across most of the rural region's empty miles.... so at night there is no fuel to get at any price, no cell service(they do not work even on roam), or no bathrooms....

I believe anyone who has not been here really does not get or comprehend what this big empty is like to cross!

There are a very few compost toilets every couple of hundred miles run by the state so for miles & hours places to stop are non-existent. More than a few times on one of those US highways the only bathroom was in the weeds along the side of the road where the rattle snakes live....


While a drive across the midwest is long in miles, taking hours of fairly high speed travel to make in a one day time period, the big differences are that stops are plentiful along the way....

Compare that to travel across the west off of the interstate is really like driving on another planet.....

And I am not saying midwest drives are not a long and hard to do drives. The drives are, but for the entire trips across anywhere in the midwest there simply are not any real big empties(no services, no cell phones, ect....) like there are out west...

Driving for hours on end across the west you will not see another vehicle for most of night from any direction for most of night...

I have on a trip not seen another person or vehicle for ~6 hours at a time from 10pm to 4am.....

Compare that to a drive across the east or the full of cities & people midwest and even in these areas middle of the night traffic is flowing fairly regularly around for the entire trip....

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Also consider the fact that a fill to brim tankof fuel at the beginning of the drive can save $$$'s(in the middle of nowhere fuel/gas can/does usually cost at a minimum $0.30-0.50 or more per gal)...

These distances cannot be crossed in a single day without some of drive being at night when everything is closed, no fuel at any price to be got...

And the fact that across many miles at night there is no fuel to be got at any price....you run out you are sleeping in your vehicle!

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Believe me, I had seen pictures of this region before I came here, but I have to say I had no comprehension of the place until I crossed.....

I literally had no idea that a place like this, a place this big that takes this long to get across, a place with so few people where you can see so far without obstruction existed anywhere!

I do not believe anyone who has never been here can really comprehend how empty these areas are, how few services are available at night, the fact that cell phones do not work across most of these empty miles......

There is a big difference between traveling ~600-700 miles for pleasure in the east & midwest....

Compared to going 600-1,000-1,600 miles for work or for business reasons with very limited time to get there & back, along with very limited time to do what needs to be done while you are there...these trips really do not compare in any way other than actual miles traveled....


Consider how far do you really need to go, how long you have to make the trip & how long you have for your visit, when you must be home again....remember that once you leave town you cell phone will not work for most of drive....

Now consider making a trip if you have a limited time to make the trip, limited time to do what you need to do, and you must be back home at a certain day?

Turning one of these long drives into a leisurely drive with stops every hour or so can/will turn that one day drive each way into a week of travel there & back! That is great if you do this once a year or once every 10 years.....

BUT, How many here have a free week to throw away to get where you need to go & back every few months, with the added costs that will be added from a week in a motel/hotel..????..
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Old March 20th, 2017, 19:03   #2127
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RK - leave El Paso, TX heading east on I-10 with a full tank, set the cruise at 85 (5 over) and sit back for the next 7 hours of pretty much nothing. (well, you can find fuel if you plan it right, but don't plan it wrong)
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Old March 20th, 2017, 21:33   #2128
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RK - leave El Paso, TX heading east on I-10 with a full tank, set the cruise at 85 (5 over) and sit back for the next 7 hours of pretty much nothing. (well, you can find fuel if you plan it right, but don't plan it wrong)
That drive from El Paso to San Antonio is not much fun. Even less than crossing from Phoenix to El Paso.
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Old March 21st, 2017, 07:46   #2129
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(You need to know that cell phones do not work out here unless you can find a roaming signal! On a city plan every minute is $$$ when there is a roaming signal....
I'm sorry, I thought this was 2017, not 2002.

I don't think there's even such a thing as a "city plan" any more, everyone offers national plans with unlimited free roaming.
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Old March 21st, 2017, 08:10   #2130
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I'm sorry, I thought this was 2017, not 2002.

I don't think there's even such a thing as a "city plan" any more, everyone offers national plans with unlimited free roaming.

Cell signals usually don't work well under rocks, either.
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