Slow Cranking? -- What's the spec. crank speed?

The Cream Dolphin

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 22, 2021
Location
Fernie, B.C. originally Dwight, ON
TDI
02 VW Golf TDI ALH 245k
Crank for a while then feel for any warm/hot cable connections at grounds, starter and battery.
Bad connections or even contacts inside the solenoid will get warm at least.
So don't burn yourself.
I can give this a check, but it usually does start after about 6 seconds max, worse if it is colder. When it is colder, the starters crank speed is very slow, so I am guessing it is the starter. Also because stripping, cleaning, and greasing it had a small improvement.
 

The Cream Dolphin

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 22, 2021
Location
Fernie, B.C. originally Dwight, ON
TDI
02 VW Golf TDI ALH 245k
What you'll need is a Valeo starter, not the Chinese knockoff 1.7kw starter. Those starters are very poorly made and have a very soft drive which wears out and often takes the flywheel ring gear out.
I understand quality trusted parts are the way to go, but I was curious with this part having a tester that I can ask about from 5 years ago to see the reliability, paired with many good TDI owners reviews on amazon. Things get tricky being in Canada too. Do you have any suggestions for a less expensive source? I would love some help.
 
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Mozambiquer

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Mar 21, 2015
Location
Versailles Missouri
TDI
2004 VW Touareg V10 TDI, 2012 Audi Q7 V6 TDI, 1998 VW Jetta TDI. 1982 VW Rabbit pickup, 2001 VW Jetta TDI, 2005 VW Passat wagon TDI X3, 2001 VW golf TDI, 1980 VW rabbit pickup,
I understand quality trusted parts are the way to go, but I was curious with this part having a tester that I can ask about from 5 years ago to see the reliability, paired with many good TDI owners reviews on amazon. Things get tricky being in Canada too. Do you have any suggestions for a less expensive source? I would love some help.
I think the ones I sell are some of the best prices for them. $195 for the new Valeo or $125 for a remanufactured Bosch.
Likely even with the Amazon one, the one 5 years ago may have been better than one now.
 

The Cream Dolphin

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 22, 2021
Location
Fernie, B.C. originally Dwight, ON
TDI
02 VW Golf TDI ALH 245k
I think the ones I sell are some of the best prices for them. $195 for the new Valeo or $125 for a remanufactured Bosch.
Likely even with the Amazon one, the one 5 years ago may have been better than one now.
Okay, that is definitely an awesome price! Any idea what the shipping to Fernie BC would be? And is there a core? I am more than happy to follow this route if I get a new one. Also - if you have a way for me to find out this info myself, let me know I do not want to bug you. Thanks.
 

Mozambiquer

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Mar 21, 2015
Location
Versailles Missouri
TDI
2004 VW Touareg V10 TDI, 2012 Audi Q7 V6 TDI, 1998 VW Jetta TDI. 1982 VW Rabbit pickup, 2001 VW Jetta TDI, 2005 VW Passat wagon TDI X3, 2001 VW golf TDI, 1980 VW rabbit pickup,
Okay, that is definitely an awesome price! Any idea what the shipping to Fernie BC would be? And is there a core? I am more than happy to follow this route if I get a new one. Also - if you have a way for me to find out this info myself, let me know I do not want to bug you. Thanks.
I can get you a shipping quote. The remanufactured one I do have a core charge on, but not the Valeo one.
You can message me with your address for a shipping quote
 

fatmobile

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 16, 2019
Location
north iowa
TDI
an ALH M-TDI in a MK2, a 2000 Jetta, 2003 wagon
Yeah, 6 seconds might not be enough to warm connections up.
I used to disconnect the injection pump stop solenoid and crank for awhile.
It's often the contacts inside the starter solenoid.
That will make the posts hot.
On the old Rabbit's, the post could be pushed in and turned 60degrees (had a hex head contact that kept it from turning) so the contacts would hit differently.
Sometimes it worked great.
I haven't tried that on a TDI starter.
 

Genesis

Top Post Dawg
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Feb 26, 2003
Location
Sevier County TN
TDI
'03 Jetta Wagon
Yeah you have to be able to get into "basic settings" to see it (either numerically or with the graph); if its retarded (but within spec) cold starting is quite-materially impacted. You might want to find someone with VCDS as this is pretty simple to adjust if its off.
 

TdiRN

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2015
Location
FL
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2002 VW Jetta, 5 speed, 400k milesish
Have you replaced your positive battery cable? I chased a problem like this for 3 years. Put in a large battery cable problem disappeared.
 

J_dude

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Jan 9, 2020
Location
SK Canada
TDI
2003 1.9l “Jedi”
Have you replaced your positive battery cable? I chased a problem like this for 3 years. Put in a large battery cable problem disappeared.
Yes, it’s amazing what an upsized starter cable can do for cranking speed!
 

The Cream Dolphin

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 22, 2021
Location
Fernie, B.C. originally Dwight, ON
TDI
02 VW Golf TDI ALH 245k
Have you replaced your positive battery cable? I chased a problem like this for 3 years. Put in a large battery cable problem disappeared.
Interesting, I had no idea! That is definitely something to look into. And you kept the same starter?
Yeah you have to be able to get into "basic settings" to see it (either numerically or with the graph); if its retarded (but within spec) cold starting is quite-materially impacted. You might want to find someone with VCDS as this is pretty simple to adjust if its off.
I will look into this too. I have read about the static timing before, but have never been able to assess my own Hopefully I can pull it off somewhere around here.
 

The Cream Dolphin

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Joined
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Location
Fernie, B.C. originally Dwight, ON
TDI
02 VW Golf TDI ALH 245k
yep - starter is 10 yrs old or more. Battery cable corrodes inside. I bought a premade 1/0 0 gauge cable off eBay. Works awesome.
Where did you get yours from? I was reading an old thread about Innovative Wirings OEM replacement/upgrade to bigger gauge cables, but that website is no longer active. It had great reviews from lots of users there.
 

BobnOH

not-a-mechanic
Joined
May 29, 2004
Location
central Ohio
TDI
New Beetle 2003 manual
Likely already been mentioned, but have you tried putting the battery on an overnight trickle charge?
 

TdiRN

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2015
Location
FL
TDI
2002 VW Jetta, 5 speed, 400k milesish
Where did you get yours from? I was reading an old thread about Innovative Wirings OEM replacement/upgrade to bigger gauge cables, but that website is no longer active. It had great reviews from lots of users there.
eBay seller: Gauge Wire and Cable
 

BobnOH

not-a-mechanic
Joined
May 29, 2004
Location
central Ohio
TDI
New Beetle 2003 manual
Going back to your original bump of the 5 YO thread (which is what we are now discussing)
Bumping an old thread, but how did this hold up? Thinking of ordering one. Mine cranks very slow for the first start, better on a warm engine. Sped up slightly after a full Wingnut Re&Re, but still not great. It is likely the original stock starter in there, so 21 years old I feel like a new one would help out. I just want it to start like my brothers BEW...
If you can rule out damage to the the the big B+ wire/connects, the battery, engine timing and mechanical damage, it's a weak starter. Sounds like a lot, it's not.
You can verify timing with any OBDII device that can read measuring block 000, field 2. Should be 12-75. Assuming the ECU has not had the timing Adapted (unlikely).
A word about static versus dynamic timing: Static timing generaly refers to the alignment of the crank, cam and IP. Dynamic is the fine adjustment of the IP to dial in the value. I myself have used these terms. But in reality those are both static adjustments. Dynamic timing is what the ECU does, adjusting timing thru the RPM range.
I read that the Wingnut R+R was performed on the starter. Have not done or read thru that, but new brushes, etc. should have left the unit as good or even better than new.
 
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