Another one bites the dust

diesel-wrench

Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Location
Texas
TDI
Passat wagon
A short history- bought the car with VW extended with 57,000 miles. At about 60,000 started to complain to the dealer that it did not run or idle as smoothly as it once did. Many service visits later, motor mounts (leaking) tandem pump (leaking) CV joints both sides rear shocks and bunch of front suspension links and numerous hook ups to the computer to check things- we pretty much decided that it was our imagination.

Timing belt (at the dealer because I was busy) at just under 100,000. Then an alternator and alternator pulley and the electric fan at 105,000 and now finally the master tech who looked at it on Friday says there is likely a problem with the oil pump drive and balance shaft assembly (based on the rude noises from the engine and the fact that you can not keep the dipstick in the tube anymore).

So it is sitting outside my shop and I guess I will get to work on after all - I had hoped to avoid actually touching it myself but 2700 quoted from the dealer is a big enough bill I can afford to NOT work on someone else's vehicle for a few days and work on my own.

I wonder if I can jam a 4BT Cummins in there?? Anyway, I have read over all the threads about the change over and it does not sound a lot different or more complex than the stuff I normally do (just smaller - as an aside I start an overhaul on a 14.7L six cylinder diesel on Monday) so I am going to give it a shot.

My only questions at this point have mainly to do with tools and one or two clarifications on the actual procedure.

Are the special tools on ebay good enough to do the job based on a one time use plan. By that I mean I expect to use them once maybe twice and then not ever again (more on that in a bit). I realize that the steel may not be as good or the piece as well made as a much more expensive tool but will they get the job done? Actual experiences would be great.

I have seen the timing belt changed on a Passat using 3 different techniques. One was to remove the nose of the car altogether. Another was to swing the nose off to one side and the third left the nose of the car alone. I think they removed the rad to gain access to the front of the engine to do the belt. So... anyone think that replacing the chain drive can be done without pulling the front end and is it worth the (I expect ) extra trouble to do it that way. Is there a real time saving over the first two?

Next question- being as the timing belt and tensioner have about 14,000 miles on them thoughts on their reuse would be appreciated. My first reaction is to toss them all just based on the crappy luck I have had in the past with after market belts and tensioners on other things. Are the VW ones any better and is it worth the risk? Or am I just being anal. Thanks for any thoughts you may have. Bryan


RANT WARNING!
Now for the rant part- you can skip this if you like- I said I would only need the tools once or maybe twice. I am going to drive this car for another 3 1/2 years or about 125,000 miles at our current rate of use. I see that as one more timing belt change and then this car is going down the road or over a bank on fire -one or the other. And VW has lost one customer forever. Period. Never again no way even if you gave me one of their cars. Too bad because up until this point I thought they where one of the greatest autos ever built. Loved my Jetta diesel could not say enough good about them. Not anymore. RANT OFF
 

dieseldorf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Location
MA
TDI
ex- 1996 wagon, ex-2000 Jetta
diesel-wrench said:
Timing belt (at the dealer because I was busy) at just under 100,000. Then an alternator and alternator pulley and the electric fan at 105,000 and now finally the master tech who looked at it on Friday says there is likely a problem with the oil pump drive and balance shaft assembly (based on the rude noises from the engine and the fact that you can not keep the dipstick in the tube anymore).

Diesel, has the balance shaft work been completed yet :confused:


I wonder if I can jam a 4BT Cummins in there?? Anyway, I have read over all the threads about the change over and it does not sound a lot different or more complex than the stuff I normally do (just smaller - as an aside I start an overhaul on a 14.7L six cylinder diesel on Monday) so I am going to give it a shot.
Too cool! That would certainly be the most desirable B5.5 in all the lands! :D What will you use for a transmission?

Welcome aboard!
 

diesel-wrench

Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Location
Texas
TDI
Passat wagon
No to the balance shaft work- that is the job I am doing myself. At 1195 for the parts that leaves me 1500 for my time and some tools. Guess I can spare a few days for a thousand bucks left in my pocket.
As to a transmission I would go with something from Dodge being as you can just bolt them onto the cummins. Probably the auto- you can build them up to handle a 5.9 making about 900 HP so they should be good for the car. :)
 

chittychittybangbang

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2007
Location
TX
TDI
none
I bought some zdmak tools off ebay and found the metalnerd crankshaft lock to be a slightly better fit. Pin is the same. Here are my experiences changing the belt and oil pump chain: http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q_how_to/b5/bhw_timingbelt_1.htm and http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q_how_to/b5/balanceshaft _moduleReplace.htm , hope the additional pics and descriptions help the .pdf install article you may have already seen. I would remove the lock carrier because the only additional step is swinging the AC condenser to the side and draining the ATF. You get a lot more room. The B5.5 passat carrier doesn't swing the same way as the B5 carrier.
 

Sloppy Snood

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2006
Location
Midwest
TDI
Passsat
If you would like, you could borrow my Dieselgeek B5 timing belt toolkit. All you have to do is ask and send it back when the job is complete. :)
 

diesel-wrench

Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Location
Texas
TDI
Passat wagon
Sloppy Snood said:
If you would like, you could borrow my Dieselgeek B5 timing belt toolkit. All you have to do is ask and send it back when the job is complete. :)
Thank You- when I eventually get over being P.O.'d with my Passat and VWNA and get the car into my shop I may do that. At the moment it is going to sit outside my shop for probably another month while I try and work out a reasonable explanation as to why it is going to catch fire in the middle of the night.:mad:
Also I have- as I mentioned - a 14L to overhaul and it appears probably a powerstroke now in line ahead of the Passat. Oh well she can drive the incredibly dependable almost never breaks cheap to fix when it does and not bad to work on 1994 ISUZU trooper.:eek: until I get around to the Passat. Bryan
 

aja8888

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 25, 2007
Location
Texas..RETIRED 12/31/17
TDI
Out of TDI's
diesel-wrench said:
Thank You- when I eventually get over being P.O.'d with my Passat and VWNA and get the car into my shop I may do that. At the moment it is going to sit outside my shop for probably another month while I try and work out a reasonable explanation as to why it is going to catch fire in the middle of the night.:mad:
Bryan
Drive it down to Zapata and park it in the Holiday Inn Express lot............leave the keys in it............call your insurance company the next day....:p
 

diesel-wrench

Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Location
Texas
TDI
Passat wagon
ninedee_golf_tdi said:
Do what this owner did, road trip:
Well - if I had any warranty left that would be one thing. If I could have found a dealer who could have figured out (or listened to me but what do I know ) that my vibration problem was the famous balance shaft drive chain problem then it would not be sitting outside my shop and I would not be :mad: :mad:

I have been complaining about the vibration in this car for 50,000 miles. The vibration has been growing worse over time and now finally, after the warranty period has expired, and the engine vibrates so badly that you can not keep the dipstick in the tube anymore, the geniuses at VW come up with - oh by the way you have a problem - we would love to solve this problem which only just happened since the last oil change for a mere 2700 bucks.


A little later this week VWNA will hear from me about my experience- I already know what a waste of time this will be but I will try and see if they will belly up to the bar and buy a round. Or not. Who knows, they may exceed my expectations.

I at least know that, when I get around to fixing the car, I can count on other VW owners to help me out with offers of tools and advice on how to proceed even if I can not get any response out of VW themselves. Thanks Guys.
 

DickSilver

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2004
Location
Kentucky
TDI
2004 B5.5V, 1996 B4V
You have vibration complaints on file in the VWNA system from long before the warranty expired. Go after them for proper satisfaction!!
 

MOGolf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jun 27, 2001
Location
underneath something
TDI
2001 Golf GLS TDI Reflex silver, rough road suspension and steel skid plate, 2004 Passat Variant, Candy White, rough road suspension and geared balanced shaft module, and much, much more. 2016 LR RR HSE TD6, 2019 Jaguar I-PACE
You can do the entire timing belt and BSM replacement with the front of the car in the service position. I've done a lot of them this way. See http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=241307.

Go to www.metalnerd.com for the timing belt tools if you want a set to keep.

Reuse of timing belt and tensioner is your call. There's a limited number of manufacturers of these parts. They are suppliers to VW for the parts stamped with the VW/Audi logos. There's no difference in quality.
 

quantum_tdi

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2004
Location
Seattle, WA
TDI
R320 CDI, '96 B4V (for sale)
DickSilver said:
You have vibration complaints on file in the VWNA system from long before the warranty expired. Go after them for proper satisfaction!!
x2 I had warranty items done at 67K on an '02 Golf after the 50K warranty expired as I had started the complaining before 50K. Damned if I can remember what it was though...
 

diesel-wrench

Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Location
Texas
TDI
Passat wagon
Well it will probably come as no surprise to anyone- I am not surprised at all. VWNA has decided that they will NOT come to the party and of course the dealer will not come without VWNA along too.

So, in spite of vibration complaints I am on my own to repair the car and pay for the repair. Vibration is not something that is covered by warranty and that there was not an outright failure before the end of the warranty period means there was and is nothing VW can do. The person we talked to also expressed the opinion that the balance shaft drive chain and tensioner was a wear part just like the timing belt. This is maintenance you know.

Mind you they where nice about it -they are sending us a nice coupon (and a letter I expect) the coupon is for a 1000 dollars off the purchase of a new VW.

I wonder if you can guess how llikely it is that the coupon will ever be used?
 

leicaman

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 24, 2004
Location
Sheboygan, Wisconsin
TDI
2015 Golf TDI SE, 2005 TDI GLS, RIP
Yeah it sure seems like B5.5 Passat owners were used and abused by VWoA. First build a POC chain driven balance shaft. Then secretly issue a technical bulletin that is yanked off the shelves. Then superceded the balance shaft with the gear driven variety. Don't forget the design gets noisy, noisy, AFTER the warranty period for many and for some with good dealers they get fixed. It is not right.. Thanks VW.

Oh yeah and then all the dealers act dumb when you yipe about your vibrator, otherwise known as a B5.5 TDI passat...

Oh and lets repeat, the VWoA factor...discusting.
 

quantum_tdi

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2004
Location
Seattle, WA
TDI
R320 CDI, '96 B4V (for sale)
diesel-wrench said:
Well it will probably come as no surprise to anyone- I am not surprised at all. VWNA has decided that they will NOT come to the party and of course the dealer will not come without VWNA along too.

So, in spite of vibration complaints I am on my own to repair the car and pay for the repair.
Boo! Even though vibration has been shown to be the harbinger of doom, these clowns are doing what the auto companies mantra has always been: deny, deny deny.
 

traubenberg

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2009
Location
Ville of Liberty
TDI
B5.5 Passat (wagon)
diesel-wrench said:
the coupon is for a 1000 dollars off the purchase of a new VW.
eBay? Maybe you can get a couple hundred bucks for it.

I know ...it ain't much, but it beats a poke in the eye with a sharp stick. (At least I'd have to assume that it would.)
 
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