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Fuels & Lubricants Discussion all about Fuels & Lubricants. synthetic oil, conventional oil, brands, change intervals, diesel grades, gelling and such debated items like that. Non TDI related postings will be moved or removed. This forum is NOT for the discussion of biodiesel and other alternative fuels.

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Old June 26th, 2005, 09:48   #1
cp
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Default The Big Squeeze By Big Oil

That's the lead story on front page of the 6/26 Kansas City Star.

You can read the whole article by going to The KC Star website but it's one of those sites where you'll have to register to read it.

The gist of it is that the number of refineries in the US has declined from 324 in 1981 to 148 today. Capacity has not decreased by a lesser amount-- in 1981 the 324 refineries could refine roughly 18.5 million barrels per day; today's output is something like 17 million barrels, around a 9% decrease in capacity. But-demand is up 38% in the same period, resulting in a 73% increase in the inflation-adjusted price of unleaded.

The saddest part of the story is that none of this is coincidence. They discovered instances in which oil companies refused to sell old refineries to cash-in-hand buyers, preferring instead to shutter the refinery so its capacity disappeared, thus 'tightening the market'. Other attempts by independents to build refineries have been thwarted in their efforts, but not by who you'd suspect (the EPA).

A disheartening, but interesting article. I can't blame the oil companies for wanting to be more efficient, but now we are running on the ragged edge of capacity with nothing in reserve.
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Old June 26th, 2005, 11:31   #2
Geordi
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Default Re: The Big Squeeze By Big Oil

And nobody believed the reports when it was happening, that Enron was deliberately manipulating the power market to greatly increase it's own profits. Here we are with big oil doing EXACTLY the same thing, but nobody will believe it... Because W says it isn't happening. Hmm. Any farmers here? Want to let that wolf guard your chickens? I'm sure that gleam in his eye doesn't mean anything...
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Old June 26th, 2005, 14:01   #3
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Default Re: The Big Squeeze By Big Oil

why shouldn't they....we will buy it as long as it is there. People at work tell me they will drive there full size SUVs to work (by themselves) as long as someone sells gas. They would not be caught dead on the highway in a little car like mine. So I say again....why shouldn't they.
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Old June 26th, 2005, 14:52   #4
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Default Re: The Big Squeeze By Big Oil

Quote:
why shouldn't they....we will buy it as long as it is there. People at work tell me they will drive there full size SUVs to work (by themselves) as long as someone sells gas. They would not be caught dead on the highway in a little car like mine. So I say again....why shouldn't they.
Right you are. Most of us completely rejected the need for conservation once fuel prices went back down. Did we think this would last forever? I've always been drawn to efficient cars because I like the idea. Frankly, I bought my first TDI because I wanted the range and I thought it was cool. Guess it was a good idea for other reasons, too.
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Old June 26th, 2005, 16:02   #5
TornadoRed
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Default The Big Squeeze By Big Oil

I saw an article somewhere this weekend about plans to go forward for a new refinery east of Yuma, AZ. The investors wanted to build in or near Maricopa County, but gave up because of all the resistance from environmental groups. The county where they are now planning to build only has 1000 population or so.

The lesson is, if you plan to build a refinery, expect LOTS of opposition. Maybe if fuel costs go over $5/gallon, it will become easier to get the permits.
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Old June 26th, 2005, 16:04   #6
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Old June 26th, 2005, 17:31   #7
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Default Re: The Big Squeeze By Big Oil

I am all for alternative fuels, solar power, wind power etc.

However, until the cost of petroleum products get high enough to make it uncomfortable for the majority of Americans, nothing is going to happen here in the states.

Thats my opinion....but I think it is pretty well founded.

Hmmmmm....anyone remember the gas crunch in the 70's? What happened since then? Not much as far as I can tell. Seriously....30 years later do we have vast improvements in efficiency or newer fuel technology? NO...well at least not on a national scale.

I wish this were not the case...but I fear it is. Im doing my part I suppose.....
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Old June 26th, 2005, 17:40   #8
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Default Re: The Big Squeeze By Big Oil *DELETED*

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Old June 26th, 2005, 17:43   #9
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Well, DUH. We knew that already.

I think. What did you say?
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Old June 26th, 2005, 17:57   #10
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Default Re: The Big Squeeze By Big Oil

Sure I remember both fuel shocks. In '73 I was driving a cherry 57 bug with about 40K on it. Beautiful car, absolutely trecherous to drive. Numb steering, oversteer, no power, lousy brakes. But it got 40 MPG at Nixon's 50 MPH speed limit.

In '78 I was driving a brand spanking new Rabbit L Diesel. I bought the car because I loved it and my father in law to be thought I was the brightest guy on earth to have anticipated the crisis.

Here we go again. Anyone learn anything? In '78 it was Ford Galaxies; today it's Ford Expeditions.
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Old June 27th, 2005, 05:45   #11
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yum, yum
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Old June 27th, 2005, 09:29   #12
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Default The Big Squeeze By Big Oil

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resulting in a 73% increase in the inflation-adjusted price of unleaded.
I believe this should be the NON-inflation adjusted price. If you take inflation into account, the price of regular gas spiked to just over $3/gal in March of 1981.
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Old June 27th, 2005, 15:40   #13
cp
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Default The Big Squeeze By Big Oil

Quote:
Quote:
resulting in a 73% increase in the inflation-adjusted price of unleaded.
I believe this should be the NON-inflation adjusted price. If you take inflation into account, the price of regular gas spiked to just over $3/gal in March of 1981.
I was quoting the article. You could very well be right.
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Old June 28th, 2005, 07:01   #14
RabbitGTI
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Default Re: The Big Squeeze By Big Oil

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why shouldn't they....we will buy it as long as it is there. People at work tell me they will drive there full size SUVs to work (by themselves) as long as someone sells gas. They would not be caught dead on the highway in a little car like mine. So I say again....why shouldn't they.
And they are the exact same azzholes who speed recklessly, tailgate and cut people off because they drive "safe" vehicles.
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