CR engine HPFP analysis

eddif

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2006
Location
MS
TDI
2004 Jetta PD Automatic
Multiple HPFP damage points

For example having a steel forger change a heat treat process slightly to obtain a higher finished hardness would not necessitate a part number change.
Personally I feel the problem is in the supplier consistent material arena and not in the design of the part.
Seeing and reading all of the posts with metal shavings in the filter and the fuel tank is a strong indicator that someone in the supply chain was not following constant/consistent heating/cooling practices with the steel. You do not test every part in a lot, just a representative sample.
You are looking at the steel treatment rather than the design. That can be a good viewpoint. Here is another viewpoint about the design of a steel part run in an aluminum cylinder. He also brings up the first flakes seen in the filter may be aluminum instead of steel. I guess a magnet would decide if the first filter housing flakes are steel or aluminum? Since an aluminum particle will tend to float more (?) we still may not know from the filter inspection which came first, even if we know which arrives at the filter first. Steel released first can cause aluminum release. Aluminum released first can cause steel roller problems. In one case the aluminum is first, but in the other case the steel is first. Fail, Fail either way.

This shore ain't agona be no easy task. LOL


It just struck me this morning at 5am. Something that has always puzzled me. Where do those initial metal particles come from? So far I have been of the belief that lack of lubrication of the roller starts the whole failure off. The roller heats up and starts to shed metal which turns into a cascading effect that sometimes ends in catastropic failure of the hpfp.

Here is my new theory. Its still a lack of lubrication,but what I'm thinking now is that the piston cup and piston cup bore are responsible for the making of the first metal particulates that develope in the fuel system. The piston cup being made of steel and the piston bore being made of aluminum. Once there is insuffient lubrication between the piston cup and piston bore the harder steel starts to wear the aluminum bore. Hence the fine metal particles that are found on the fuel filter top. Minimal wear that really doesn't have much affect on the fuel system. Conversely if this contact area between the piston cup and piston bore becomes too dry due to lack of lubrication the aluminum bore starts to wear dramatically. Once enough metal is made in this manner,some of it may become trapped between the roller and the roller holder. Tolerances are very close in this area as the roller rides on a thin film of fuel. Any particles large enough to wedge between the roller and roller holder start to score the roller making more metal particles. Once the roller is scared up enough it starts to wear the cam. From there on out it ain't pretty. Game over.

So, its still a lubricity problem,but I now believe it is the hpfp aluminum case w/ the steel piston cup running inside that precipitates the failure.

dweisel
LUBRICITY,LUBRICITY,LUBRICITY!
If you look at the first photo in a viewer.

You can notice the roller assembly is scuffed up.

So if we look at several failures we will find out which comes first, second third etc. And then one failure may start one place and another failure start another.

We have:
Roller damage
Roller cup damage
Roller outer sleeve damage (?)
Aluminum bore scuffing
Aluminum released
Steel released

I guess we are to the point of looking at each individual failure and try to see how many damage areas have occured and the order they took place.

You are all getting some pretty good information in to sift through.

This from VWSHPFRMN is interesting too.


I think his text tells just the roller was really the only failure. If the thing was that hot how long before the aluminum scuffing starts?

Mercy

eddif
 

wjam

Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2010
Location
France
TDI
Audi A4 quattro 3.0TDi
CR pump problems

Hi All,

i have just found this thread and it is extremely interesting.

I have a 3.0TDi Audi A4 (almost same as the Q7 motor, but the pump is a Bosch CP3)

I too have been having numerous problems since about 80000 miles (I'm now on 95K.. I bought a large diesel expecting 250000 miles plus without problems.. I now am seriously thinking about going back to an old fashioned petrol engine, no turbo, no nothing fancy). However, back to the case in hand... my problems are related to engine stalling off throttle. It seems to be largely related to the inlet metering valve (which amazingly is not available separately) but I will be extremely interested to look for signs of wear.

After fighting with Audi for the past 6 months I have bought my own replacement pump (new, for considerably less than Audi charge) and will have it installed by an independent garage. The bonus of this approach is that I will keep the old pump. Audi would not allow this to happen (interesting)

I will let you all know what I find in due course... But I'm glad i did not opt to try an "upgrade" to the newer pump you guys are all using cos it looks like a nightmare. On the face of it the CP3 seems relatively reliable except for the inlet valve which looks, on the exterior at least, the same design as on the pump on this forum.

My biggest problem (apart from the appalling service offered by Audi) is that, how is the average punter supposed to know what quality of diesel enters their car via the fuel pump? If these pumps are so fragile (regarding fuel contamination) then either the car companies or the fuel companies will have to address the issue. But at this time neither shows much willingness. I also see many issues on other forums related to high pressure diesel pumps for various makes of car, so i think the can of worms is just starting to open regarding common rail.

ciao

WJAM
 

ronaldleemhuis

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 17, 2010
Location
Erie, PA
TDI
2010 Jetta TDI
So, its still a lubricity problem,but I now believe it is the hpfp aluminum case w/ the steel piston cup running inside that precipitates the failure.

dweisel
LUBRICITY,LUBRICITY,LUBRICITY!
It would be helpful to know whether a magnet will pick up the metal particles in the fuel filter. Maybe that could distinguish aluminum from steel.
 

aja8888

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 25, 2007
Location
Texas..RETIRED 12/31/17
TDI
Out of TDI's
Hi All,

i have just found this thread and it is extremely interesting.

I have a 3.0TDi Audi A4 (almost same as the Q7 motor, but the pump is a Bosch CP3)

I too have been having numerous problems since about 80000 miles (I'm now on 95K.. I bought a large diesel expecting 250000 miles plus without problems.. I now am seriously thinking about going back to an old fashioned petrol engine, no turbo, no nothing fancy). However, back to the case in hand... my problems are related to engine stalling off throttle. It seems to be largely related to the inlet metering valve (which amazingly is not available separately) but I will be extremely interested to look for signs of wear.

After fighting with Audi for the past 6 months I have bought my own replacement pump (new, for considerably less than Audi charge) and will have it installed by an independent garage. The bonus of this approach is that I will keep the old pump. Audi would not allow this to happen (interesting)

I will let you all know what I find in due course... But I'm glad i did not opt to try an "upgrade" to the newer pump you guys are all using cos it looks like a nightmare. On the face of it the CP3 seems relatively reliable except for the inlet valve which looks, on the exterior at least, the same design as on the pump on this forum.

My biggest problem (apart from the appalling service offered by Audi) is that, how is the average punter supposed to know what quality of diesel enters their car via the fuel pump? If these pumps are so fragile (regarding fuel contamination) then either the car companies or the fuel companies will have to address the issue. But at this time neither shows much willingness. I also see many issues on other forums related to high pressure diesel pumps for various makes of car, so i think the can of worms is just starting to open regarding common rail.

ciao


WJAM

Thanks, looks like this is more than a '09 - '10 VW pump issue then. It's been mentioned here that it may be a U.S. issue.
 

wjam

Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2010
Location
France
TDI
Audi A4 quattro 3.0TDi
HPFP US issue

I don't think it's a US only issue at all.. or indeed related to VW specifically.

I suspect (and hope I'm wrong) that there is an endemic issue with common rail cars and fuel quality that punters have no control over.

However on this particular pump I think you guys might be on to something regarding the aluminium sleeve vs steel piston. This looks like a cost cutting measure on manufacturing.

My pump appears to have a steel body, and I notice it is widely used in US trucks (who have reported the same issue as me).

But the newer cars (Audi / VW) all have a pump of this or similar design as mentioned on this thread.

But my car has been a complete nightmare... And Audi just want to relieve me of cash to fix a problem that I think will continue to grow. They won't even guarantee they fix it.

I do admire you guys in digging into this with some determination. I have tried in vain to raise some interest on UK and French forums. I have zero responses over here..

good luck

WJAM
 

HornetHandler

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2010
Location
Canada
TDI
2010 Jetta TDI
Thanks, looks like this is more than a '09 - '10 VW pump issue then. It's been mentioned here that it may be a U.S. issue.
aja888

What the H**L is the picture in your signature block???
I'v been looking at it and just can't figure it out.


Mack
 

St.Hubbins

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Location
Nashville
TDI
'10 Golf, DSG / '11 A3, DSG (both went buyback) - '15 GSW SE
:D:D:D Yeah, it's too bad VW didn't make the HPFP as sturdy and wear resistant as the Stryker titanium and ceramic implant in my hip joint!:D
not sure i'd trust a hip named after Ted Stryker... "No dice, Chicago!":D
 

aja8888

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 25, 2007
Location
Texas..RETIRED 12/31/17
TDI
Out of TDI's
Wasn't there a recall on Stryker hip and knee replacements?
Wish there was a recall on HPFP....
Not on the one I have....:cool:

HornetH: It's fine and been in a year now. I can do anything I did when I was younger. I don't even think about it these days. :)

Mr Hubbins: The trust needs to be in the surgeon, too!:D
 

eddif

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2006
Location
MS
TDI
2004 Jetta PD Automatic
Is there anyone who can draw up some fuel flow diagrams? We are not allowed to just post the ones VW has done for their presentation material.
If we get some fair quality drawings, done by a member, we can set about using a drawing with the discussions.

I want to discuss where to place low pressure filters to trap wear materials. I believe there is a way to stop most wear materials from going throughout the whole system, especially being recirculated back to the inlet to the HPFP, but I want input from others to do this. If the tank is kept free of most metal shavings the cost of service will be greatly reduced. I am not assured everyone will agree, but some discussions will at least help us understand the existing system. Right now there is no adequate filtering of return fuel. If the wear is taking place in the HPFP then the wear materials must be filtered out before returning to the tank. I remember some of this starting to be discussed and then quitting. This needs to be talked all the way through.

eddif
 

eddif

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2006
Location
MS
TDI
2004 Jetta PD Automatic
One of the most simple thoughts I have had about the HPFP is this.

The roller assembly may not have enough clearance in the aluminum pump bore. Although we would normally think the aluminum bore would expand quicker than the steel; there may be a way for the steel to expand quicker than the bore. There have been several discussions by dweisel on how hot the roller assembly got. If localized heat from gasoline almost instantly heated the roller assembly it might expand enough to partially sieze in the bore. The metals being different might be part of it but the factory allowed clearance might not be enough. A simple hone job to give more clearance might help prevent the severe wear.

eddif
 

ziggy55

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 2, 2006
Location
Montreal, QC
TDI
2010 Golf TDI
Is there anyone who can draw up some fuel flow diagrams? We are not allowed to just post the ones VW has done for their presentation material.
If we get some fair quality drawings, done by a member, we can set about using a drawing with the discussions.

I want to discuss where to place low pressure filters to trap wear materials. I believe there is a way to stop most wear materials from going throughout the whole system, especially being recirculated back to the inlet to the HPFP, but I want input from others to do this. If the tank is kept free of most metal shavings the cost of service will be greatly reduced. I am not assured everyone will agree, but some discussions will at least help us understand the existing system. Right now there is no adequate filtering of return fuel. If the wear is taking place in the HPFP then the wear materials must be filtered out before returning to the tank. I remember some of this starting to be discussed and then quitting. This needs to be talked all the way through.

eddif

How about a high pressure filter after the HPFP, try to save the expensive injectors at least. There is hydraulic filter systems that can work up to about 30000psi. Just wonder who would like to be a guinea pig.
 

HeAvYfUeL

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2005
Location
Gatineau,CAN
TDI
2009, Golf Variant, DSG
I have been following the discussions on this subject on and off. I'm also driving a possible time-bomb and already had a small problem with my HPFP, fixed under warranty. (Pressure regulator). Due to my background as marine engineer I have been reading a lot lately on a dutch website; AMT.NL (sorry Dutch only) where CR diesels have been driving around for more then 10 years. There are a lot of interessting articles and documentens regarding cars and engines. My thoughts are that the main cause of the problem is the lubricity of the diesel fuel (Inline with dweisel's signature). Any foreign matter in the diesel fuel. Gas, water, etc. should not enter the system. The HPFP creates very high pressures and any gas/water that breaks the lubrication film is destroying the HPFP components. The fuel filter in the CR diesel must have a water drain valve and maybe the design should be modified to help water/gas separation in the filter. Any water/gas in the diesel fuel also jams the injectors which causes pressure waves in the CR that could damage the HPFP.
 
Last edited:

HornetHandler

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2010
Location
Canada
TDI
2010 Jetta TDI
Not on the one I have....:cool:

HornetH: It's fine and been in a year now. I can do anything I did when I was younger. I don't even think about it these days. :)

Mr Hubbins: The trust needs to be in the surgeon, too!:D

aja:
Glad to hear it! Good for you my friend.

Mack
 

eddif

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2006
Location
MS
TDI
2004 Jetta PD Automatic
How about a high pressure filter after the HPFP, try to save the expensive injectors at least. There is hydraulic filter systems that can work up to about 30000psi. Just wonder who would like to be a guinea pig.
I sure do not know it all. I do think that the amount of actual flow through the injectors is small. High pressure filters take an extremely thick case and special construction.

I suppose a low pressure filter that kept the lower part of the HPFP free of wear particles would be much simpler. If in fact the wear particles are created in fuel at < 120psi (?) then the filter would be much less complex. If the filter removed the wear particles before the conversion to 26,000 psi then there should be no wear particles going to the common rail or injectors. There has been no real description of wear starting in the high pressure part of the pump, but in the low pressure side where the cam and roller assembly are.

This is why I have requested those who might create our version of a fuel flow diagram would help. We could trace the pressure increases and path of the fuel for all to see. Right now it is almost impossible to do all the operational path with words, and a run to another web page.

If the fuel is clean coming into the HPFP (I think it is). Another filter leaving (or bypassing) the cam / lobe chamber would keep the fuel going to the high pressure part of the pump clean, and thus the injectors clean.
Then​
If the fuel leaving the low pressure side of the HPFP is filtered before making a loop back to the primary pump heating loop (?) then the filtering of wear particles will be started.​
Finally​
If all return fuel to the tank is filtered we should have captured most of the wear particles.
+++++++++++++++​

I have been following the discussions on this subject on and off. I'm also driving a possible time-bomb and already had a small problem with my HPFP, fixed under warranty. (Pressure regulator). Due to my background as marine engineer I have been reading a lot lately on a dutch website; AMT.NL (sorry Dutch only) where CR diesels have been driving around for more then 10 years. There are a lot of interessting articles and documentens regarding cars and engines. My thoughts are that the main cause of the problem is the lubricity of the diesel fuel (Inline with dweisel's signature). Any foreign matter in the diesel fuel. Gas, water, etc. should not enter the system. The HPFP creates very high pressures and any gas/water that breaks the lubrication film is destroying the HPFP components. The fuel filter in the CR diesel must have a water drain valve and maybe the design should be modified to help water/gas separation in the filter. Any water/gas in the diesel fuel also jams the injectors which causes pressure waves in the CR that could damage the HPFP.
We are right back to the fact that the HPFP is not robust enough to handle the slightest bit of foreign matter. We basically need a tougher / more robust pump, a better fuel, or both. Probably both.

If VW, Bosch, or the fuel suppliers will not provide the needed products then it is left up to the aftermarket or owners. We are rapidly heading to cars that are out of warranty and more will follow rapidly. If we wait there will just be a group of antique cars heading for the scrap / breaker yards. And some owners that face an owner paid one fuel system replacement at $7,000.00 USD so they can sell the car (a debatable action)..
+++++++++++++++++

Are you sure you don't want to consider a seperate oiling system for the low pressure side of the HPFP.

eddif
 

eddif

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2006
Location
MS
TDI
2004 Jetta PD Automatic
This hip replacement conversation is great. If you have a major hip problem you do what you can do for the trouble. Doctors, prayer, and technology.

The VW CR HPFP is the same thing. We can hope for aftermarket help. We can ask for VW help (original builder). We can use technology to sleeve the aluminum bore, or do whatever can be done in the HPFP area by owners (owners are really limited here, but not without hope).

eddif
 

aja8888

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 25, 2007
Location
Texas..RETIRED 12/31/17
TDI
Out of TDI's
This hip replacement conversation is great. If you have a major hip problem you do what you can do for the trouble. Doctors, prayer, and technology.

The VW CR HPFP is the same thing. We can hope for aftermarket help. We can ask for VW help (original builder). We can use technology to sleeve the aluminum bore, or do whatever can be done in the HPFP area by owners (owners are really limited here, but not without hope).

eddif
eddief: I enjoy following your posts and your dedication to making things better for the cause here. ;)

I sincerely hope that VW or Bosch make this pump have the long term ability to run on U.S. diesel without failures like we are seeing. This is not an insurmountable issue from what I can tell as a practicing mechanical engineer. It's about money with the suppliers (VW, Bosch). Heck, if companies can make body parts like I have work as good as original, then this pump issue should be "duck soup" to get done right.
 

Jack Frost

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Location
Rural Manitoba
TDI
2009 Clean Diesel
How about a high pressure filter after the HPFP, try to save the expensive injectors at least. There is hydraulic filter systems that can work up to about 30000psi. Just wonder who would like to be a guinea pig.
With your proposal, it is not the fuel filter that has to withstand 30,000 psi, it is the fuel filter housing that has to take that pressure. It will take more than a few torx screws to hold the lid down on that! :eek::eek: If any air were to get entrain in that fuel filter housing, you would have a real bomb under your hood.
 

scrappytdi

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 2, 2010
Location
Princeton NC
TDI
'10 jetta
but if you could port the fuel from the low pressure side of the pump and out thru an external filter then back into the high pressure side of the pump, the contamination would be contained by the filter. a regular fuel (or hydraulic?)filter would suffice.
 

eddif

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2006
Location
MS
TDI
2004 Jetta PD Automatic
but if you could port the fuel from the low pressure side of the pump and out thru an external filter then back into the high pressure side of the pump, the contamination would be contained by the filter. a regular fuel (or hydraulic?)filter would suffice.
Again we are back to needing the fuel flow diagrams. Several people think they have the flow down, but no diagrams to compare notes on construction and operation with each other.

I am trying to stay out of this (I do not own a CR), and let someone who owns a CR be the driving force. I tend to develop directions of thought, and go for those thoughts till I feel my thoughts have failed.


eddif
 

eddif

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2006
Location
MS
TDI
2004 Jetta PD Automatic
The information that shows the problem is listed over and over. All we have to do is go back and get everything organized. There is other information on other threads also. This is going to be more complex than the PD failure, but not by much.

I will volunteer to start a seperate thread if you all wish. I do not want to force an eddif monologue study on this thread. I have read enough posts others have done to know the information is around to solve the problem. It is not a simple solution but has a simple cause. It took me forever to finally point to one major PD problem, but posters have actually led us to the problem / problems.


Yes I know it is not the filter. I was just pointitng out that what kind of filter design allows the whole fuel system to contaminent with metal based on the failure of the pump.
Oh Yeah it is the filtering. Go ziggy and others. Filtering, Filtering, Filtering

Major theories:
1... It is about Lubrication (I agree)
2... It is about fuel filtering
3... It is about water seperation and water draining / removal
4... It is about fuel quality (especially with the stock HPFP)

New Possible Reason for Failure: #2
1... The design tries to maintain heat at low climate temperatures but uses no adequate filtering of heat loop fuel. (just screens that do not seem to work). Back to the oil screen filter in the air-cooled VW. If you have good fuel and no contaminates the screens work, but if fuel is substandard, or contaminated you need the extra filtering. Sorry.
2... Return fuel to the tank is not adequately filtered either.

How we know about the filtering fault:
1... The filter does not show extreme contamination till late in the wear game. The filter should show wear particles from the first wear stages if all wear contaminated fuel was being forced through the filter. The delay in contamination shows the primary filter is out of the loop at times. This is going to take many peoples help to prove.
2... Water seems to be super mixed (emulsifed ?) with fuel and forced out the injectors rather than drained off before HPFP. (this gets rid of the water but at a possible cost).

Thanks from the other end of I-70 in MO. Thanks so much for digging into this.

Would be possible to take a new HPFP, modify it with higher quality internal components (cylinder sleeve, piston, roller, etc.) to make it less sensitive to lubricity variance?

You know, even if it failed in under30k miles, but without releasing metal, it would be a VAST improvement over OEM.

Alternatively, replace the entire unit with one that is manufactured to bolt in (connections/mounting same), but has either a different design, or better materials and machining??

An extremely well built unit for $1500-1800 would look pretty d@mned attractive in a few years, particularly if the rate of failure begins to creep above 1%...
To use our NA fuel we have to: (IMHO)
1... Make changes in the pump. Right now it appears to involve re-routing internal HPFP by-pass loops.
2... External low pressure filters (drilling the HPFP housing etc). Choke gag etc. LOL

If the cam and roller were lubricated with crankcase oil instead of fuel, there would likely be no problem.
This is an option. A seperate sump, pump, and filter is my choice.

Being an owner of a 2010 Golf this has me very concerned. I have to admit that we do have ourselves to blame a little, we did buy a Volkswagen. This is my 6th VW and I vowed after each that this would be my last. I have owned other cars too, but keep going back to VW. Its like taking drugs, your addicted and keep poisioning yourself.

That being the fact does not excuse VW/Bosch from poor design. This failure looks like a combination of poor fuel, poor design and probably faulty pumps due to manufacturing material issues. Maybe they should QC sample their units more, and verify the process of manufatcuring.

Another issue I have is what kind of sloppy filtering system is this. Unit fails and contamination is caused all over the fuel system, whats the point of the filter (good looks). Why not have a water collector also doesn't hurt.

Also if this pump was designed for ideal conditions, shame on the engineers, maybe they should leave the cubicle and have a field trip to the local refinery and follow the fuel delivery right to the station. There is no way any fuel pumped from a station is 100% perfect. There will always be some water, contaminants and foreign trace solvent present. I remember watching them dig up storage tanks form a local station and guess what some of the tanks didn't have any bottoms left.

As I see it we need to start putting pressure on VW immediatly and very aggresivley.

I would alsolike to thank all who are already working on a solution. Maybe in the meantime we can develop some sort of better filtering system that will catch all the contaminants from the pump before a repair will cost you half the price of the car(???). This is starting to sound like the W8 fiasco.
It is the filtering system. Great post.

Ok guys, here's the facts on the failure of the pump in the labeled photos in the first post. This car was in my shop. The customer broke down a few blocks from the gas station after filling up. Upon initial inspection we opened the fuel filter canister and found no metal. The fuel was cloudy and white in color. It smelled like turpentine but not gasoline. The fuel felt oily to the touch. We drained the tank, cleaned out the lines, added fresh diesel and primed the system. The vehicle seemed to run ok so we released the vehicle to the customer but warned him of possible future problems. We also gave him a sample of the fuel. I was worried about the low pressure fault it had when it came in. The next day the car returned on a hook just as I feared. The fuel canister had metal in it this time. The fuel sample we gave the customer was still cloudy but had developed water droplets on the bottom of the jar. I can tell everyone for sure that this pump failed from contaminated fuel. Lesson learned, next car I find with no metal but suspect fuel, I will pull the piston out of the pump and inspect the roller for damage.

The thread started by KNOWLEDGE where his fuel canister was rusted and we found rust in his tank did not need a complete fuel system. On his car we found the rust by pure luck. We were chasing down a drivability concern which ended up being the 5 volt signal wire on the charge pressure sensor rubbing on the a/c pipe on the compressor. It was dumb luck that we opened the canister and found rust.We found no contaminated fuel. We cleaned the tank, replaced the lift pump and fuel canister . The car has been running fine to this day.
You are a super source of information.

(First Paragraph)
If the filter was working properly they would have seen trash in the filter up front. Not only after the whole system was loaded with wear particles. The only time the filter really seems to see trash is after the screens are loaded and the tank is contaminated. I thought filters were supposed to filter and screens were an emergency back up plan.

(Second Paragraph Rust)
Any fill up should be before a 50 mile trip if possible. Any water needs to be gone ASAP (do not fill up in a rain storm and drive 2 blocks to the house and take a 2 week vacation with a CR left sitting with water in the system.

This little mesh screen is clean on both the pumps I have here. One seems to have a couple tiny 'flecks' of gray stuck in it, but nothing what you would think to see given the amount of wear on the internals. That screen must not filter anything after the pump itself.
Much needed information. The screens do not work. We need more pictures desperately. I had to develop what few photo skills I have after joining the club.

No, Dennis. What it is actually showing is the the fuel is pumped in to the HPFP through the bottom connection. It lubricates the cam and roller and is then sucked into the (what I will call) compression chamber through the top valve (green valve at the top). It is there that the piston (green rod) compresses it to a very high pressure, and is then ejected into the high pressure common rail (orange path).

So if the cam/roller chip away at each other, that contaminated fuel will still get sucked into the compression chamber. There is no way to filter that.

Read page 35 for information on the "Intake Stroke".
A seperate low pressure pre-filter needed before the High Pressure part of the HPFP. More than a screen.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I know I left out many that said the same things (possibly you were first). I hope you chime in and expand on your original thoughts.

eddif
 

El Dobro

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 21, 2006
Location
NJ
TDI
2017 Bolt EV Premier, 2023 Bolt EUV Premier
Maybe all these threads should be forwarded to Stanadyne's R&D department.
 

Big_Al

Member
Joined
Oct 23, 2010
Location
Texas
TDI
2010 Jetta CR
i've been searching the forum for people who have had problems with there 2010 jetta tdi with a recent build date. my 2010 tdi was built aug 2010 and i've had a problem free first 10,000 miles. does anybody know of a failure so far with a recent build date? maybe VW actually fixed the prob??
 

Plus 3 Golfer

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 29, 2008
Location
ARIZONA
TDI
Und tschüss! 2009 Jetta 12/23/2012
i've been searching the forum for people who have had problems with there 2010 jetta tdi with a recent build date. my 2010 tdi was built aug 2010 and i've had a problem free first 10,000 miles. does anybody know of a failure so far with a recent build date? maybe VW actually fixed the prob??
Did you check the part/serial number of your HPFP? and compare with previous ones? Build dates as of 7/2010 have the same part number. If yours is the same, "lubricity, lubricity, lubricity". :)
 

El Dobro

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 21, 2006
Location
NJ
TDI
2017 Bolt EV Premier, 2023 Bolt EUV Premier
i've been searching the forum for people who have had problems with there 2010 jetta tdi with a recent build date. my 2010 tdi was built aug 2010 and i've had a problem free first 10,000 miles. does anybody know of a failure so far with a recent build date? maybe VW actually fixed the prob??
I don't know if it's been updated, but there was a posting somewhere about a possible 2011 HPFP problem.
 
Top