Timing Belt Popped on Client

alphaseinor

TDI Innovator, Gone but Not Forgotten
Joined
Jul 30, 2006
Location
Denton, TX
TDI
'03 Jetta TDI 780,000 miles (totaled out), 01 Audi TT 225 Quattro 230,000 Miles (runs great!), 00 Cabreetle Beetle dash, ALH & MK4 harness Swap
Well, I'm replacing a head, and timing belt now... just thought I would share the experience with unknown parts.

The Story

I have a client that brought a car to me about eight months ago, needed a belt change. I used his parts, which I notified him were not my preferred type (generic... This is the first time I've used them... and now I know why...). He just needed it for about a year of driving.

He called me last week and said his car was running kinda rough, gave slowdown shutter symptoms. I was going to go out and see it... however yesterday his belt popped at the lower idler.

2000 miles since my belt change...

The Parts

I'm not going to name any names, but let's just say it's no one I know here on the boards... 100% generic, no part numbers that match... cheap junk.

What I'm doing for him

I'm not admitting any guilt on the installation... this puppy failed... it's the parts fault...

Since I put in junk (which I suspected) instead of waiting on "real" timing belt parts, I'm volunteering my time and my money to fix his car. This problem will not happen again.

The Damage

Here's the funny part: Tensioner, all rollers, camshaft, crankshaft, water pump and injection pump are "normal" no unusual feel, no grittyness, no locking.

Head: I haven't even looked to see how many valves hit
Timing Belt: Yes... it snapped... very unusual how clean it broke...almost as if it was at a seam... couldn't find any damage to the belt other than it's got a clean break.

The Moral

Don't use junk parts under any circumstance, even for short periods of time!


This is my first belt failure... ever... all of my other customers are cooking along nicely... no problems

I've kept my preferred vendors, and I will refuse, as usual to install anything that isn't what I recommend for their car.
 

jasonTDI

TDI GURU Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Apr 26, 2001
Location
Oregon, WI
TDI
20' RAM 3500 CCLB dually HO/Aisan. 2019 Cherokee 2.0T
It DID break at the seam.

I'll say I'm sorry it happened, it sucks.

That's the reason I WILL NOT install unknown junk. Period. I don't even like people bringing in stuff. In fact you have no warranty if you do unless I KNOW where it came from. (I have to see the shipping box as proof)

That said I think I'd say he's S.O.L. Since it's not your fault and HE supplied the parts. Make him put a claim against the supplier.

There IS a seam in the belt, look at a new one. You'll see it. Must have used Chinese cat-gut for stiching.....
 

Dimitri16V

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 30, 2005
Location
DE
TDI
01 Golf, 04 Golf
Most repair places have the same policy. Since they are charging extra for parts , they don't like customers bringing their own. Can't really blame shop owners though since there are some junk parts outhere.
Alpha, can you post a pic from the belt break ?
 

TDIJetta99

Top Post Dawg
Joined
May 17, 2005
Location
Port Jervis, New York, USA
TDI
03... Faster than yours =]
I've had one brought to me like that, about 4500 miles after a change. I never asked who changed the belt the first time... Some no-name belt was on it... same crap, clean break right at the seam.... I have one here right now that has a questionable Gates belt on it.. It looks like the 100k belt, but doesn't have the part number that I'm used to seeing...
 

alphaseinor

TDI Innovator, Gone but Not Forgotten
Joined
Jul 30, 2006
Location
Denton, TX
TDI
'03 Jetta TDI 780,000 miles (totaled out), 01 Audi TT 225 Quattro 230,000 Miles (runs great!), 00 Cabreetle Beetle dash, ALH & MK4 harness Swap
Oh yes, I know he's technically SOL, however I have a reputation to uphold... It's a matter of pride! There was no warranty because of the parts, and he knew it.

I'll see if I can post pics later on...
 

paramedick

TDIClub Enthusiast, Vendor
Joined
Jul 29, 2001
Location
Versailles, Kentucky
TDI
2015 Audi Q5 TDI
Got a phone call from another reputable TB installer a few days ago.

Customer brought him the TB kit he bought off Ebay. He was concerned.

My answer was he had reason to be concerned. I urged him to compare it to known good parts and see if he really wanted to install it.
 

alphaseinor

TDI Innovator, Gone but Not Forgotten
Joined
Jul 30, 2006
Location
Denton, TX
TDI
'03 Jetta TDI 780,000 miles (totaled out), 01 Audi TT 225 Quattro 230,000 Miles (runs great!), 00 Cabreetle Beetle dash, ALH & MK4 harness Swap
Normally I tell them to take it back... for whatever reason, I decided to use these since it was a short amount of time with very little miles...

now I'm back to the moral...
 

jasonTDI

TDI GURU Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Apr 26, 2001
Location
Oregon, WI
TDI
20' RAM 3500 CCLB dually HO/Aisan. 2019 Cherokee 2.0T
No morals about it. Hard feelings maybe (who wouldn't feel bad for the guy) but sometimes you just have to do business the hardball way. That said I'd work a deal on the labor for him but that's as far as it goes. And yes I am insured. It's not an issue of a claim, it's an issue of junk parts against the mechanics advice. But that's all water under the bridge at this point. Hope it works out.
 

alphaseinor

TDI Innovator, Gone but Not Forgotten
Joined
Jul 30, 2006
Location
Denton, TX
TDI
'03 Jetta TDI 780,000 miles (totaled out), 01 Audi TT 225 Quattro 230,000 Miles (runs great!), 00 Cabreetle Beetle dash, ALH & MK4 harness Swap
jasonTDI said:
Hope it works out.
With my parts... yes... it will...

he's going after the company that sold him the parts...
 
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KROUT

persona non grata
Joined
Aug 26, 2005
Location
JAX FL
I am with Jason on this one. I would how ever discount the labor but he would be paying something for my time. Why should you be out of pocket anything when he made the choice to buy cheap parts. Oem parts are not that much more.

I will not warranty any part I dont buy.
 
Joined
Apr 27, 2003
Location
Stafford Virginia 22556
TDI
96 glx variant tdi
So what happens if it happens to a "known" name ? Yesterday, I installed a FEBI cam made in Turkey, FEBI headbolts made in Taiwan, and a FEBI roller made in China, and followers made in... hmmm... never did read where they were made now that I think of it. If you say only OEM parts, that rules out a lot of parts we commonly advocate buying from vendors on here.
 

Losha

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2005
Location
Sioux Falls, SD
TDI
06 Jetta TDI DSG, 2001 Golf TDI, Audi S6, A8, Toureg
Sorry to hear about that. I know its not your fault but sometimes we just have to take a loss, I hope that he will pay some for your time spend.

ninedee_golf_tdi said:
So what happens if it happens to a "known" name ? Yesterday, I installed a FEBI cam made in Turkey, FEBI headbolts made in Taiwan, and a FEBI roller made in China, and followers made in... hmmm... never did read where they were made now that I think of it. If you say only OEM parts, that rules out a lot of parts we commonly advocate buying from vendors on here.
Thats what I noticed too, some of this trusted brand names that were supposed to be OEM have parts that are made in like china, taiwan, or some other countries that make bad quality parts. Its had to decide sometimes if to use that part or not.
 

tdidieselbobny

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 4, 2005
Location
Stafford,NY (WNY)
TDI
'03 Galactic Blue Jetta TDI, '15 Silk Blue Golf Sportwagen TDI
I'm just wondering-the older these cars get,do the replacement parts get worse? Does it get more difficult to get "known" quality??
 

jasonTDI

TDI GURU Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Apr 26, 2001
Location
Oregon, WI
TDI
20' RAM 3500 CCLB dually HO/Aisan. 2019 Cherokee 2.0T
About the only febi stuff I use is the cam but again that's FEBI/Bilstein. I've not had issues with their stuff so far. But then again I only use Litens kits from Dieselgeek. THAT'S why I ask what you're coming with FIRST. I'm pretty close to not installing a HEPU water pump ever again in a TDI though. I have one in the car I bought leaking after 13K. Just like the 3 others of the 10 kits with that pump I've installed. Not to dis the vendors that sell them but I've had terrible luck with them.

And I don't say OE only I say OEM. If it's gates or litens that sourcce INA rollers from europe I'm just fine with that stuff.
 

jasonTDI

TDI GURU Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Apr 26, 2001
Location
Oregon, WI
TDI
20' RAM 3500 CCLB dually HO/Aisan. 2019 Cherokee 2.0T
If you guys are getting chinese parts in TB kits you need to go to another vendor. I won't chance a clients car on their hit or miss quality. Just because someone wants to under cut another vendor and is saving $4 in the process by getting parts 4th or 5th hand I find that bad business. That's again another reason I stay where I'm at for TB kits. Could I save a few $$ Sure but it's not worth it. PERIOD.
 
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