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Go Back   TDIClub Forums > TDI Model Specific Discussions Areas > VW MKIV-A4 TDIs (VE and PD)

VW MKIV-A4 TDIs (VE and PD) This is a general discussion about A4/MkIV Jetta (99.5-~2005), Golf(99.5-2006), and New Beetle(98-2006). Both VE and PD engines are covered here.

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Old December 21st, 2012, 15:27   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richptl View Post
I won't gamble then and I'll pull the belly pan and side shield and turn at the crankshaft. I am changing injectors and one thing I had in mind was to use my Frostheater to warm the block a bit. Hoping that the block will heat up a few degrees warmer than the injector body to help with getting the injectors out. Running the engine to warm it up runs warm oil across the injector, plus the spring makes heat, and the injector pump makes heat. I've seen in other threads that the injectors pull easier on a warm engine, and I think the Frostheater method might make a teeny bit of difference in temp between cylinder head and injector body. I can do the same thing to put the new injectors in. Any thoughts pro or con?
warm might help .... I found that prying the injector body toward the clamp side helps as they tend to wear grooves into the head opposite the clamp and can hang up damaging the bore
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Old December 25th, 2012, 08:30   #32
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I've never had a problem getting the PD injectors out, hot or cold, using the puller. Jimbote's advice is good though, as I can see it happening. Because the injectors have O-rings that seal them, they don't seem to stick like something threaded (think glow plug) does.

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Old January 28th, 2013, 07:46   #33
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Thanks for the tips all I got the PD150's installed yesterday and car is running now. I'll have to check the idle stabilization #'s in a couple days with VCDS to see how well I did, but this lash check worked out easy. Some observations:

* Old PD100 038 130 073 BF injectors were stuck in pretty well. I turned them back and forth with vice grips holding onto the octagonal end of the injector solenoid and pulled. The motor was warmed up with my Frostheater. Warm, not hot.
* I did get the Bosch model injector seal kits which cost under $15 each, much less than the VW part #. The seals went on easily, careful not to roll them. Used Dieselpurge to lube them up.
* I had the used PD150 injectors soaking (old seals removed, new seals not on yet) for 1 1/2 weeks in Dieselpurge.

Another thing I did because I have a Racor 645 2 micron fuel filter with test ports and a gauge test port at the tandem pump, I installed a hose between Racor filter outlet and tandem pump outlet and ran a wire to the electric fuel pump. Ran several minutes and pushed about 2 quarts of fuel from return line into a gallon jug. Took hose off, hooked up fuel pump normally. Car started in 2 seconds and ran smoothly almost immediately.

There was some good fretting in the injector bores and the injectors on the side opposite the hold down clamp. I cleaned up the bore with emery cloth. Flushed that junk down into the cylinder with a small rinse with Dieselpurge. Blew all fuel out of cylinders with glow plugs pulled with a 2 second crank prior to the fuel prime.

Removing and installing my skid plate is a little tricky due to the side shield on the pulley end of the engine being a tight fit around my modified 1.8 T pancake pipe and beefed up intercooler piping.

I check MPG every fill-up and have been noticing a drop off this winter, down to about 40 mpg. I'll see what happens in the next few tankfulls with the PD150's.
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Old January 28th, 2013, 10:10   #34
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Wow, nice MPG numbers with the auto!
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Old May 9th, 2013, 12:26   #35
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Should injector lash be set with the engine hot or cold?
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Old May 9th, 2013, 18:16   #36
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I would say cold. Warm or hot settings are wayyyyy to difficult to complete before engines cool off... Plus it's not a scientific method
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Old May 9th, 2013, 19:18   #37
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Yeah I was thinking cold too.
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Old September 29th, 2013, 21:10   #38
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Default valve setting, any help please

Quote:
Originally Posted by apples12 View Post
Apologies for thread revival...
i'm going to be doing this procedure on my mk5 as it wasnt done when we changed the injectors 22,000 miles ago and i'm trying to eliminate things for my current 'best' of 43mpg (UK) motorway mileage....
am i correct in understanding the procedure is as follows:
1) remove rocker cover
2) Rotate CAM using 18mm spanner until the rear of the roller of the rocker arm is at its highest point... (thus compressing the injector the most)
3) screw the adjusting screw in all the way in until resistance is felt
4) turn the adjusting screw BACK 180 degrees
5) maintain position of adjusting screw and tighten the lock nut
6) repeat the procedure 1-5 with the other 3 injectors
i'm guessing the use of the dial gauge in the bentley manual/vw workshop manual is to ensure the rocker follower is at its highest point and the injector is compressed the most?
many thanks for any help

What is the correct method for the job? which is the order of valves adjustment 1,3,4 2 or 4,3,2,1? Could someone please describe the method BENTLEY.
My valve setting is fail, I use a dial indicator and 1,3,4,2 order, but failed. When last valve is adjusted (number two) the valves 1 and 3 are very big gap.
Thank you very much!!!!!

*sorry for my English!*
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Old December 3rd, 2014, 18:36   #39
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Item number #2 on Apples12 is incorrect.

The cam should not be turned until the injector is completely compressed. If you do this you will cause an interference condition, which may break the timing belt and/or bend the valves.

Valve lash - like injector lash - needs to be performed when the cam is on base circle (when the the injector lobe is at lowest point). If you read the instructions at the top of the post, Frank06 tells you to do lash when the intake lobe is at it's highest point relative to the head (and then the injector is on it's lowest point on the cam) - but it SHOULD BE DONE when the intake valve is closing, which makes the exhaust valve lobe the thing that is highest above the head that you must align with the roller pivot . If you look at Frank06's picture again, you will see that the EXHAUST valve lobe should be right across from the injectors roller pivot. Frank06 said as much in his post (about the intake lobe, but should be the exhaust lobe), if you are careful to read it.

Again, the injector lobe needs to be at it's lowest point, which is just after the intake valve closes and the exhaust lobe lines up with the roller pivot on the injector rocker arm (motor turns clockwise at the crank bolt). After you back off the lash by 180 degrees, the rocker arm should have just a little play in it. If you turn the motor over by hand (twice, to make sure there is no interference in the motor), the rocker arm should NEVER be loose except for a little bit of play when it is on base circle.

If you don't know which is the exhaust lobe, line up the valve with the exhaust manifold, you will see which is the exhaust and which is the intake for every cylinder.

Yes, I know I am dredging up an old post, but since I was doing injector install and injector lash on a BLS/BRM motor swap- and this is the first post that my search on injector lash showed up - I thought it might be important to correct before someone trashes their engine.

I also looked through the Bentley manual and a Haynes manual - they both have it wrong too. Yes, it is possible for people to make a mistake printing out the manual, and it can be propagated throughout other reference materials. I attepmted it their way initially, but the engine locked up and the spring inside the timing belt idler stretched (causing the timing belt timing to become incorrect). The way they have it posted in the reference material is simply wrong.

Last edited by tdivaughn; December 19th, 2014 at 11:32.
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Old March 11th, 2015, 18:39   #40
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Just did this today . The injectors were untouched since the factory
Inj quantity deviation had been increasing for 3 cylinders
I found the lock nuts definitely not torqued to spec. I readjusted the injectors ( Thanks Frank06) and the values came down to some degree
It is definitely a good idea to check them especially on a high mileage vehicle and maybe compensate for wear on the ball studs
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Old March 11th, 2015, 18:45   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdivaughn View Post
Item number #2 on Apples12 is incorrect.

The cam should not be turned until the injector is completely compressed. If you do this you will cause an interference condition, which may break the timing belt and/or bend the valves.

Valve lash - like injector lash - needs to be performed when the cam is on base circle (when the the injector lobe is at lowest point). If you read the instructions at the top of the post, Frank06 tells you to do lash when the intake lobe is at it's highest point relative to the head (and then the injector is on it's lowest point on the cam) - but it SHOULD BE DONE when the intake valve is closing, which makes the exhaust valve lobe the thing that is highest above the head that you must align with the roller pivot . If you look at Frank06's picture again, you will see that the EXHAUST valve lobe should be right across from the injectors roller pivot. Frank06 said as much in his post (about the intake lobe, but should be the exhaust lobe), if you are careful to read it.

Again, the injector lobe needs to be at it's lowest point, which is just after the intake valve closes and the exhaust lobe lines up with the roller pivot on the injector rocker arm (motor turns clockwise at the crank bolt). After you back off the lash by 180 degrees, the rocker arm should have just a little play in it. If you turn the motor over by hand (twice, to make sure there is no interference in the motor), the rocker arm should NEVER be loose except for a little bit of play when it is on base circle.

If you don't know which is the exhaust lobe, line up the valve with the exhaust manifold, you will see which is the exhaust and which is the intake for every cylinder.

Yes, I know I am dredging up an old post, but since I was doing injector install and injector lash on a BLS/BRM motor swap- and this is the first post that my search on injector lash showed up - I thought it might be important to correct before someone trashes their engine.

I also looked through the Bentley manual and a Haynes manual - they both have it wrong too. Yes, it is possible for people to make a mistake printing out the manual, and it can be propagated throughout other reference materials. I attepmted it their way initially, but the engine locked up and the spring inside the timing belt idler stretched (causing the timing belt timing to become incorrect). The way they have it posted in the reference material is simply wrong.
This post makes no sense
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Old September 18th, 2015, 08:49   #42
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This post makes no sense I agree..
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Old August 16th, 2016, 15:14   #43
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It is very confusing. I had my injectors reconditioned and cleaned by a bosch authorised garage and they told me to lash the injectors I must turn back 270degrees. Here they say 180 degrees. Did they say 270 because they spray heavier atomised diesel? I times the injectors at 180 degrees and result is no power until 2800revs and lots of vibration until the engine boosts. Dmf is new and all vacuum pipes are new. Turbo is perfect also. I guess it is all about the injector/Rocker arm clearance. 180, 225 or 270 degrees?? I have a 2.0ltr tdi 16v BKD 2006 model. Any help would be appreciated. Tyanu888@hotmail.com
Thanks.
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Old August 16th, 2016, 16:19   #44
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270 was the early instructions for PD. Later instructions say 180. No hardware changes so most do 180 now.
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Old February 23rd, 2017, 08:18   #45
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BEW with 270k on the clock.. did timing belt and camshaft change on the car over an evening fired up the car (cam sensor code came active when I washed the engine prior to beginning this project and a new one is on the way)

I have a 0 in the torsion value due to no cam sensor.. was 1.5 before I started this. My friend and I ran across this thread and thought "why not at least check them".

Inj 3 took a turn and a half of adjustment while the other three took only half a turn. Now the idle fuel deviation is way off compared to where it was.

Is this value something that the engine will have to trim back once the cam sensor is in place and the torsion value is set? I assume it is so unhappy at the moment due to lack of knowledge of where the cam is.

Sorry.. I know this is lengthy.. I intend to post elsewhere as well.
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