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TDI Power Enhancements Discussions about increasing the power of your TDI engine. i.e. chips, injectors, powerboxes, clutches, etc. Handling, suspensions, wheels, type discussion should be put into the "Upgrades (non TDI Engine related)" forum. Non TDI vehicle related postings will be moved or removed. Please note the Performance Disclaimer.

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Old June 18th, 2019, 01:13   #1
Jasengine
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Default Tuning a 2.0TDI 140 PPD with DSG

Has anyone had a successful remap with the BKP engine with a DSG box?
I have the Darkside EGR & cooler delete with the turbo hard pipe kit. Turbo Dynamics hybrid turbo good for 220bhp (GT22 billet compressor, trimmed turbine, upgraded thrust bearing etc).
I had a remap some years ago, but unknown at the time the vacuum valve box response was slow. I have recently changed it to a N75 valve and the boost response is very quick, but the tune is unstable and has strange over-boost and fuelling under certain load and rpm conditions, which I have to keep an eye on the boost gauge to correct. I've checked for a sticking VNT actuator, but on installing the standard MAP, shows perfect boost response under all revs and load conditions, so I don't see the hybrid turbo being an issue.
Two independent well known tuners have declined to tune this setup, one because it has a 'hybrid' turbo and the other because of the extent of the programming for 4bar MAP etc (not installed yet)... Maybe the DSG has an influence on tuning here?
So I am now running the standard MAP which is slow and boring together with the engine check lights flashing at me! This can't be a 'one-off' impossible setup....can it?? Or does everyone keep clear of the BKP with DSG and hybrids

Last edited by Jasengine; June 20th, 2019 at 12:09.
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Old June 21st, 2019, 14:42   #2
adamss24
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Ditch the rubbish TD hybrid and get a serious turbo in there ! I see they still selling them archaic gt compressors and still clip the turbine blades to stop boost creep! You dont need a 4 bar map sensor with that turbo, it wont be pushing any more than 1,5-1.7 bar of boost ! And for your information, almost every VAG VNT turbo has a "upgraded" trust bearing !
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Old June 21st, 2019, 22:43   #3
duke21
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Stock 1749vc turbo can handle 1.7b
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Old June 22nd, 2019, 00:52   #4
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Interesting comments guys.
It's mapped for 1.79barand a wot will settle at 1.7. It will spike to 2.2bar though.
I had a 1756 hybrid from TD may years ago on a 1.9 ALH, with no boost issues what so ever. So I am a little sceptical about this labeling of hybrids being crap. Perhaps they've been given a bad name by cheap builds off eBay??
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Old July 3rd, 2019, 14:09   #5
adi_mazilu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasengine View Post
Has anyone had a successful remap with the BKP engine with a DSG box?
I have the Darkside EGR & cooler delete with the turbo hard pipe kit. Turbo Dynamics hybrid turbo good for 220bhp (GT22 billet compressor, trimmed turbine, upgraded thrust bearing etc).
I had a remap some years ago, but unknown at the time the vacuum valve box response was slow. I have recently changed it to a N75 valve and the boost response is very quick, but the tune is unstable and has strange over-boost and fuelling under certain load and rpm conditions, which I have to keep an eye on the boost gauge to correct. I've checked for a sticking VNT actuator, but on installing the standard MAP, shows perfect boost response under all revs and load conditions, so I don't see the hybrid turbo being an issue.
Two independent well known tuners have declined to tune this setup, one because it has a 'hybrid' turbo and the other because of the extent of the programming for 4bar MAP etc (not installed yet)... Maybe the DSG has an influence on tuning here?
So I am now running the standard MAP which is slow and boring together with the engine check lights flashing at me! This can't be a 'one-off' impossible setup....can it?? Or does everyone keep clear of the BKP with DSG and hybrids
I can help you
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Old July 4th, 2019, 16:25   #6
adamss24
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Trimming the turbine is a cheap way of trying to hide a poorly matched compressor to a small turbine and limit the surge- wont do much to stop spikes ! Either get a new,matched turbine or get a gtb turbo and tune that !

Alh has a archaic edc15 ecu with a lot less maps for n75 that's why you felt no issues then with the larger hybrid...edc16 is a lot more sofisticated and reacts a lot quicker compared with edc15...

As i've built over 100 hybrids i can guarantee you that the td hybrid is crap, seen their work before...had a crap one on a 2.5 v6 tdi (!), also every garret turbo from gt1749v on has an upgraded trust bearing ! They're passing 20 years old tech as being novelty !

Last edited by adamss24; July 4th, 2019 at 16:35.
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Old July 5th, 2019, 02:25   #7
Bobby Singh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adamss24 View Post
They're passing 20 years old tech as being novelty !

haha - Chris the worse part is they sell them as 240hp units (at least for the 1.9's) - CW from a BMW 530d basically on stock TW.
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Old July 7th, 2019, 12:32   #8
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I know Bobby, that's why i told the OP to change his turbo before doing any more work or spending any more money ! Years ago i bought a car from a fellow forum member, it had large poorly setup nozzles and a md240 turbo from the usual "suspects" ! It was a non runner and upon removal of the turbo i found turbine wheel damaged by shards of metal from failing exhaust manifolds ! I phoned TD and said that i wanted to repair the turbo and they said they don't replace the turbine, they just "clip" the blades to improve spool ! They said i need a new turbo at a tune of over 1200 + VAT ! I just asked why they charge so much for just a compressor change ? It wasn't anything exotic, as you said just stock 56mm compressor... Few months after the incident, two guys i know left Turbo Dynamics and started their own business - Tdi Turbos - then a few years later they've split and each went their way ! One is Craig at tdi turbos and the other is Adam Springer Davidson at Pioneering Performance -which i strongly recommend the OP to get in touch with to fix his poor hybrid !
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Old July 9th, 2019, 01:56   #9
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Adam's manifold/2260 do work well -

Managed to get this from a 1.9 stock injectors etc
Very low emp

Its more geared up for 300hp plus (due to runner sizes) - soon will have larger injectors.


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Old July 9th, 2019, 22:56   #10
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That's nice to see ! Thanks Bobby for sharing with us your finds !!!
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Old July 10th, 2019, 00:59   #11
ibizatdi130
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on my seat leon bkd I use a 4 in 1 manifold found on ebay with gtb1756vk with mfs cw. Before I have try gt1852v and it was a crap, next gtb1756 mfs with stock manifold I was having surge problems at low rpm and bad power at hight rpm
now with that 4 in 1 manifold and the same gtb1756vk mfs work realy better than with stock manifold, no surge and spool very quickly at low rpm. I have wraped it and painted with silicon


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Old July 10th, 2019, 01:25   #12
ibizatdi130
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my tuning files is not realy perfect, I need to spend more time on it but but the car work realy better than with stock manifold



Mardi,26,Mars,2019,22:10:20:50725-VCID:74E653DF177D0AE69E-8020,Version VCDS: FRM 17.8.0,Version données: 20170721 DS276.2
03G 906 021 LL,,R4 2.0L EDC G000SG 9185,

,Groupe A:,'011,,,,Groupe B:, Non actif,,,,Groupe C:, Non actif
,,Engine Speed,Boost Pressure,Boost Pressure,Charge Pressure,,,,,,,,,,
,Repère,(G28),(specified),(actual),Control Duty Cycle,Repère,,,,,Repère,,,,
Marqueur,temps, /min,,, %,temps,,,,,temps,,,,
,0.11,1659,1032.0,1080.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,0.27,1638,1032.0,1068.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,0.44,1638,1032.0,1068.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,0.60,1617,1032.0,1068.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,0.75,1596,1032.0,1056.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,0.91,1575,1032.0,1056.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,1.08,1554,1032.0,1044.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,1.24,1533,1032.0,1044.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,1.40,1512,1032.0,1044.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,1.55,1512,1032.0,1044.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,1.72,1491,1032.0,1032.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,1.88,1470,1032.0,1032.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,2.03,1449,1032.0,1032.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,2.19,1428,1032.0,1020.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,2.37,1407,1032.0,1020.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,2.52,1386,1032.0,1020.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,2.68,1386,1032.0,1020.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,2.83,1365,1032.0,1008.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,3.01,1344,1056.0,1008.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,3.16,1323,1056.0,1008.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,3.32,1323,1068.0,1008.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,3.47,1323,1116.0,1008.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,3.64,1344,1248.0,1008.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,3.80,1323,1284.0,1008.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,3.96,1323,1284.0,1020.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,4.11,1344,1308.0,1032.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,4.29,1365,1308.0,1032.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,4.44,1365,1320.0,1044.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,4.60,1386,1332.0,1056.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,4.76,1407,1344.0,1068.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,4.93,1428,1404.0,1080.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,5.08,1449,1416.0,1092.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,5.24,1491,1512.0,1104.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,5.40,1512,1656.0,1128.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,5.57,1554,1692.0,1164.0,75.0,,,,,,,,,,
,5.72,1575,1740.0,1200.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,5.88,1617,1848.0,1236.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,6.04,1659,1992.0,1284.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,6.21,1701,2124.0,1332.0,75.8,,,,,,,,,,
,6.37,1743,2196.0,1392.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,6.52,1785,2244.0,1452.0,73.8,,,,,,,,,,
,6.68,1827,2244.0,1524.0,71.8,,,,,,,,,,
,6.85,1890,2256.0,1620.0,71.8,,,,,,,,,,
,7.01,1932,2532.0,1692.0,75.4,,,,,,,,,,
,7.17,1995,2724.0,1988.0,71.4,,,,,,,,,,
,7.32,2037,2760.0,2120.0,67.9,,,,,,,,,,
,7.49,2100,2796.0,2324.0,66.7,,,,,,,,,,
,7.65,2184,2832.0,2416.0,66.7,,,,,,,,,,
,7.81,2247,2868.0,2596.0,67.5,,,,,,,,,,
,7.96,2310,2880.0,2740.0,61.2,,,,,,,,,,
,8.13,2394,2904.0,2896.0,58.8,,,,,,,,,,
,8.29,2478,2928.0,2928.0,55.6,,,,,,,,,,
,8.44,2541,2940.0,3048.0,49.3,,,,,,,,,,
,8.60,2604,2940.0,3060.0,39.1,,,,,,,,,,
,8.77,2709,2940.0,3060.0,34.7,,,,,,,,,,
,8.93,2772,2940.0,3060.0,35.1,,,,,,,,,,
,9.09,2856,2940.0,3060.0,35.1,,,,,,,,,,
,9.24,2940,2940.0,3060.0,34.3,,,,,,,,,,
,9.41,3024,2940.0,3060.0,33.9,,,,,,,,,,
,9.57,3108,2940.0,3024.0,32.7,,,,,,,,,,
,9.73,3192,2940.0,3012.0,30.8,,,,,,,,,,
,9.88,3255,2940.0,3024.0,28.4,,,,,,,,,,
,10.06,3360,2940.0,3024.0,27.2,,,,,,,,,,
,10.21,3423,2940.0,3000.0,26.4,,,,,,,,,,
,10.37,3528,2940.0,2964.0,25.3,,,,,,,,,,
,10.53,3591,2940.0,2952.0,24.5,,,,,,,,,,
,10.70,3675,2940.0,2928.0,24.5,,,,,,,,,,
,10.85,3738,2940.0,2904.0,23.7,,,,,,,,,,
,11.01,3822,2940.0,2892.0,23.3,,,,,,,,,,
,11.17,3885,2940.0,2880.0,22.9,,,,,,,,,,
,11.34,3969,2940.0,2868.0,22.5,,,,,,,,,,
,11.49,4032,2940.0,2844.0,22.5,,,,,,,,,,
,11.65,3864,1080.0,2688.0,46.9,,,,,,,,,,
,11.81,3549,1056.0,2220.0,48.9,,,,,,,,,,
,11.97,3213,1056.0,1956.0,51.7,,,,,,,,,,
,12.13,2940,1044.0,1764.0,55.6,,,,,,,,,,
,12.29,2709,1044.0,1608.0,67.1,,,,,,,,,,
,12.44,2709,1044.0,1524.0,67.1,,,,,,,,,,
,12.61,2730,1044.0,1488.0,67.1,,,,,,,,,,
,12.78,2688,1044.0,1464.0,67.9,,,,,,,,,,
,12.93,2688,1044.0,1464.0,68.3,,,,,,,,,,
,13.09,2688,1044.0,1452.0,69.4,,,,,,,,,,
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Old July 10th, 2019, 03:24   #13
tdi_my live
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Your requested pressure ist till 2300rpm to high.
Set it down, max 100mbar than the Turbo can do.
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Old July 10th, 2019, 05:34   #14
ibizatdi130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdi_my live View Post
Your requested pressure ist till 2300rpm to high.
Set it down, max 100mbar than the Turbo can do.

yes I know that I need to work on my tune but I'm too busy... I think I can also close the vnt a little bite more over 3000rpm, but this time have experienced some problems on this car, leaking gearbox, leaking tandem pump, leaking clutch mastercylinder etc... and I don't know if I want to spend time on that tune when will change for a gtd1756vrk soon...

Last edited by ibizatdi130; July 10th, 2019 at 05:40.
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Old July 11th, 2019, 05:51   #15
Jasengine
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Thanks for all your info. I'm guessing my setup is not ideal. I've had a tuner look into tuning and had come up against issues with 4bar map mapping and limp mode which would require a lot of work. Not sure what the details are but the Siemens ECU sounds different to the norm...
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