1997 (B5) Audi 1.9TDi Quattro Avant gearbox R&R

Has anyone any advice for this?

Looks like the pinion bearing on my B5 is less than happy - I have a road speed related whine/grumble from the gearbox or front diff. I believe it to be on the output side of the transmission; clutch in or out, in gear or out, number of engine revs, makes no difference. The sound is present while the car is moving and doesn't change or go away when turning a corner. Oil level is fine. The car has done nearly 155k miles.

The odd thing is that this noise first appeared about 9 months ago. At the time we drained the gearbox oil and refilled using Fuchs 75W90. Audi claimed the 'box is 'sealed for life' but the thin dark liquid that we drained from it would suggest otherwise. The noise almost immediately became worse, but then went away completely.

I suppose it might go away again, but we're off to France in a couple of weeks time and I don't fancy trying to explain a duff gearbox to a Frenchman in his rural garage! Better safe than sorry.

I've been quoted £300+VAT to have the new bearing fitted - £60 for the bearing, £40 for the seals and gaskets, and £200 for the labour. It'd be another £200+VAT to have the trans specialist remove and refit the 'box.

I have the option of a used box from an 80k mile car for £140+shipping (about another £40) but the concern is I could spend that and find the replacement 'box needs work too. "It was fine when it came out of the car" is all very well, but the seller (a breaker) won't offer any sort of guarantee of integrity.

I have a Haynes manual that details gearbox R&R on a front wheel drive car, but nothing giving any info for the quattro.

The question of 'is it worth it?' has been raised, but I recently replaced the front suspension arms and rear locating arms for the MoT, and have replaced all discs and pads in the last year. It's a great car, and I'd rather spend some money fixing it and know where I stand than buy another car and possibly find more problems.

Finally, does anyone have an idea of the weight of the quattro gearbox?

Any hints, tips or advice will be very welcome! And if anyone is in the Norwich area of England, please do get in touch!

TIA.

Another approach...

OK... A related question. Has anyone heard of a 'DWG' code gearbox? I'm 99.9% sure (without looking) that my car has a code 'DGW' gearbox, and code 'DAJ' rear axle.

I've found someone advertising a gearbox for a 1997 Audi A4, but he's adamant (and has checked) that the code stamped into it is 'DWG'. I know of no such designation and can find nothing the refers to a 'DWG'. Presumably it's different to my 'box...

Anyone?

Bit more info re suitable 'boxes - I'm told the DGW is interchangeable with the EEP and CXY code boxes.

The DWG is a 2wd 5-speed 'box.

I am kind of in the same position, my gearbox has gotten noisy, it has two whines, one that does not change pitch with gear changes (just with road speed) and one that changes in pitch with gear selection. But is dead silent in neutral or with the clutch in (the gears are not loaded). Happens on engine over run in gear too. Sound started 30,000 miles ago, several thousand miles after a gear oil change (with VW OEM fluid). I was kind of hard on it in my earlier days, but have lightened up a lot on my driving style (no more burnouts around corners!) I am the original owner, so I know the car's history.

I have done some thinking about my situation. Here are my thoughts:

It may be possible that you are hearing something outside of the transaxle. I say this because you hear the noise in all the time while driving, even in neutral and with the clutch in. The gears are not loaded under these conditions, and the shaft bearings should get quite, I think. The most likely only other thing it could be would be an inner CV joint. Other possibilities would be tire noise, a front wheel bearing (they tend to change sound when loading the bearing by turning, though) or outter CV joint.

A whine can continue for a long time without causing problems. You may be able to drive for a year, two, or more, without fixing it. If it's inside the transaxle, using some product (like moly lube) designed for noisey gearboxes may help (I may try that). Also, if it is the transaxle, it could be a bad bearing, or bearings, or it could be a shaft pre-load issue (specifically a lack of preload). It may even a cracked case that caused pre-load to lessen. That may not be rebuildable. There are three pre-loads to set and the case has to be opened up to check them and shim them to specifications. Input shaft, output shaft and the final drive. Bottom line, if its inside the gearbox, no telling what it could be, so figure on paying for a complete rebuild or finding a used transaxle. If you go either route, make sure its the same code and subcode as the one in the car.

I have elected to wait and see what happens with mine, and at the same time keeping my eye out for a low mileage used transaxle at a good price. If my situation worsens, I will consider buying a rebuilt transaxle or having mine rebuilt, depending on price and availability.

Since this is a Quattro, there might be something more unique about it. Are there any U-joints for drive shafts that could make noise?

I can not address your question about how to remove your particular transaxle.

--Nate

Thanks Nate, There is a lot that can go wrong with a gearbox!
One other piece of information that I've unintentionally omitted is that we've had the car on a two post lift, engine running, and in gear. There's no noise from anywhere. We can stop a single wheel turning and there's no discernible play in any of the driveshafts or joints. I've been advised by two transmission specialists - independently - that the 'boxes fitted in these cars are susceptible to pinion bearing wear, sometimes starting as low as 80k miles (we have nearly 155k showing).

I sincerely hope it is the gearbox as I've ordered a replacement; I found a completely recon gearbox for a bank balance shattering £475+VAT. There's a surcharge of £150 for the old box which I'm happy to return.
I'm assured that the only old parts of the 'new' box are the casings... And that any parts that may have been riveted n the old box (I've no idea if there are any) have been replaced and it's all held together with stainless bolts.

Incidentally, I'll be using Fuchs Sintopoid fully synthetic 75W90 oil in the gearbox/front diff, and Hypoid EP90 mineral oil in the rear diff. VW/Audi have been no help whatsoever with oil and have actually been apologetic! They have no idea what the constitution of the oil is or it's specification. Not only does the bottle not list any information (other than a VAG spec code), it doesn't even say whether it's mineral, semi-synth, or fully synthetic! I took advice from someone who's been working with Quattros of all descriptions - Pikes Peak to TDis - for many years.

Aaaarghh!

Well, the fun continues. Located a recon gearbox. Spoke to folk over phone, quoting 'quattro', 'tdi', and 'DGW'.

"Yes sir, we have a DGW. Actually, it's a CXY but that's a later designation for the same gearbox." No problem - that's fine with me. The EEP is another that would fit - I think the common denominator is 0LA. (Providing the ratios are all correct, of course.)

Box arrives and doesn't look quite what I'd expect. Turns out to be a FEC, as fitted to the 11/00-12/04 A4 1.9TDi Avant.

I'm fuming. And waiting for more news from the supplier.

Tum-te-tum, tum-te-tum...