TD04HL turbine housing on an HE221?

http://www.stavtech.co.uk/home/stav...olvo-and-saab-exhaust-manifolds-and-downpipes

So this guy says it bolts together... anyone here done it? My HE221 has a 7cm housing (I’d like smaller to get faster spool up) and TD04 turbos are far more readily available and cheap than just a 5 or 6cm holset housing on its own.

I don't have many answers, but I have my he221w and a TD04L (not TD04HL) beside each other here and the housings won't fit over. The cartridge is just slightly bigger on the TD04 and will not slip in far enough to work correctly. Yes the TD04HL and he221w do have the same dimensions on the turbine wheel so maybe with a slight bit of lathe work a TD04 housing will fit. I also imagine (but not sure) that all the different variants of the Td04 have the same cartridge .

Well the answer is yes. No lathe work. TD04HL turbine housing fits on the holset like it was made for each other. So now I have an HE221 with a 5cm housing.

This matters because many of the used or new EBay he221 have 7 or 8 cm housing but this TD04HL cost me a whopping $47 and I can probably sell the cold side and cartridge to get half of that back. So if you find a good deal on an he221 on eBay, you can bolt on a nice tight turbine housing and actually get it to spool at a reasonable RPM.

I still need to figure out the downpipe so I won’t get to drive it till tomorrow or Thursday when I finish it up because I’m done for the day.

Hey could you post some boost logs or roughly when you can get 5psi and 20psi? I have a td04hl that's slightly larger than the he211 but with a 7cm exhaust. If the 5cm works i might run it as a single.

I will update with my comparison (or if it’s an epic fail...), I’m really hoping this improves my spool up by a good bit.

I read that the he211 shares the TD04L, not HL , turbine. I cannot confirm though.

I need to measure my HE221W housing and see what size it is. It's way too small in my opinion (too high Exhaust pressure). Maybe we can strike a deal

Is that high EMP because of your compound setup? I haven’t been following the thread, are you still running a small vnt plus the holset? I don’t think there is a way to measure the housing size like with a caliper as I think cm^2 numbers relates to a cross sectional area inside the snail. But it should be cast into the housing.

I didn’t get it all together today. A few minor stumbling blocks. Janky homemade downpipe took a little time. Also the oil drain didn’t fit right, it kinked because the turbo moved a tiny bit away from where it used to sit. Then I had to call it a quits early because the wife wasn’t home yet when the kids finished school.

Yes, small VNT in series with HE221W. Even just driving down the road at 2000 RPM there will be 5 psi of total exhaust pressure, 4 psi of it is from the Holset.

I'll be interested to see how well it works once you get it running. Did you ever run with the 7cm housing?

I was using that holset for almost a year with the larger housing. Spool was tolerable but just barely so.... I assumed it was my half-arsed tuning contributing to it also.

Now that it’s apart I’m not 100% that it’s a 7cm. That’s just what the seller told me I think. The cast number is hard to read. Might be larger or smaller... I really need to research the casting number and confirm. It’s at my dads shop so I cannot just go look quick. Lol.

It will never be as smooth or efficient as a mid/large VNT but I spent like a third of what a ready made GTB kit costs.

the cast in number denoting the volute size in cm^2 is inside the turbine inlet flange

apples to oranges thing to say, but on my compound setup I recently switched from 16cm housing to a 9cm housing, and I don't think I like it very much. Spools maybe 1k RPM sooner, but now it has some surge when I let off, indicating that it isn't flowing as well.

I got my He221w used with a 6cm housing. I'm going to run it like that. I had a Td05h on my other car with a 6cm housing and a bigger turbine and it wasn't horribly laggy. The Td05 spoolled best with literally no smoke and fairly low SOI.

[486] said:

the cast in number denoting the volute size in cm^2 is inside the turbine inlet flange

Click to expand...

I know that’s where it was supposed to be, but there is a casting defect there and the number is just a funny looking blob... no legible number.

However after some googling I found this chart of the exhaust housing PNs, And it turns out I actually have a 6cm, not a 7cm.

Cummins PNs for HE221
4048057 7cm2
3593196 6cm2
3779626 5.5cm2
3774237 5cm2

There was an improvement but it wasn’t as much as I was hoping for. Maybe a couple hundred rpms better on the low end. I would say it spools sooner but it’s more like it spends less time waiting for boost rather than an actual numerical RPM-to-boost improvement. I know that’s butt dyno, non-empirical BS.... but it’s all i got for now... I’ll have to run boost logs and get some feedback from folks smarter than I.

Ultimately I’m still happy I confirmed that the TD04HL stuff fits... because those holset housings are much more expensive than junkyard TD04HL stuff.

ketchupshirt88 said:

I know that’s butt dyno, non-empirical BS.... but it’s all i got for now... I’ll have to run boost logs and get some feedback from folks smarter than I.

Click to expand...

turbo lag is basically non-quantifiable
such a situational thing that the only way is by butt-dyno comparative descriptions

[486] said:

turbo lag is basically non-quantifiable
such a situational thing that the only way is by butt-dyno comparative descriptions

Click to expand...

You could get something from a tps-time and boost-time graph but it'd only be useful comparing different setups starting in the same gear and rpm. Not sure if vagcom does those graphs either, never played enough with it.

I gotta take a look under it again this week... on my way to work this morning, the boost gauge would go nuts... spike drop spike drop spike drop and so on if I was above like 10psi.

My guess is the oring at the vband connection or the wastegate isn’t staying shut. The actuator is not hooked to anything so it shouldn’t ever open... but this housing has a much larger diameter gate so maybe the exhaust manifold pressure is just forcing it open.

Until that happened this morning, I was gonna say I’m actually happier with it than I was on the first day. It just seems like the turbo isn’t lazy anymore and driving around town is greatly improved as far as responsiveness and less excessive smoke. Backcountry roads and highway is only a mild improvement.

Issue in last post was just a boost leak. The hose from the turbo to the 1.8T pancake pipe had a small tear in it. I think it rubbed on CV axle when i hit bigger bumps. It lasted too long to have rubbed regularly...

Replaced with a hunk of intercooler hose out of the mystery box. Originally from a volvo - no idea what model. I collect a handful of intercooler hoses whenever i go to junkyard because they are more oil resistant than radiator hose from the parts store and cheaper too.

happens pretty common with those 1.8 pipes in my experience
the fitting is some metric size just the right amount larger than 2" that you can fit it over, but it'll usually tear eventually

oh and I'd positioned the hose clamp such that it protected it from the axleshaft, which it did rub on enough to cause concern

Yea, I can see why it happens... not a ton of room even before you hit bumps and Wisconsin roads took a beating this year with all the frost heaves busting them up.

the Volvo hose section is about 2 1/8 and sort of has an arch in the area where the old nearly straight hose rubbed. Should hold up at least as well as the last one.