Volkswagen's Clean Air Act violations on 2009+ TDIs spark huge recall, investigations

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pkhoury

That guy with the goats
Joined
Nov 30, 2010
Location
Medina, TX
TDI
2013 JSW, 2003 Jetta Ute, 2 x 2002 Golf, 2000 Golf
What do you guys want as a fair compensation for all this?

1. Software flash plus a gift card and extended warranty
2. Software flash plus compensation for the discrepancy in performance and gas mileage.
3. Buyback at KBB's pricing plus 10% premium
4. Buyback at Kbb's pricing plus 10% ONLY if you buy another vw(if not, you get the software flash from #1). New vw will be at a special discounted price as well.
5. Same offer as #3 but extends to the entire VW group of cars.
6. Make up your own offer and discuss
Between $7500 and $10K would be acceptable to me, but we know that's not going to happen. If it were up to CARB, it would be a mandatory buy back from VW and we'd get credit towards a Prius. And I'd also have to turn in my man card.
 

pkhoury

That guy with the goats
Joined
Nov 30, 2010
Location
Medina, TX
TDI
2013 JSW, 2003 Jetta Ute, 2 x 2002 Golf, 2000 Golf
The toxicity of many of the posts in this thread saddens me. I never thought the TDI community was so full of hateful close minded people. This is not some great EPA conspiracy theory. This is all VW's own doing to make an easier buck at the expense of ALL OF US, the Law, the planet and the future health of generations to come. Shameful on VW's part and shameful on everyone who thinks somehow VW is the victim in all of this. We're the victims.
Victims of what? This honestly doesn't affect me any. While I do cringe at trucks that blow black smoke out of the exhaust (no emissions control whatsoever), I keep toying with the idea of removing my DPF, which has already been replaced once, so I can get better fuel economy. The EPA is somewhat of a scam, but CARB is worse. Biggest waste of my tax dollars.
 

TDI2000Zim

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 23, 2010
Location
NJ
TDI
VW hat meinen '14 Passat TDiSE getötet.
When the dust settles, VW may BEATLE us on TDIs...

For the Millennials here, VW removed the air cooled Beatle from the US market in 1979, never to come back. The New Beatle is merely a Golf in disguise.
 

onslaught192

Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2015
Location
Toronto
TDI
Jetta Highline
scheduled service

longtime lurker, so i signed up just to ask this question...lol

i own a 2104 jetta tdi highline and have the 30k service coming up.....with this emission scandal, would they have the balls to do any kind of software flash/fix without my knowledge or without telling me that could possibly omit me from the lawsuits/litigation that's upcoming??

should i do the service myself?

thanks
 

PlaneCrazy

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 3, 2000
Location
Province of Quebec, Canada
TDI
Gone...
In any case, I want to see some retesting of the 2007-2009 E320 Bluetec, as it may actually offer the best possibility for a system that could work to retrofit the CBEA and CJAA cars - LNT plus a SCR that works off of ammonia emissions from the LNT, no urea tank needed.
My memory may be failing me but I seem to recall that those early Bluetecs were NOT 50 state cars, and not admissible in the CARB states. If so that wouldn't be much of a solution.
 

dak503

Active member
Joined
Oct 20, 2013
Location
northern nj
TDI
2013 passat se
my only concern right now is Ive been using scan gauge on my car since new.have I been running my car in test mode for the last 53k miles. how is it activated.
 

pkhoury

That guy with the goats
Joined
Nov 30, 2010
Location
Medina, TX
TDI
2013 JSW, 2003 Jetta Ute, 2 x 2002 Golf, 2000 Golf
My memory may be failing me but I seem to recall that those early Bluetecs were NOT 50 state cars, and not admissible in the CARB states. If so that wouldn't be much of a solution.
Uhh... CARB states? CARB = California Air Resources Board. I seriously hope to God there isn't more than one California. One is enough to deal with in the US.
 

Norm0770

Well-known member
Joined
May 27, 2008
Location
Indianapolis, IN
TDI
None anymore
Has anyone who received the earlier recall update noticed higher soot levels?
I cannot be sure they are related, but since my car received the 23o6 update the EGR, EGR-filter and DPF failed causing them to be replaced under the federal 8/80000 emissions warranty. Since the replacement mey car goes into regeneration mode about every 100-150 miles, which is more often than it used to.
 

pkhoury

That guy with the goats
Joined
Nov 30, 2010
Location
Medina, TX
TDI
2013 JSW, 2003 Jetta Ute, 2 x 2002 Golf, 2000 Golf
If VW were to by back my 2013 JSW I would turn right around and use it on a 2016 GSW. Here is what I posted on my face book page.
No wonder I get great mileage in my VW diesel... my emissions system turns off when I leave the testing booth. I love the smell of nitrogen oxides (NOx) in the morning... smells like, like great fuel millage. Breath deep my gas loving friends.
I love it!
 

LogicBomb

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 15, 2014
Location
SoCal
TDI
2014 Passat
Uhh... CARB states? CARB = California Air Resources Board. I seriously hope to God there isn't more than one California. One is enough to deal with in the US.

There are other states who have adopted "CARB Standards". Exactly which standards, I'm not entirely sure, but I know that Washington state is one of them that has applied some of the California standards to theirs.


Edit for proof:

http://www.dol.wa.gov/vehicleregistration/cleancar.html
 

blazerico

Active member
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Location
UBE, PA
TDI
`09 JSW, DSG; '12 JSW (manual)
Are there different rules for diesel trucks? Just wondering because it seems silly to call out VW for emissions, when there are millions of diesel trucks out there spewing soot all over the roadways. I have done zero research on the topic and haven't read all 200 pages of this thread.
Also, can someone point me in the direction of good mechanic near 18972, so I can avoid whatever fix they come up with or at least I can revert back if I'm forced to make the change. thanks!
 

Chris Tobin

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2011
Location
Tennessee
TDI
'06 Jetta TDI
I'm going to suggest a possible explanation for this whole fiasco that's a little bit more in VW's favour.

The ECU is probably Bosch, and they would supply the code. I think VW asked for test and efficient modes, and Bosch obliged. Efficient mode is for normal driving, that they thought would be a bit worse in terms of emissions than the test mode but maximised MPG and performance. What they didn't know was how much worse for NOX it would be. It's possible that they didn't know. After all, to know that, you would need a machine like UV had - and VW probably don't have one. All they could do was dynamometer testing - when the ECU went into test mode.

That would explain why VW kept saying something must be wrong with the vehicle, when the road test results were so bad.

Thus, the real reason for this fiasco is good old-fashioned incompetence. It sounds more likely to me than malice. That really just seems unlikely. Maybe I still want to believe that VW's intentions were good.
WOW, you must have drank A LOT of the VW Cool-aid!!!!

VW already admitted to installing the programming "defeat device" on the cars. Why is it so hard for the VW Cool-aid sippers to admit that their worship at the VW altar has been undeserving???

Do you honestly believe ANY of what you said??? Bosch wrote specific code all on their own to cheat the EPA test? AND VW does not have the equipment to test emissions on their own? They only had a dyno? AND VW was surprised at the findings when the cheat was brought to their attention and actually thought it was a problem?

If you honestly believe ANY of that I've got some beach front Arizona property to sell you real cheap!!!:eek::confused::D:cool:
 

bhtooefr

TDIClub Enthusiast, ToofTek Inventor
Joined
Oct 16, 2005
Location
Newark, OH
TDI
None
Test mode is activated with the correct combination of lack of steering input, barometric pressure, and throttle/braking inputs for the EPA emissions test cycles.

You're not doing that on the road, and not entering test mode.

Also... these have some interesting tidbits in them:

Winterkorn's statement on his resignation (the full statement quoted below, my emphasis): https://www.volkswagen-media-servic...ec13158edd433c6630f5ac445da?p_p_auth=z1h8CA9s

I am shocked by the events of the past few days. Above all, I am stunned that misconduct on such a scale was possible in the Volkswagen Group.

As CEO I accept responsibility for the irregularities that have been found in diesel engines and have therefore requested the Supervisory Board to agree on terminating my function as CEO of the Volkswagen Group. I am doing this in the interests of the company even though I am not aware of any wrong doing on my part.

Volkswagen needs a fresh start – also in terms of personnel. I am clearing the way for this fresh start with my resignation.

I have always been driven by my desire to serve this company, especially our customers and employees. Volkswagen has been, is and will always be my life.

The process of clarification and transparency must continue. This is the only way to win back trust. I am convinced that the Volkswagen Group and its team will overcome this grave crisis.
Executive Committee's statement on Winterkorn's resignation: https://www.volkswagen-media-servic...ec13158edd433c6630f5ac445da?p_p_auth=z1h8CA9s

6. The Executive Committee have decided that the company will voluntarily submit a complaint to the State Prosecutors' office in Brunswick. In the view of the Executive Committee criminal proceedings may be relevant due to the irregularities. The investigations of the State Prosecutor will be supported in all form from the side of Volkswagen.
 

amstel78

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Location
Shohola, PA
TDI
2012 Golf TDI [buyback completed 14/1/2017] 2006 S65 AMG
Are there different rules for diesel trucks? Just wondering because it seems silly to call out VW for emissions, when there are millions of diesel trucks out there spewing soot all over the roadways. I have done zero research on the topic and haven't read all 200 pages of this thread.
Also, can someone point me in the direction of good mechanic near 18972, so I can avoid whatever fix they come up with or at least I can revert back if I'm forced to make the change. thanks!
To be fair to the OTR guys, a good majority of all tractors on the road nowadays aren't soot-spewing beasts. They all have easily serviceable DPF filters and NOX cats.

As for your second - give Mike Hevster a call over at M&M Autocycle. He's a well respected TDI guru that's close to NEPA. I've used him for several jobs in the past, including my last TB change and he did a great job at very fair prices.
 

VeeDubTDI

Wanderluster, Traveler, TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 2, 2000
Location
Springfield, VA
TDI
‘18 Tesla Model 3D+, ‘14 Cadillac ELR, ‘13 Fiat 500e
my only concern right now is Ive been using scan gauge on my car since new.have I been running my car in test mode for the last 53k miles. how is it activated.
If that's all you're concerned about, you're in luck. Having something plugged into the OBD port has nothing to do with whether or not the car runs in "emissions mode."
 

jbmill3

Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2013
Location
KY
TDI
JSW
trade now or later?

I have a 2014 JSW TDI with only 16000 miles on it. I love the car and I had planned to run it into the ground but now this news has changed my plans. Here is my question: should I trade now for a 2016 GSW TSI? Or am I going to be better off financially waiting for several months (or years) to see how this plays out? I could wait to see if there is a possible buyback/trade-in incentive and switch to a GSW TSI at that time. I am going to get hosed if I trade now but I'm worried I will be even more hosed if I wait and there is a recall that cripples performance. Angry that I have to even think about this.
 

totitan

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2012
Location
Thousand Oaks, CA
TDI
2012 Jetta Sportwagon TDI
Uhh... CARB states? CARB = California Air Resources Board. I seriously hope to God there isn't more than one California. One is enough to deal with in the US.
Im tired of the constant CA bashing and name calling.
CA has the 7th largest economy in the world, and 38.8 million people. That is eleven million more than Texas. To not take the lead in reducing emissions would be irresponsible.
 

pkhoury

That guy with the goats
Joined
Nov 30, 2010
Location
Medina, TX
TDI
2013 JSW, 2003 Jetta Ute, 2 x 2002 Golf, 2000 Golf
There are other states who have adopted "CARB Standards". Exactly which standards, I'm not entirely sure, but I know that Washington state is one of them that has applied some of the California standards to theirs.


Edit for proof:

http://www.dol.wa.gov/vehicleregistration/cleancar.html
Wow. I didn't know this! Thankfully, I won't be moving to Washington state anytime soon. I spend my time about 60/40 between Texas and California right now; I might have to register my car outside of California depending on the outcome of this whole ordeal (if it involves killing my already fairly decent fuel economy).
 

pkhoury

That guy with the goats
Joined
Nov 30, 2010
Location
Medina, TX
TDI
2013 JSW, 2003 Jetta Ute, 2 x 2002 Golf, 2000 Golf
Im tired of the constant CA bashing and name calling.
CA has the 7th largest economy in the world, and 38.8 million people. That is eleven million more than Texas. To not take the lead in reducing emissions would be irresponsible.
You're absolutely right. I was born and raised in CA, but you're still right, I shouldn't bash it. Yup, California has plentiful water resources right now, a strong economy, and lots of jobs. I heard Nissan is opening a new plant somewhere in Southern California. The best part is there are no threats from natural disasters such as earthquakes or fires, as you would find with other states, state income tax and property tax is low, and you can do 75mph on the freeway. So you're right - I should stop bashing CA.

Also, if you could kindly post a citation that states California has the 7th largest economy in the world (that's current within the last year), that would be most appreciated.
 

LogicBomb

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 15, 2014
Location
SoCal
TDI
2014 Passat
Wow. I didn't know this! Thankfully, I won't be moving to Washington state anytime soon. I spend my time about 60/40 between Texas and California right now; I might have to register my car outside of California depending on the outcome of this whole ordeal (if it involves killing my already fairly decent fuel economy).

But Washington has very unCARB caveats. For example;

The following vehicles never need emission tests:

Motorcycles

2009 and newer models (All vehicles 2009-Present)

Toyota Prius and Honda Insight

All diesel powered passenger vehicles weighing less than 6,001 pounds

All diesel vehicles model year 2007 and newer, regardless of weight.

They also have a rolling 25 year rule, in that any car over 25 years old doesn't require emission testing for registration. California is stuck with the pre-1975 rule.

http://www.emissiontestwa.com/e/faq.aspx#3
 

jorpet

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 31, 2000
Location
West Seattle, WA
TDI
2001 Jetta - 2015 Golf SW
There are other states who have adopted "CARB Standards". Exactly which standards, I'm not entirely sure, but I know that Washington state is one of them that has applied some of the California standards to theirs.


Edit for proof:

http://www.dol.wa.gov/vehicleregistration/cleancar.html
While it is true that cars sold in WA have to meet CARB regulations, we don't test diesels, so it really only applies to new cars, not an ongoing emissions test issue.

Edit to add: LogicBomb's response is way more detailed than mine. I only found out we no longer test diesel cars when I took my 2001 Jetta in last year to have it tested and they said I no longer needed to do so.
 
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