New Passat TDI confirmed for U.S.

Blonde Guy

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The Euro is getting cheaper every day. I hope VW will undertake new projects here in light of the increased buying power of the dollar. I'm not really in the market for a large sedan or wagon, but if they make that cute diner window bus on the Up! platform, I'm in. I hope it's an electric, or a plug-in diesel hybrid -- either of those would be perfect for my needs.
 

dubStrom

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LRTDI said:
In comparison to EEC, the US is a very CHEAP labor market. US made cars sold in EEC for example commonly sell for a far higher price than in the US. Go check Jeeps, Chryslers and look for yourself.

The BMW plant is the sole worldwide production location for the X5, X6 and the new X3 that will be introduced shortly. BMW ships all engines etc to SC from Germany then exports the car with these same engines installed. So there are many BMWs out there whose engines have travelled from Germany to the US and back again, before seeing a dealership.

As for Honda, Honda builds the Civic, Accord (all variants) Pilot, MDX, Odyssey in the US.
I don't think those higher prices on autos in Europe are due to labor cost. Labor cost in the US is responsible for loss of tire-, textile-, auto-, electronics-, steel-, furniture-, tool-making industries, uh... I think I can stop. Point is made. And please look at the price of the X5, X6, and new X3. The cars are loaded with features, so they can charge enough to pay for the labor market. VW sells more lower end vehicles.

Specifically...There are many places on the planet cheaper to make an automobile besides EEU. Our Jetta TDIs are from Mexico, a much cheaper labor market for example (and does the word maquiladores ring a bell???). The US is hardly a cheap place to hire people.

But I say again... the reason why Honda makes Accord here, Toyota makes Camry here, etcetra, to avoid import duties...the so-called "chicken tax", which actually goes back to taxes on US chickens back in the early sixties (chicken tax).

To see how weird it can get, the Subaru brat had rear oriented seats in the bed so that it qualified as a passenger car, thereby avoiding taxes.

North American auto assembly plants are an import duty dodge, but they can be dressed up as partnerships, and we buy the cars, so it makes sense. Unfortunatley, the TIF give-aways can prevent North American communities from benefiting from these assembly plants. Local governments pay up front (actually borrow, up front) to provide infrastructure, and promise tax breaks. In the case of Chattanooga's long range tax deferrals with VW of America, it seems that increased tax revenues will more than pay for the infrastructure investment and those long term tax breaks. This deal might be very good for Tennesse and for Volkswagen.

But North American workers, like me, are not cheap. In fact, we are notoriously expensive and productive. BUT, to get back to the specific point I made, and stand by... VW will not export vehicles from the new Tennessee plant, besides maybe to Canada (I would be dumbfounded). It is very clearly a great way for VW to assemble vehicles here, avoiding the tax, and being a local hero for hiring people. I wonder just what it cost Chattanooga/Tennessee to get VW to expand and build the new facilities (TIF?). Perhaps a little reality check is in order. Don't get me wrong, it is a good thing, but one should look at the bigger picture as well.
Here is some context:
ONE
TWO

The numbers are staggering. You be the judge.
 
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GTIDan

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TwoTone said:
LOL that's one of the funnest things I've read. Yea, not one of the 3 dealer in my area had heard anything about DMF failures when mine started to fail.
So it must not have happened right?

Oh wait, that's right took over a year for the TSB to come out.

You must be new to VWs, the dealer is the last place to go for actual knowledge on a VW.
Actually this is my fourth VW (2 bugs, a GTI VR 6 and now the TDI)

As to implying all VW dealers are dopes I think is over the top. I've met many Techs who were pretty sharp and took damn good care of my car/s.

Up on the sales floor you may have some creditability but out back in the shop I'd check my remarks. JMHO.

And most importantly I NEVER posted anything about DMF failures. You have confused me with someone else. I said none of the dealers/mechanics in my area have heard anything about unusual HPFP failures and I stand by that statement.

:)
 

va_reman

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Springfield, VA
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No no problem sharing just there is no way to post the pic unless going thru alot of work as you just cnt post here on the forum, atleast I dont know how?!?!?!?! I could put it on the pics area but then directing people to it... I rather email it out. Just seems easier.
 

kjclow

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dubStrom said:
As far as TDI is concerned, no other market needs to meet the cleaner particulates standard, which has an impact on fuel economy and production cost (not sensible to sell it elsewhere).
Yes, CARB (California Air Resources Board) has tighter emission requirements than any other place in the world, which has lead to the redesign of the TDI engines for North America. however, the only real change in the Jetta/Golf engines for North America versus Europe was the addition of the partical filter. The engine already met the Bin V requirements for Europe. Getting the engine approved by the EPA and waiting for the US to catch up with ULSD, is what stopped us from having new TDIs from the 06 to the 09 model years. My understanding is that the partical filters are being used in Europe and the urea on the larger vehicles, Toureg and Benz, is also being used. VW would not have spent the money if these changes were not also being implemented for Europe sales.
 

kjclow

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rme said:
Wouldn't it be sweet if they (VW) would import the Amarok from S. America since that is where they are building it. Geeeez I wonder how many thousands they would sell. Maybe its just me but with the gas prices getting ready to shoot thru the ceiling I just can't imagine VW passing this up....but then again VW is very good about snatching failure from the jaws of success and costing thereselves a ton of money...
I totally agree. If they brought the Amarok to the US, I would stand in line to get one, assuming that my JSW is paid off.... I have been saying for years that a small or medium sized (depending on how you want to classify the Tacoma or Fontier) with a diesel engine would sell like hotcakes. Especially since the big three have decided not to put diesels in the half ton trucks and all but Subaru have announced that they will not be bringing diesels to the US. Come on VW, give us something more that no one else has. They want to expand the share of NA autosales, then bring more diesels.
 

kjclow

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LRTDI said:
In comparison to EEC, the US is a very CHEAP labor market. US made cars sold in EEC for example commonly sell for a far higher price than in the US. Go check Jeeps, Chryslers and look for yourself.
In talking to a German co-worker several months back, the US made BMWs in Germany are selling at about 50% markup compared to the same vehicle in the US. Part is shipping costs and part is higher taxes. The rest is profit!
 

Snoozer

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Southern Indiana
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2015 Passat TDI SE Manual
Not the NMS

The spy shots referenced above are of the NCS (New Compact Sedan) aka Jetta, and not the New Midsize Sedan. We've been discussing it here:

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=283312

I have to agree the looks are underwhelming at this point. Maybe once they remove what's left of the camouflage and put some bigger/nicer wheels on it, the new Jetta might turn out to be more attractive than it appears in these photos. We can only hope! :rolleyes:
 

dubStrom

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LRTDI said:
If BMW's presence in the GSP area of SC is anything to go by, it will be a hugely positive economic effect in your area.

But BMW exports vehicles to the world from SC, will VW export from TN to the ROW or keep the production in North America? If the latter, the plant will be more affected by regional economic changes than a plant that exports to the ROW
Hear is an interesting article that describes VWs strategy on increasing North American sales. It is badly translated (or just very badly written), but note that mexican labor is paid ~27 dollars per day (not per hour!!!!).

This emphasizes that reality that import duty is an important impetus for the expansion at the Chattanooga plant, not labor cost. But increasing sales hinges on profitability... the less expensive Jetta VI will be made in Mexico, whereas the upscaled NMS (Passat?) is to be made in Tennesee. Even if profit margin is thinner at the Chattanooga plant, VW wants to increase sales in the US.

I don't understand the entire import policy formula, but Puebla will be making the new Jettas, including TDIs. Maybe import duty can be avoided or reduced if a high percentage of the parts in the vehicle are made in US or Canada, even if it is assembled in Mexico. Does anyone know what the rules on this really are??

Fortunately, the Mexican plant will be able to ramp up production quickly for VW. Puebla is fully staffed and experienced to make the Jetta transition. Chattanooga and the NMS (still badged Passat?, maybe??) will follow at some point.
 
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Dooglas

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Portland, OR
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'06 Jetta
Interesting (and not very surprising) that the lines of the new Jetta are not dissimilar to those of the CC. I'll wager the NMS looks similar as well. This appears to be VWs idea of what the US market prefers.
 

jeffer28

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London ON
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Looking
Snoozer said:
The spy shots referenced above are of the NCS (New Compact Sedan) aka Jetta, and not the New Midsize Sedan. We've been discussing it here:

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=283312

I have to agree the looks are underwhelming at this point. Maybe once they remove what's left of the camouflage and put some bigger/nicer wheels on it, the new Jetta might turn out to be more attractive than it appears in these photos. We can only hope! :rolleyes:
it does look a little "vanilla", however, Honda and Toyota make the most vanilla looking cars out there and sell tons.

here is the problem...the current Jetta is in its own area...it is more upscale in features and "quality" than a Civic or Corolla, but is also more expensive...while its "quality" is similar to an Accord or Camry, it is smaller than those cars, and similar in price...i believe the new Jetta will be "cut down" in terms of its "level"...in order for VW to increase its sales, it needs to Jetta to compete head on with cars like the Civic and Corolla and revise the Passat (perhaps that is what the new NMS will be) to slot in where the Accord and Camry sit...as it sits now, the Jetta ends up in its own "segment"...larger and more expensive than other Compact Sedans, but not as big as mid-size models...they have almost made it "too good"...it is like having the nicest and most expensive house on the street...yes, it looks and is good, but not practical in terms of selling it.
 

GTIDan

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Unless things change the TDI engine will be assembled in Germany or Hungary.
One thing that seemed a little odd to me was that I noticed the TDI Golf motor was assembled in Hungary while the TDI Jetta motor was assembled in Germany. The Golf is built in Germany and the Jetta in Mexico. Why export German motors to Mexico and Hungarian motors to Germany?
No big deal I guess but just something to wonder about over a brew
 

Dooglas

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GTIDan said:
Unless things change the TDI engine will be assembled in Germany or Hungary.
One thing that seemed a little odd to me was that I noticed the TDI Golf motor was assembled in Hungary while the TDI Jetta motor was assembled in Germany. The Golf is built in Germany and the Jetta in Mexico. Why export German motors to Mexico and Hungarian motors to Germany?
VW is a big company and has bought up many smaller manufacturers in Europe - Skoda and SEAT being just two examples. They have retooled some plants for specific tasks - such as engine fabrication. There are also some wage advantages at Eastern European plants as well as some other facilities in the VW system. And, remember - we are talking Europe. The distance from Hungary or Poland to Germany is not really very great.

In the case of Mexico, they are shipping some components from European plants to Mexico, outsourcing other components, assembling completed autos, and distributing them in North America. Cheaper than assembling complete autos in Europe and shipping them here. When they begin assembly in the US they will undoubtedly continue the practice of shipping many components from Europe. It is a global market controlled by costs.
 

dubStrom

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PaulTDI said:
This may have been posted already, but anyway...
http://www.vw.com/upcomingcars/en/us/
I have NOT seen that. Thank you.

So that's the NMS sitting under there, I assume. And we see Passat spy photos of apparently a separate vehicle (the wagon and sedan) on this other thread
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=284803

It looks like Passat will be a Europe/Eastern Europe, Australian only vehcle (at least not NA market):mad:

Passat wagon TDI would be expensive but worth it. Space and low emissions. I should just move to Spain and be done with it. Skoda, Seat, VW POLO 1.4LTDI...

This market stinks.

Oh, I forgot to mention Amarok. AAARGH!!
 
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f14dmechanic

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frugality said:
Um....yeah....they are.....

The Jetta Sportwagen TDI was introduced in 2009. You can still buy one in 2010.

Sure can.... DO IT.. DO IT.... I highly recommend it. I love mine.... Great car, and fun to drive.
 

GTIDan

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BeetleGo said:
This new car looks BORING~!

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/252394/volkswagen_jetta_spied.html?CMP=NLC-Newsletters&uid=267345f3388adddc6333e6db2d918802

Very mid to late 80's generic Japanese sedan, if you ask me. I guess that's what it takes to go main(#@$%*)stream.
The Jetta is a 'family' sedan.............want more sport than go for the Golf. As the story goes the Jetta is considered an 'old man' car in Germany. I guess that's OK by me since I'm 70 and I have one..... :)
 

LRTDI

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The bit I don't like, between the headlights and grille is just a cover that I think will disappear in the production version. I don't think thats the final grille either.

Have faith brothers!
 

BeetleGo

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LRTDI

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Red Sox Nation
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RIP 16 GSW... Just the LR diesel now
Ford Mondeo is on the EUCD chassis(as several other Euro Fords, Volvos and Land Rover models, Taurus is on the D platform. Fusion and Mondeo will share chassis down the road
 

poppadoc

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GTIDAN I am glad to see a member as young as me, I will be 75 in sept. and I enjoy blasting these kids at the red light and looking at thier expresson in the rear view mirror which says how did that old man with handicap plates smoke me plus it's a diesel?
 

3waygeek

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Jalopnik gives us a sneak peek at the new Jetta. It's not based on the Golf platform, and borrows from the NCC concept shown at Detroit earlier this year.
 

Oberkanone

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Ncs

dubStrom said:
The VW official unveiling appears to be scheduled for Tuesday June 15th at about 11:30am EST. This link was posted (thanks PaulTDI), but just in case you didn't notice it, here it is again.

http://www.vw.com/upcomingcars/en/us/


If it isn't the NMS, maybe it is the shocking NA release of Amarok (sorry...just kidding).
NCS. No NMS yet.
 

dubStrom

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Nms ?

Could this be the new NMS?
It doesn't look like a Jetta. Maybe this link has all ready been posted in this forum and I missed it, but it seems that it’s the NMS. Only one photo, but I do not recognize that nose. Anybody else seen other photos of this black one or others yet?
 
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Marley

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TN
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none
Well, I think that looks better than the new 2011 JETTA .
But.........02 .
Confused, so VW is building a "decontented" Jetta, and they are going to build at the Chatt plant a new "NMS" called something ?
Have I got this straight ?
 
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