TDI DSG retrofit

witchcraftz

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Location
Vancouver BC
TDI
2015 Golf TDI
I have a 2005 TDI Jetta with Tiptronic. I want to retrofit the 2004 TDI new Beetle DSG transmission to it.

I'm looking for any information, diagrams, diy, help from people who have done this on how difficult it will be to mate up.

:)
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
I don't think anyone has done this, because common sense won out. If you do this, you'll probably be the only one.

What is wrong with your 09A? They are usually a decent transmission, and to be honest probably better than the early 02E.
 

witchcraftz

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Location
Vancouver BC
TDI
2015 Golf TDI
I can pick up the DSG transmission for $500. It's the actual transmission replacement that has me wondering.
 

storx

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2006
Location
Earth!!
TDI
2009 Jetta CR140, 2010 Corvette Z06
Look up on vwvortex about it.. there are a few post i read off there with nightmares on doing the swap. This is why i rather swap my turbo kit over to a few DSG donor car than to swap trannys. Guy tried to cheap out on the dsg swap and apparently the ABS system is coded special for the the DSG to work.. and the old ABS system on the exact same year car wouldnt accept the recoding requiring him to find an entire abs system off an dsg car to swap to.. then there was the issues he had with the electric steering. not accepting the recode either.. all in all.. it cost him about 8k to do the swap..
 

glitdi

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2009
Location
West Coast Canada
TDI
Tdi asv motor in a mk3 golf, om642 in a wk jeep
I have been lead to believe from a couple of buddy's who are factory trained Vw technicians within our area that the 06 mark IV diesel wagon was offered in a dsg transmission.. I might have driven one years ago, I know Vw tried them out in the beetle first as a guinea pig in case things went terribly wrong. That being said the 2006 was a strange year for tdi's the wagon might have been just the right fit to brew up a test batch.
That being said I doubt you will be able to complete a swap successfully without a ton of money and someone who is well versed in many disciplines of Vw. Finding a guru that wants to take on that challenge will be difficult...Lots of money will probably help but at what price? will it negate the cost of a brand new rebuilt transmission of that model year? Maybe test drive an 06 wagon if you can find it and consider selling your wagon and starting new if you are really serious.
 

fouckhest

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Location
g'vegs, sc
TDI
.:GTD, .:R32, DangerRanger
I have been putting some thought into this swap myself as of late; with my current setup, 02mq i have already surpassed the limits of my ~400lbft SBC, in FWD mode only hitting 3rd gear from a 1st/2nd spin, so i know if i were to launch hard from a dead stop in 1st, it would be the end of my clutch...which puts me on the cusp of having to think about a twin disc setup, which make me cringe due to drive-ability

I have a buddy in MN that has an MK5 r32t that has put down well north of 500+lbft to all 4 wheels thru the DSG; they went thru several rounds of upgraded clutch packs made by various vendors, only to land back with the OEM clutch discs, then refined the programing.

From a power holding standpoint i have confidence in the trans and its power holding capabilities; i am not intimidated by the electronics, there are always ways to "re-code" and "code out" things such as ABS, ect, (this should be no different than coding out the ABS/WSS from an mk4 cluster, which was started by the mk1/2 guys doing engine swaps, and since gone mainstream by the mk4 fanboi's shaving bays) especially with the current capabilities of tuners such as Jeff Atwood at UM and i know Malone does some tuning for the TDI DSG.

My main concern at this point will be going to spend a slow saturday afternoon down at the VW deal with my buddy and browsing ETKA to find out if the bell housing from a TDI and meat and potatoes of an mk5 r32 trans will mate up and allow me to keep my AWD functionality...

not sure when i will be able to dedicate that kind of time...but it is on my list of things to do...:p
 

storx

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2006
Location
Earth!!
TDI
2009 Jetta CR140, 2010 Corvette Z06
Fouckhest, don't. Forget the Audi TT came with dsg on both 4cylinder and vr6...the 4cylinder version would def work as well an golf r dsg...
 

witchcraftz

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Location
Vancouver BC
TDI
2015 Golf TDI
Dug this up

http://www.volkspage.net/technik/ssp/ssp/SSP_308.pdf

"It looks to have all it's sensors built in. Only using CAN for Engine speed/input shaft speed and Car speed/Output shaft speed If there is a fault with one of the gearbox sensors."

The MK4 R32 comes with DSG, the New beetle MK4 comes with DSG, which suggests it can also mate to other MK4 TDIs.

A couple of years ago the DSG would have been expensive, with the cost going down now, it's starting to make sense to do the swap.

I also found the threads on the other people who have done this:
http://www.dsg-corrado.de/index.php?option=com_zoom&Itemid=46&catid=24
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5248493-Manual-to-DSG-swap
 
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compu_85

Gadget Guy
Joined
Sep 29, 2003
Location
La Conner, WA
TDI
... None :S
Stinks it's so hard to get this working. I always wondered if it would be possible to get a DSG going with an ALH.

-J
 

storx

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2006
Location
Earth!!
TDI
2009 Jetta CR140, 2010 Corvette Z06
Stinks it's so hard to get this working. I always wondered if it would be possible to get a DSG going with an ALH.

-J
Im sure you could wire dual ecu.. and make it work... an ecu of the donor the dsg came from tied into the ecu running the engine..
 

fouckhest

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Location
g'vegs, sc
TDI
.:GTD, .:R32, DangerRanger
Fouckhest, don't. Forget the Audi TT came with dsg on both 4cylinder and vr6...the 4cylinder version would def work as well an golf r dsg...
TT only came with DSG in 6cyl in US...a reliable TT source tells me that they made DSG 4cyl in UK....otherwise will have to start investigating golf R and dual ECUs
 

langer

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2011
Location
Bawlmer
TDI
'12 a3 & '07 gasser gti
I have a buddy in MN that has an MK5 r32t that has put down well north of 500+lbft to all 4 wheels thru the DSG; they went thru several rounds of upgraded clutch packs made by various vendors, only to land back with the OEM clutch discs, then refined the programing.
Zevion's r32? His build thread is amazing.
 

OKC

Member
Joined
Mar 12, 2017
Location
Barrie Ontario Canada
TDI
2006 MK4 Jetta Wagon TDI
Old thread I know

But has anyone ever got anywhere with a DSG into MK4? My 2006 MK4 Jetta wagon TDI has provision for coding a 6speed dual-clutch. 1 standard, 4 automatic (5speed 09A) or 8 for DSG (02E/DQ250). I keep getting error 31, request out range though. I can easily code back and forth between auto and standard. Any ideas out there. Its gonna happen one way or another. Transmission is in, wiring mostly figured. Malone has a Beetle bench file to flash into my ECU but they say not sure if the adaptation will work. BEW/HLJ engine/trans combo
 
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Matt-98AHU

Loose Nut Behind the Wheel Vendor
Joined
Apr 23, 2006
Location
Gresham, OR
TDI
2001 Golf TDI, 2005 Passat wagon, 2004 Touareg V10.
Old thread I know

But has anyone ever got anywhere with a DSG into MK4? My 2006 MK4 Jetta wagon TDI has provision for coding a 6speed dual-clutch. 1 standard, 4 automatic (5speed 09A) or 8 for DSG (02E/DQ250). I keep getting error 31, request out range though. I can easily code back and forth between auto and standard. Any ideas out there. Its gonna happen one way or another. Transmission is in, wiring mostly figured. Malone has a Beetle bench file to flash into my ECU but they say not sure if the adaptation will work. BEW/HLJ engine/trans combo
Not sure anyone has, but I keep eyeballing the same swap idea myself and have noticed the coding option as well. It might be that you need to have the Beetle BEW ECU to make it work if the coding won't save.

There's also coding in the instrument cluster relating to how it picks up the VSS, and there IS an option to pick it up from the data bus (signal generated via ABS). I've always wondered if I could use that doing a DSG swap or even for an 09A to manual swap (which I've done a few--but wired the VSS manually) because that swap is a bit of a bugger to get the VSS wiring correct.

I've actually got most parts and wiring pigtails I'd need to do an 09A to DSG swap in a BEW-powered Mk4. Just need to find the right Jetta wagon for cheap that has a terminal failure of its automatic transmission.
 
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mrchill

TDIClub Enthusiast, Super Secret Diesel Ninja Vend
Joined
Sep 16, 2003
Location
MASS! home of THE WORLD SERIES CHAMPION RED SOX! x
TDI
96 B4v red \ 98 Mk3 green\98 Mk3 Jetta black\ 99 Mk4 Jetta green x2\ 99 Mk4 Golf silver x2\ 99 Mk4 Jetta black\ 97 B4 sedan green\04 JSW gold\03 JSW silver
Its been done...and will soon be done again. Actually Matt Phelan in Cali is soon to convert his PD jetta wagon with a beetle DSG setup. You may contact him.
 

Matt-98AHU

Loose Nut Behind the Wheel Vendor
Joined
Apr 23, 2006
Location
Gresham, OR
TDI
2001 Golf TDI, 2005 Passat wagon, 2004 Touareg V10.
Its been done...and will soon be done again. Actually Matt Phelan in Cali is soon to convert his PD jetta wagon with a beetle DSG setup. You may contact him.
Hey! That's me :p
 

OKC

Member
Joined
Mar 12, 2017
Location
Barrie Ontario Canada
TDI
2006 MK4 Jetta Wagon TDI
I did it. It’s running good. But I need another gear. My brother is an avionics technician. When I asked for his help he went like a savant for two days and wrote a wiring diagram. Instead of running discrete wiring we cut out the board from the TCU and jumpered the pins within it. Used an 06 Beetle ECU as it had the DSG transmission coding option, HLJ code DSG transmission from the same model year car and the shifter from the same car. The shifter bolted right up like a factory install. We could start the car at first. Savant like again after I told my brother at 11 pm, he called back with a solution. Used some jumper wiring within a specific relay because of polarity differences for a trigger signal. I reset the installation list within the clusters gateway by recoding it with same value. The gateway picked everything up fine. What a fluke there. My cluster now shows PRNDS instead of PRND432. In tiptronic mode it shows 12345. No 6. It indicates what gear I have selected fine but in 6th it the display just goes all black. It’s all fine by me with that though. I need to get the project all cleaned up though


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Mysticle31

Active member
Joined
Apr 27, 2021
Location
California
TDI
One of every generation to MK4
Hey. How are the DSG TDI's holding up? I'm either going to DSG or get a 6-speed for my 2005 BEW, unless someone talks me into a 5 :p

They still driving? How do they drive? Any issues tuning for the diesel?
What did you use? Did you have to swap a whole harness? What MPGs are you getting?

This is the latest thread I could find on this. Consensus in the early 00s was it would be a hard swap...
 
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mrchill

TDIClub Enthusiast, Super Secret Diesel Ninja Vend
Joined
Sep 16, 2003
Location
MASS! home of THE WORLD SERIES CHAMPION RED SOX! x
TDI
96 B4v red \ 98 Mk3 green\98 Mk3 Jetta black\ 99 Mk4 Jetta green x2\ 99 Mk4 Golf silver x2\ 99 Mk4 Jetta black\ 97 B4 sedan green\04 JSW gold\03 JSW silver
if using an edc16 its much easier. I'll bet the conversions are running just fine.
 

Mysticle31

Active member
Joined
Apr 27, 2021
Location
California
TDI
One of every generation to MK4
My car has an EDC16.

I wonder if I should do this based on any extra challenges of the swap, transmission reliability and complexity, dsg vs 6sp mpg.
40K mile service I dont look forward too, but an automatic in traffic would be nice.

I wonder how the resale market would be for a DSG vs a 6sp Jetta Wagon. I'm not building my car to resell but in a couple years I could go hybrid or full electric..
 
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