How necessary is a belly pan?

I have been looking for a second-hand belly pan, but haven't had any luck locating one.

Just wondering if it is really necessary?

Car is a lot more fun to drive since I removed it. It was vibrating and bouncing loudly and really needed to go. Should I replace it?

It keeps dirt and snow away from your turbo actuator and belt area, if nothing else... (important in the snow/salt belt...)

The plastic dust shield that came on the car is better than nothing, but... a solid metal (aluminum or steel) skid plate will protect your fragile oil pan... see Dieselgeek.com (Panzer), Evolution Import (Atlas) and Defender-Tech for options. Most would agree that it's relatively cheap insurance against getting stuck far from home... (although not a fool-proof or accident-proof armor shield)

Yuri

IMHO the Panzer (or equivalent) is utterly necessary.

Mine was put on almost immediately after I bought the car, and it has saved me from at least two oil pan punctures that could have been seriously nasty incidents -- BOTH on trips that were a hell of a long way from home.

In addition it has kept corrosion off components down there, which makes routine service and such a joy instead of outright torture. The value of the latter cannot be overestimated even if you never have an incident that would otherwise compromise your oil pan.

Finally it stiffens up the chassis more than a bit, which was immediately noticeable in road feel.

X2 to Genesis' comments. We have the Panzers on both of our cars.

genesis said:

imho the panzer (or equivalent) is utterly necessary.
Mine was put on almost immediately after i bought the car, and it has saved me from at least two oil pan punctures that could have been seriously nasty incidents -- both on trips that were a hell of a long way from home.
In addition it has kept corrosion off components down there, which makes routine service and such a joy instead of out tight torture. The value of the latter cannot be overestimated even if you never have an incident that would otherwise compromise your oil pan.
Finally it stiffens up the chassis more than a bit, which was immediately noticeable in road feel.

Click to expand...

x3!!.....

VWs tend to be pretty low to the ground, at least my passat is very low stock. I've hit chunks of ice in the winter that other cars just pass over and clear, even bottomed out on speed bumps, coming in/out of parking lots, unlevel roads a couple of times (street car tracks just this week) and heard the skid plate take it every time. If it wasn't for the plate, the oil pan would have busted by now. The plate does take away an inch or two of clearance especially if you use the nylon washers I guess (after speed bumps I didnt bottom out without the plate, I could hear the skid plate hitting the ground if I went over it at the speed I used to without the plate). Im sure my oil pan would be toast by now without it.

Get a skid plate, you wont regret it. But above all, slow down when there are imperfections in the road or bumps of any kind.

Do it. Every oil change I see new scrapes. Thankfully not any real dents. New Panzer plate when installed:

csteve said:

I have been looking for a second-hand belly pan, but haven't had any luck locating one.

Just wondering if it is really necessary?

Car is a lot more fun to drive since I removed it. It was vibrating and bouncing loudly and really needed to go. Should I replace it?

Click to expand...

The problem isn't the stock "belly Pan". The problem is the low ground clearance of the Mk-4 platform.

Ruptured oil pans is the least of the problems of the Mk-4.
The honest solution is to install a lift-kit in conjunction with refreshing the suspension (struts & shocks).

The metal skid-plate is not the solution it is nothing but a Band-Aid fix,
The skid plate does not solve the problem and at times may even exasperate the problem and add to even further damage.

Thanks for all the advice.

I am just about ready to pull the trigger on the panzer with side skirts. I don't see any sense in replacing the plastic side skirts with plastic side skirts. They skirt failed once and would only fail again.

With or without oil drain window?

I might finally start doing my own oil changes, and was thinking about using the vacuum method. How does the Panzer removable plate that stores in place (i.e., drill your own hole to secure with a screw) hold up?

Evolution seems to do a better job in this area. Unfortunately, they only reinforce the side skirt, but mine is all busted up already.

Defender-tech website doesn't load, so nothing to compare.
ID Parts has a metal belly with plastic skirts, but it is essentially the same price as the full aluminum Panzer. The unit weight is a lot lighter, too, which I wonder if it is a typo. Does anyone know what is the sound absorption option that they offer? Theirs is cut most closely to resemble the original part, however, if that matters.

Herm TDI said:

The honest solution is to install a lift-kit in conjunction with refreshing the suspension (struts & shocks).

Click to expand...

I agree!
My wallet and wife, however, have a contrary opinion.

…eventually.

It's been an expensive car year already (2K on mine and 2K on hers), and two tuitions due this month.

Koni Reds and a lift kit could keep car happy for a long while.

Get the oil drain window, always nice to have the option to long drain the oil. I personally went with the Panzer with FMJ, love it and highly recommend it. Follow the instructions and take your time.

Herm TDI said:

The problem isn't the stock "belly Pan". The problem is the low ground clearance of the Mk-4 platform.

Ruptured oil pans is the least of the problems of the Mk-4.
The honest solution is to install a lift-kit in conjunction with refreshing the suspension (struts & shocks).

The metal skid-plate is not the solution it is nothing but a Band-Aid fix,
The skid plate does not solve the problem and at times may even exasperate the problem and add to even further damage.

Click to expand...

Agreed, I maintain my suspension and still have the OE oil pan that came with the car after 300K miles. I still have the OE plastic pan too.

I change my oil from the top and didn't get the plate with the window as a result.

No regrets. If I want access to the bottom I want to inspect everything anyway, which means the plate has to come off. It does, easily, in a couple of minutes, so from my perspective there is no reason to do the door thing.

The only thing the plastic pan is good for is concealing fluid leaks for months at a time.

Get the panzer, yes these cars are low, raising them an inch or so is almost pointless, about two weeks ago the pickup in front of me straddled a dead woodchuck. When that fat groundhog cleared the rear of his truck the only place to go was the opposing car filled lane.
Without the skid plate my pan would have cracked I hit that hard.

Any body ever come around a corner and have someone's firewood stratigacelly placed in the center of the road? How about this past winter and chunks of ice falling off trucks. If you still have an original pan after several hundred thousand miles you live a charmed life.

It's nearly impossible out here in the country.

i've got 210k on mine, never even had the original plastic belly pan. not since i bought it at 61k, anyway. still the exposed, original oil pan is intact. lucky me. oh, but i live in san diego, where firewood, rocks, and ice are rarely an issue. as well as dead woodchucks

Genesis said:

IMHO the Panzer (or equivalent) is utterly necessary.

Mine was put on almost immediately after I bought the car, and it has saved me from at least two oil pan punctures that could have been seriously nasty incidents -- BOTH on trips that were a hell of a long way from home.

In addition it has kept corrosion off components down there, which makes routine service and such a joy instead of outright torture. The value of the latter cannot be overestimated even if you never have an incident that would otherwise compromise your oil pan.

Finally it stiffens up the chassis more than a bit, which was immediately noticeable in road feel.

Click to expand...

I drove almost 10 years with stock pan. It was falling apart, so I replaced with aluminum pan. Man have I been lucky, I never really hit much but this past winter, it was a relentless onslaught of ice chunks (aka road apples) and without the aluminum pan, I would have had multiple oil pan disasters. If you want peace of mind, get the panzer(or equivalent).

I don't know anyone with a MKIV in Edmonton that hasn't lost their plastic shield at some point in winter. It happened twice to my friend, and once to me. The comical part is that the dealership charged my friend more for the plastic shield than a shop did for the metal skid plate.

Panzer Plate

In looking at Dieselgeeks video it says something to the effect of " Really needed for your MKIV engine protection". I assume with a 2014 JSW MKVI it's not necessary? Is the MKVI higher or better protected?

I just installed the Dielselgeek Panzer Plate on my Mk VI '14 Golf Wagon last night. It took a little longer than I had anticipated but wasn't "difficult" - though one or two steps are a bit finicky (loosening the bumper bolt, for one). The weirdest thing about the whole process was crawling around under a 3- week old car. I've never been under a car that clean before.

I spend a fair amount of time driving on dirt/gravel fire roads, and in the winter where death cookies are constantly lying in wait. To me the skid plate was a no-brainer.

Herm TDI said:

The honest solution is to install a lift-kit in conjunction with refreshing the suspension (struts & shocks).

Click to expand...

I like Herm's solution but I never got to installing a lift kit in my TDIs when I had them.

I agree the Mk4 TDIs sit low and the oil pan is the most vulnerable spot. I noticed the Mk6 (2010+) TDIs have more ground clearance under the engine. The belly pan on an Mk6 TDI is completely flat whereas an Mk4 TDI has to bend down to go under the oil pan. The bend has been eliminated in the newer TDIs. It looks like the bottom of the engine in the newer TDIs sit higher up in the engine compartment.

Although more expensive, I think the ultimate solution is to do BOTH. Install a 2 inch lift kit in an Mk4 TDI to lift it up and refresh the suspension while your at it. Then also install a Mk4 Panzer plate so you have some armor plating underneath to give some protection in case you can't avoid hitting something big in the road.

Good luck.

Thanks khai and n1das, both good thoughts. Think I'll do some more research and consider a plate.

these threads are all the same. but a suspension "refresh" still doesn't do anything if all the sudden a log or whatever comes into view and your only choice is a semi to the right or a barrier to the left. people who think otherwise are fools, are very lucky (but think they are smart)

Yeah, and swerving on an icy Canadian highway to avoid that giant brown ice hunk that just fell off the semi in front of you isn't advised either.

Skid plate on a MKIV is a must.

I put an Evo plate on my Mk5 shortly after I bought it and the number of gouges I have in it are a testimony to the many times it saved my oil pan. Most recently a big rock laying in the middle of the road and I didn't see it in time to swerve around it. It made such loud bang and commotion passing under the car I was certain it must have damaged something but all it did was add another dent and gouge.

I would consider using a skid plate together with and over the top of the original plastic one as long as it isn't broken since it does a much better job of sealing up the engine compartment from road spray than the metal plate by itself which leaves the wheel well sides wide open.

These threads are a lot alike: Some people say belly pans are unnecessary, and others swear by their skid plates. And I'll chime in, as I usually do, and say that neither my sons or I have ever had any problems with factory belly pans on cars in New England. Between us that's over a half million miles of driving. The original on my wagon finally gave up the ghost two years ago, replaced it with one of the lightweight aluminum ones we sell, and all's good. My younger son even got run off the road last winter in Western MA in his '00 Golf and didn't break the oil pan. Maybe we're lucky. But one thing a lot of skid plate fans don't mention is that most plates end up closer to the ground than the factory pan. So of course it hits things, things that you'd probably go right over if it wasn't there. We bought my son's Golf with an Evolution skid plate and it was very close to the road, although, like everything else on the car, it was probably installed wrong.

But I know I'm not going to change any minds here. The only thing I will add for the OP is that the belly pan (or skid plate) keeps your turbo, alternator, A/C compressor, power steering pump, and other bits cleaner than they would be without it. Sure, someone in SoCal can drive around without one, but in New England I think it's helpful.

I will chime in too. I have customer with the skid plate on and have used Peters lower aluminum replacement to replace broken stock ones. If you drive your car hard go skid plate at some point you are going to bonce of some thing. It dos drop your ground clearance by 1/2 inch. Peters aluminum one is very nice and cheaper then the stock one and will take a hit with out cracking. I think when VW added the bottom covers it was more about sound than any thing for the diesel.
Bob Mann

Skid plates are a great addition for the occaisional unforseen obstacles in the road, BUT, they will never be a replacement for driving in a way that allows some driver reaction time.
In other words, "BACK OFF JACK".

If nothing else, use the belly pan to keep things clean.

I ran the car for a couple months in the winter without the belly pan because I was "in between" some maintenance work. I just finished yanking the transmission to replace the flywheel and the case is FILTHY. Everything inside the engine bay is dirty, dusty, grimy, gross, disgusting, etc. All that grime makes it harder to visually inspect things, find oil leaks, exhaust leaks, etc.

I have a lot of scrubbing to do, brb.

ugenetoo said:

they will never be a replacement for driving in a way that allows some driver reaction time.

Click to expand...

There are many areas of the world where, if you followed the proper etiquette and left the appropriate distance between you and the next car, you'd be driving backwards...


Yuri

Chalk another in the metal plate column.

Both TDIs of mine have had Dieselgeek plates installed. My first TDI got the STEEL plate (Geez that thing weighed a ton) after cracking the SECOND oil pan on something. You don't always have to be actually off-road to be off-roading... Sometimes the Gowanus Parkway qualifies.

TDI #2 (my current wagon) somehow miraculously survived 244k miles with the original owner and nought but the plastic pan down there... I put the Panzer aluminum shield in place - cut a drain hole for the tranny and got the factory hole for the oil. That plate has collected an IMPRESSIVE amount of scrapes in it, a testament to protecting my oil pan and engine.

I didn't get the side shields, and I don't have the plastic ones anymore either. That is one thing I may have to fix.