Why do You Still Have Your MK4 TDI?

Because it only has 106k miles and I am hoping to keep it for a very long time. Fuel economy, simplicity and good looks are another reasons why I am keeping it. Also parts are really cheap compare to parts for newer cars and even if I have to go to scrap yard to pull parts for her I still enjoy it more than having a new car. To me it has more character than my wifes 2013 passat tdi to the point that I rarely want to drive her car even though she works from home and her car is always available.

Currently, it's kind of a good time to own a mk4. The mk4's are the most common models at junkyards and new parts are still available, unlike older generations. You can still find some nice upgrades in decent condition at good prices. However, new parts do seem to be running out. I've been replacing a variety of interior parts with new items and recently replaced all my exterior lights with all new lights. After I overhaul the suspension, my wagon should be good to go for a long time.

it was cheap and a diesel. thats why i am swapping it into my OTHER 99 jetta. frames bent and my other has a few options i cant swap over, like a sunroof.

Because it still puts on a smile on my face and still runs? And I just fixed a bunch of stuff on it.

Still? It only has 341,000 miles on it!


Ok yeah, my honda blew up at 298,000, but many heavy trucks where I work have over a million, so why not shoot for the stars?


I love diesel engines, this car was affordable, the mechanical components are (relatively) simple, it's a manual, and since it's old, there's no concern about digital privacy, or security. If my ODBII port is vacant, no external threat can attack my ECU.


I'm young, it's a decent car to learn stuff on, and while parts are expensive, fuel cost-per-mile is not. Having no car payment is a no-brainier.


Plus I already bought the specialty tools for the timing belt. I'd better use them more than once!



(Actually, telemactics was an option. But I checked, my car doesn't have it.)

The previous post gets at other reasons why I like my 17 year old VW:

• I can put items on the passenger seat without setting off a seat belt warning
• I don't have a back up camera. Yes, I turn my head!
• It starts with a key, no remote batteries to worry about
• Crank windows and manual mirrors. They don't break
• No ASR or ESP.
• No MFI constantly reminding me of FE or miles to empty
• No tire pressure monitoring to bug me (try a BMW if you don't know what I mean)

I also don't worry about locking the car when I leave it in a parking lot, I'm not worried about parking it at the airport, on the street in NYC, or anywhere for that mattter. It's not going to get stolen. And it's about as far from being a cop magnet on the road as you can get.

Hmmmmmmmm, 49 mpg at 75 mph with 334k miles on it. How am I going to top that? DEF ?

I don't have a back up camera. Yes, I turn my head!

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Heh, I have one that I'll eventually need to take off the headliner to route in.

Turning your head is fine, but having a cam to look past the bike rack clearance is also good. (Do both)

It starts with a key, no remote batteries to worry about

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I had my key get desync'd from the wagon. Also the door lock sensors need a washing or something...

Original battery in my Wagon key lasted over 10 years. I've already replaced batteries in my '15's remotes.

I will admit that visibility out of older VWs is far better than new. My MKIV Wagon is dead easy to parallel park. The new GSW's window is small enough that the rear camera is helpful.

I drive it because I enjoy shifting, and get a kick out of people taking pictures of my rear exhaust pipe w/ rain cap at lights and parking lots. 438k miles on it now, bought w/ 418k last year. 20k less miles on my '15 GSW....

I really like the MK4 platform, even if they have some problems.
I enjoy the fuel economy.
A newer car isn't better, it's just newer (for me).
Oil changes are under $30 and they're at 10kmi intervals. Maintenance and a lot of the replacement parts are very cheap. It's a simpler car, so I can do work on a bunch of things myself. I can find parts for it at a junkyard if i have to.
I definitely like the interior of a MK4. I think it was the last one that was well made, but I haven't been playing in many MK7s.
There's a ridiculous amount of aftermarket support for just about anything you want to do with it or to it.
I love the way the fender flares look on them, they are also actual metal.
It's a great commuter car for me.
The ALH can run for a LOT of miles.
Did some math to see what cars cost and this makes sense to own and saves me a LOT of money.
Visually, most new cars don't appeal to me all that much.
I absolutely hate the fact that so many new cars now have this one double din head unit with thee everything tied into it. That's just putting all your eggs in one basket and I find that silly. I actually like buttons and knobs more than a touch screen. If the sun is really bright or happens to be in my eyes, I can still use buttons and knobs without looking at them. So far, we haven't made a screen brighter than the sun. I can install an aftermarket sound system in my cars worry free.
I enjoy not having to hook up a computer to my car for damn near everything, such as maintenance, repairs or mods. I did buy a VAGCOM/VCDS KII cable, a VAG KKL cable and a laptop with some software on it, but it was for mods, because I chose to.
The car is practical for me. I can fit a large adult bicycle in my sedan just fine, but also have a wagon.
The car isn't damn aircraft carrier sized with the interior room of a red solo cup. The pillars aren't late-80's-toyota slim, but I can see out of the cars just fine when i have to back up or just looking out for the idiots out there on the roads every day. The windows are a great size and aren't port holes.
The windshield is hydrophobic without having to step up to a MUCH more expensive car.
If I need an option, I can just add it to the car without having to step up in package/trim levels and paying what I paid for the whole car. No bluetooth? Couple hundred $ and I have an adapter connected. No fog lights? $30 from whatever autozone/pepboys/advance/walmart/amazon/ebay retailer of choice and I have them, but I opted to get the oem Bora foglights. I can add glass lenses, projector HID headlights, rear foglights for safety for a VERY reasonable price over an afternoon.
It's cheap to insure so I have glass, comp and collision, with the rental all included.
I swapped for a MK4 .:R32 interior in the wagon and you can't really do that on a new car.
It's emissions exempt here in NY.
It was available as a sedan, a hatchback (2 door and 4 door), a wagon and with a manual, auto and tiptronic transmission with several engines to choose from. Turbos were already installed from the factory.
Most other cars don't have a SUPER informative forum like this one for them.
When I mention the range per tank or fuel economy, nobody says "well, THAT sucks!".
It doesn't attract a lot of attention from the LEOs.
I like the design of the trunk.
It had some really smart/practical features available from the factory. I may not have them in mine, but I could add them.
EDIT: forgot to add a tremendously important fact. I can make BOTH of mine into an AWD car for a relatively small amount of money. I mean, how amazing is THAT?!

My son is moving out of his '02 Jetta Sedan and into a '15 Passat SEL. He was at my house over the weekend and I took a good look at his car. Low miles for an ALH (230K or so), interior looks great (leather) exterior looks like he lives in the city. Mechanically it's 100%, except for a bent rear axle. I was going to fix the minor stuff and sell it, but now I'm thinking about having it cleaned up and painted and keeping it. I've never owned a MKIV Jetta Sedan. I think if I do this some of my non-MKIV cars will have to go, but these are the cars I like to drive.

I have a 2002 TDI with over 504,000 km, drives great and makes me smile whenever I drive by a Gas Station. First owner and I'll keep it forever.

Votblindub said:

The car isn't damn aircraft carrier sized with the interior room of a red solo cup.

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This! I've driven several modern SUVs, and it's amazing how they can have about the same interior room as an MKIV Golf, but be massive on the outside. Plus they tend to have tiny poorly placed windows that make the car a death trap when the sensors and cameras fail. Even our MK7 Golf has much worse visibility than the MK4.

Poor outward visibility is a gripe I have with most newer vehicles, and it is getting worse. I am in and out of all kinds of stuff, some are downright scary to try and back up or park in a tight spot. They almost force you to become dependent on the abysmal cameras they want to stick everywhere... and then you get a $1200 side view mirror camera repair to deal with. Just did one of these recently on a CRV. The irony is, the driver knocked it off...while backing out of the garage.

I like think that continuing to drive a MKIV, or hanging on to any older car, is a form of protest against manufacturers no longer building cars we want. Easy to maintain drivetrains, simple electronics, the ability to see outside, sensible size, great space utlization, excellent fuel economy, durability...these are all attributes of older TDIs that we can't easily find in newer cars. Some of it is regulation, some of it is marketing efforts training us to think we need a tall, AWD monster as a daily driver. MKIV TDIs buck that trend.

This is purely emotional, but I appreciate the character and feel of the mk4 TDI wagon. I like that it is slightly vintage yet it has the additional safety of all the airbags.

I also like the aesthetic, particularly the Jetta wagon. It’s such a clean, simple, monolithic, understated design. Yet the headlights and protruding grill with the hood bump give it just a hint of aggression without looking angry like most modern cars.

The ALH Golf was the right price and has more usable cargo space than my other mk4, a 2001 new beetle with AEG and 01M. Also I enjoy a form of entertainment I call "hobby wrenching", hence the modifications making the Golf into my Forestry rig. I'm avoiding getting a 4WD pickup as long as I am able, an anomaly in my profession. I dislike the ever-growing size and cost of even used pickups, and relatively unchanging mpg through the model years as they bloat.

The Golf fits on a lot of disused forest roads and tractor trails a truck or a jeep just won't fit.

Why do I still drive my 2002 Golf with 348,XXX miles?

I am still waiting to put in the replacement clutch I bought from amazon
warehouse deals for like $125. That was almost 5 years ago. Original
clutch still does not slip or make noise.
I am still waiting for oil consumption to get to be more than a quart every
10,000 miles
I am still waiting to see how hard it is to remove the turbo to replace it.
I am still waiting for a wheel bearing, other then the front right, to fail.
I am still waiting for the door bushings to wear so the doors don't close
easily.
I am still waiting for the sunroof or a power window to fail.
I am still waiting for it to leak some fluid on to my driveway.
I am still waiting for a wheel bearing, other then the front right, to fail.
I am still waiting for the alternator to fail. (regulator and freewheel clutch
have failed, but not the alternator itself.

Now don't get me wrong there has been a lot of maintenance done and a few failures. On extra timing belt replacement due to a leaking water pump 65,000 after it was changed. One rear caliper replacement due to a sticky parking brake mechanism. And yes this spring the AC finally died, but replacement parts had already been accumulated. Door latch switch fails are a pet peeve, and i need to get to a junk yard to get some window seals that are not split.

Now she don't look as pretty as she one did. Stone chips to the leading edge of the hood and above the windshield along with the grill that I have not put back after adding HIDs are just character marks, they show shes been through a lot. Oh, did I mention the only nights shes spent in the garage were when she was being worked on.

I guess I am left wondering why I would stop driving it?

Besides I think it pisses of my wife and kids.

Simple Man

Why do I still have my nine running Mk4 VWs and my 2000 Audi TT alh? Because most of them I bought for $500 or less and fixed them for another $200 - $500. And they keep running and running. Highest mileage one is the 2005 Jetta wagon (BEW) with 435k. Next up is my daughter's 2002 Golf (alh) with 339k. I have four parts cars to support the nine running Mk4s. I've got a mix of gas (2.0) and diesel Mk4s.

The Mk4s are pretty easy to work on and share a lot of parts between the TDI and the 2.0 engine. Parts are fairly inexpensive.

My daughters are finally coming to the conclusion that it's cheaper to drive an older car than spend a fortune on a new car when they both get you from point a to point b.

Eric

2002 Jetta TDI 5M, bought new

Because the car is robust as others have eloquently described, because I like it and because I don't make financial / maintenance decisions based solely relative to the car's (now miniscule) book value.

I'm presently in process of rebuilding the engine at 354K miles. It has all original valvetrain components and still doesn't consume significant qty of oil, although the rear main seal was found to be leaking a bit. It had started to consume coolant, which I figured was a failing head gasket but have since found was the O-ring seal water pump to block. (and it was leaking significantly- I was surprised at that.)

I've decided to do some mods along with the rebuild (VNT-17, injector tips, tune etc.) Evaluating from a purely financial perspective, this isn't justifiable and the car should have been parted out or gone to a scrap yard. But otoh, as others have observed- parts are plentiful or at least attainable. My car has received attentive maintenance through the years, including "deeper" things like rebuilding front & rear suspension etc. Replaced the drivers seat foam last year. (I don't drive it in winter, so it remains rust free) Presently, one of its worst issues is the headliner fabric coming loose, especially at the rear. I "bandaided" that with some of those ACCO binder clips- you can install them, then remove the wire handles so they don't show as much.

(Once the engine is back together...) I wouldn't hesitate to drive it coast to coast. For a few thousand $, I'll retain a 50MPG car that I enjoy driving. One of my biggest concerns is being rear-ended or some such event that would bring the car's demise.

Not directly relevant in this thread, but... I owned one of the 2014 TDI Sportwagen scandal cars, which I sold back to VW in 2017. Promptly turned around and bought a 2017 Golf Sportwagen S 1.8T 4motion, largely because I got a great deal on it. Presently has 3500 (3.5K) miles on it, and sadly just learned that VW won't be selling them nor the Alltrak in US after 2019.

Best regards to all...

Corsair said:

2002 Jetta TDI 5M, bought new

Because the car is robust as others have eloquently described, because I like it and because I don't make financial / maintenance decisions based solely relative to the car's (now miniscule) book value.

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Props to you! I've never understood people's resistance to spending money on repairs because "the car's not worth enough." My guru has another way to math that: consider a new car may cost $300-$400/month, plus increased insurance costs and taxes. And that is usually lost money as the new car is depreciating every day. So if your old car costs less than $4-5K a year to maintain you're ahead of the game. And in my experience you'd have to work pretty hard to spend $4K on a MKIV every year.

By the time i have 20K into my mk4, between fuel, repairs and routine maintenance ill have driven 200,000 or more miles.

20K(basically) would be the beginning of the life of a new vw. It would cost a lot of money in fuel on top of that to get to 200K miles.

Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk

Well my ex got the 2004. 99.5 was rear ended, unibody crunched 3/4”, got rid of it and recently bought a ‘00 w/ 350k. Got a local mechanic I like, getting ~47mpg, paid $1600 cash for it, can haul my tools and get thumbs up from other mk4 tdi drivers. Maintenance and math makes sense, 20 years old, 356k, no problemo.

Two examples: Bought my '02 Wagon new for $!8K, I wouldn't be surprised if I haven't put another 18K in it over the years in repairs, upgrades, and replacements, not including fuel and routine maintenance, which I'd have to do on any car. So total cost of the car with repairs and replacements is probably $35-40K. And I'm just shy of 400K miles. That's pretty economical.

We bought my son's '02 Golf for $1,500 including two new sets of tires, one of which I used on my Wagon. Put about $1,500 into it when we purchased it, and have probably spent another $2K on repairs and replacements (suspension, intercooler, junk yard fenders, headlights, etc. He's driven it 120K miles, maybe we have $5K in it. Also a pretty good deal. If we'd bought him a new Civic, for example, it would have depreciated far more than $5K over 120K miles. His car is still worth $1,500, at least.

I have owned 16 cars in my 49 years of driving. I bought some used, but most were new. I bought a new 1979 American made Rabbit that I owned for 17 years. During our time together, it left me stranded many times even during rain and snow storms. I kept fixing it up anyway. I loved that car and it was sad for me to let it go because of severe rusting. My current mk4 is 18 years old and it has never stranded me, has zero rust and is fun to drive.

IndigoBlueWagon said:

Props to you! I've never understood people's resistance to spending money on repairs because "the car's not worth enough." My guru has another way to math that: consider a new car may cost $300-$400/month, plus increased insurance costs and taxes. And that is usually lost money as the new car is depreciating every day. So if your old car costs less than $4-5K a year to maintain you're ahead of the game. And in my experience you'd have to work pretty hard to spend $4K on a MKIV every year.

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I've been trying to tell people around me the same exact thing, but they don't listen. I think that if people can afford to, they will get new cars and replace them rather often (most people stateside would). They get used to having new and quickly get tired of them. This is why there's programs or at least pilot programs from higher cost manufacturers being proposed or starting where you pay a rather steep monthly fee, but basically get a completely new car once a month or so. Part of me thinks that it's pretty cool to try that many cars in a year, but another part of me hates this. I was discussing costs with a friend and he recently had a kid, so a newer and safer car made sense. There's also somebody at my job who traded in a GTI that was 2 years old because the tires were worn out, but was complaining about money. I still don't understand their logic, but i cannot tell people how to spend their money. What blew my mind was that they put 0 effort into shopping around for tires and went straight to the dealer, which is the most expensive option 90% of the time. I'm always glad to help people with car advice, I just don't like doing ALL their work for them though. But, that person lost a HEAP of cash on the trade (obviously) and got another car extending their debt amount and the time frame. I think a big part of it is how cheap the cars and fuel are in the USA compared to the rest of the world. People in England sometimes end up paying more for their annual insurance than the cost of the actual car they drive. We should consider ourselves lucky.

My father and I have been the only two owners of my Jetta Wagon. I have every service receipt since it had 30 miles. I truly love this car more than some people. I swapped the trans and no matter what has broken over the years, I keep fixing it because it's not just a car, it's my diesel-powered friend.

The other thing for me is I routinely get to experience driving and servicing a lot of other cars, most of which leave me shaking my head as to how anyone would/could drive one.

Today's miserable turd is the Subaru XV (Impreza hatch with a little lift). 75k miles, the A/C compressor is shot, and the drive axles are clicking, which are on national backorder. How does a car that has NO POWER, like, crazy gutless, made worse with a CVT, and has an EXTRA SET of axles, manage to chew through these so quickly? No split boots. Just a 'click-clack-click-clack'ing away.

VWdrummer said:

I keep fixing it because it's not just a car, it's my diesel-powered friend.

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My TDI is like a cowboy's horse. "There are other horses like it but this one is mine."