Newbie Looking For Some Advice

Hi folks,
As you can see I am new here but I have been lurking for quite a while as I have been looking to purchase a TDI. I finally found what I think might be the one but now I am getting nervous.
Here's what I am looking at: the car is a 2004 Passat TDI GLS Wagon with 78k miles. Vehicle is in excellent shape with all service records but has NOT had the timing belt replaced and has NOT had the balance shaft upgrade done.
My question is whether this is a good vehicle to get knowing that I will be dropping 3k+ very soon on the BS and TB, or should I just look for a TDI Jetta, or should I save another year and buy a new (or slightly used) sportwagon TDI? Price was listed at $12500 but I offered $11000 based on the upcoming services.
I really appreciate any input you folks can give me.
Thanks,
Taylor

Great car once the necessary upgrades are completed. I'd go for it, but keep in mind prices are high now due to reactionary people with regards to current fuel prices.

I love mine, 112k miles so far and is fantastic.

Thanks oilhammer, been reading through your posts for the last 5hrs straight getting up to speed on this upgrade; you certainly are a wealth of knowledge here. You mentioned that prices are currently high based on fuel, two questions 1) in your opinion is the vehicle worth $11K as stated and 2) when are gas prices coming down

Taylor, welcome to Fred's! The B5.5 Passat is kind of a unique animal here in the USA in terms of diesel cars. You should decide how important interior volume is. Furthermore, make yourself aware of the other "issues" that have been showing up recently with them.

Also, I wonder whether that discount is adequate in light of near-term work. Happy hunting!

Thanks dieseldorf, reality is I have been looking for a Jetta TDI Wagon all this time and just happened upon this passat and figured 'even better'; maybe not?
I am wondering the same re: the price, which, I might add he has not yet accepted. I guess the question remains, should I change gears and continue my search for a jetta tdi wagon, save for another year and buy a new or newer sportwagon, or go with this one?

taylor3633 said:

Thanks dieseldorf, reality is I have been looking for a Jetta TDI Wagon all this time and just happened upon this passat and figured 'even better'; maybe not?
I am wondering the same re: the price, which, I might add he has not yet accepted. I guess the question remains, should I change gears and continue my search for a jetta tdi wagon, save for another year and buy a new or newer sportwagon, or go with this one?

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Drive them all to see what suits your fancy. Plus, figure out what will work best for your use.

Personally, The Passat is roomier and a great highway car. Its downsides are less MPG and a some upfront design issues (Balance Shaft). It also has an Audi front suspension which may be costlier to rebuild when it needs it. Owners of these cars prefer them to the Jetta wagons based on size and comfort (in general).

The newer Jetta/Golf TDIs (2009 - 2011) are nice but are plagued with a fuel system that has no tolerance for anything but the best fuel. (Search HPFP failure).

The 2012 models are untested as of yet.

aja8888 said:

It also has an Audi front suspension which may be costlier to rebuild when it needs it.

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In Quebec, it's not a matter of may be but will be thanks to our rough roads. I've had to redo ours. There are 8 control arms and when the bushings to the entire control arm has to be replaced. I did ours on two separate occasions, in which 4 arms were replaced. Over $1000 each time. When they go, it sounds like you're driving a clapped-out Cavalier.

PlaneCrazy said:

In Quebec, it's not a matter of may be but will be thanks to our rough roads. I've had to redo ours. There are 8 control arms and when the bushings to the entire control arm has to be replaced. I did ours on two separate occasions, in which 4 arms were replaced. Over $1000 each time. When they go, it sounds like you're driving a clapped-out Cavalier.

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Fortunately, down here in Texas where I drive a lot of freeways that only see rain, that suspension should last a long time. I feel your pain though.

We do not see a whole heck of a lot of front suspension issues with the B5s here, either. The earlier ones were much worse, they even had a recall on 1998 Passats for outer tie rod ends. It is the B5's big brother, the C5 (sold here as the 1997 through 2004 Audi A6) is harder on those components, especially the V8s. Upper links and tie rod ends are usually the bits that need attention first. Not terribly difficult to do, but the front end alignment is VERY specific to these cars due to the raised toe settings.

It saddens me how much you see people with V8 A6s, cars that MSRP'd well over $60k new, whine when their car needs $1000 worth of suspension work at 100k miles. Some people should just stick to Kias.

maybe someone could list the differences between the earlier production and late production b5.5's so as to advise a potential buyer as to whether to look for a late production 2005, other than physical age.

taylor3633 said:

My question is whether this is a good vehicle to get knowing that I will be dropping 3k+ very soon on the BS and TB, or should I just look for a TDI Jetta, or should I save another year and buy a new (or slightly used) sportwagon TDI? Price was listed at $12500 but I offered $11000 based on the upcoming services.

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I actually just went through this thought process. I was looking at Jettas and stumbled across the Passat. Even with the BSM issue, I am glad I went with the PAssat. I commute about 3 hours/day and the Passat is much more comfortable. The MK 4 Jettas are just like any Jetta before them, noisy and small. The Mk 5's are much improved but still a little too noisy for me. It was hard to find a 2006 Jetta that wasn't in need of serious maintenance.

As far as price, you have to figure out what is fair to you. There has definitely been a premium placed on used diesel vehicles over the last 5 years. With rising gas prices, more people will be seeking them out.

The previous owner of my Passat told me he was looking at new car. I used Kelly Blue book and NADA trade in values to see what he would get if he traded it in. Then I looked at private party prices and retail prices to help determine what the ball park value of the car would be. We ended up higher than trade in and a little less than private party. It actually was very close to the Edmund's fair market value price.

As far as diesels, they only sold them here in 2004 and 2005.

The only differences are:

coolant fill cap

2004s had door sill trim, deleted in 2005

2004s used 15" alloy wheels, 2005s used 16" or optional 17" (both GL trim models used the same 15" steelies, however).

at some point the egr cooler was changed, but that was in 2005 I believe. was the eariler cooler bad or just a supplier change?

the stability control changed name, different software early to late?

All BHWs use the same EGR cooler, 038-131-513-S. There were several software updates, but that is a moot point as even the newest BHW car has had at least two of those since it left the factory with regards to the glow plug fiasco.

To the OP:
Between the MKIV Jetta wagon and the B5.5 Passat wagon you are looking at probably the most desired TDI models with the least amount of supply in the marketplace. Makes for a sellers market which is compounded by rising petroleum costs.
I drive an '00 Golf, put 140k on it since Feb '05 (same platform/suspension as Jetta). Fantastic car, great fun to drive and mod, but IMO suspension is its weakest point. Two years at 90k I replaced EVERYTHING (struts, ball joints, tie rod ends, all mounts and bushings). 100k on suspension rebuild and its now time to do rear axle bushings, struts, and replace springs, could have easily justified doing it 20k ago but funds did not allow.
I have not owned a B5.5, but have driven many. GREAT car to drive, even more so as a TDI. IMO in all phases the suspension is far superior to the MKIV's. Add in the extra interior space/comfort and car becomes even more appealing.
BUT as compared to the MKIV it comes with a cost of approx 10-15mpg (depending ondriving style), plus the added privilege of absorbing the cost of a BSM upgrade, 50/50 chance at transmission replacement, potential cam issues, and an expensive suspension to refresh.
Having said all that two weeks ago I put 1800 miles on my Golf in 2 days and my posterior still feels like cement. I'm buying a B5.5 TDI when the correct opportunity presents itself. Golf has been/still is a great car but my skinny a$$ needs more comfort.

I will give you my take. I regularly drive 250 up to 500 miles in a given day. The Passat is by far one of the bext riding/driving cars I have had and even after 10 hours in the car I feel pretty good. I drove the Jetta and was convinced I was going to get a Jetta wagon based on mpg's etc and then drove the Passat and it was no comparision ride wise and that has been proven be true. The car still rides and drives like when I got it. They are not perfect and cost money to keep going, but are good cars. I still have not found anything better to replace it with for overall mpg, size, ride and style. Regards PJ

I really appreciate everyone's input on this issue and I am still working on getting this vehicle! That being said it will be an adjustment for me as my wife and I both drive toyota's w/ 100+k miles that have never needed anything other than routine maintenance. We will be replacing my wife's corolla with this vehicle because we need more space for dog, ski's, bikes, camping gear, and soon enough (hopefully) a child.
Thanks again!

Mech644, you might consider Recaro seats. The previous owner installed them in my Jetta Wagon and I find them extremely comfortable for long trips.

I also have a 2000 Golf, and I love it dearly but the 2004 Passat we have is far superior on the road (but keep in mind the Golf is far superior than many other cars, too).

But I drive the Golf most days because it easily bests the Passat's fuel use by about 10 MPG.

Taylor- glad to hear your prepared for a more "interactive" relationship with your upcoming VW. They are not set it/forget it/drive it vehicles, if your willing to buy in for the long term and keep a weather ear and eye on how the car feels and sounds you'll be just fine. They are vastly superior to anything in the same price class. The cars styling holds up well, 5-10 years from now when you role into a parking lot for a wedding/class reunion/bar mitvah you'll look fine, it'll never look like the reincarnation of an AMC Pacer.

Mike V- I've actually been THIS CLOSE to buying a set of Recaro's a number of times, something has always come up though. Even at their steep price a set of Recaro's is cheaper then car payments. If the biomass and pulpwood market picks up I may be able to squeeze some cash out of my woodlot.

I'm with you OH, think I'll keep the Golf around even a B5.5 finds it way into my yard.