Why add SCR and the Cheat

fredthe

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2013 Passat SEL Premium DSG, 2015 Golf Sportwagon SEL DSG
Wow, the NY lawsuit (https://ag.ny.gov/sites/default/files/new_york_vw_complaint_7.19.pdf) has lot's of good information. Start reading at page 21 for the listing of the 6 generations of defeat devices.
For Gen 1 models:
Early in the development of the Lean Trap system, however, it became apparent
to Volkswagen’s engineers that activating the Lean Trap and EGR as frequently as necessary to
bring NOx emissions within legal limits would produce too much soot for the Soot Filter. The
Soot Filter would in turn clog and break within just 50,000 miles of operation – far sooner than
the initially 120,000- and later 150,000-mile – Full Useful Life, U.S. durability standard
Volkswagen was required to meet.
For the 3.0l models:
to comply with more stringent U.S. NOx limits and an EPA rule that tied urea tank
refills to the manufacturer’s service intervals, Audi’s 3.0 liter vehicles in the United States would
require larger urea tanks than their European counterparts.
Some competitors, for example, had
service intervals as low as 7,500 or even 5,000 miles; Volkswagen and Audi, however, chose to
maintain a 10,000-mile service interval.
In addition to the EGR defeat device implemented in the Generation 1s, the 3.0Ls
also featured a urea-dosing defeat device.
As to why they added SCR for the Passats (Gen 2):
In 2009, Volkswagen turned its attention to the planned roll-out in the U.S. of the
MY 2012 Generation 2 Selective Catalytic Reduction-equipped Passat, a model heavier than its
Generation 1 predecessors and therefore unsuitable for a Lean Trap emissions control system
.
In designing an SCR-equipped emissions system for the Passat, however, Volkswagen’s
engineers now faced the same quandary their Audi colleagues had confronted – insufficient
space in the vehicle chassis to incorporate urea tanks large enough to meet the 10,000-mile refill
interval to which they certified the Generation 2s.
and
In real-world conditions, the Generation 2s sold in this country exceeded lawful NOx
emissions levels by some five to twenty times
 

fredthe

Veteran Member
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Location
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2013 Passat SEL Premium DSG, 2015 Golf Sportwagon SEL DSG
So it was a matter of certification, not just convenience that the tank went over 10k miles?
Yep! Apparently the EPA requires that the DEF only needs filling during routine maintenance. I don't know if VW could have reduced the maintenance interval to 5k which would include only DEF refill and possibly inspection and met the requirement.

In hindsight they should have done that, and offered the first 6 maintenance visits for free :)
 

cevans

TDIClub Enthusiast, TDI Parts Ninja Vendor , w/Bus
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Odd that other manufacturers had shorter service intervals without issue. Was it VWAG policy to stand fast to the 10k intervals?
 

jims2321

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2013 VW Jetta TDI 6mt, sold back, replacement 2017 Golf GTI Autobahn
Apparently. More of a marketing gimmick. Look we only require service every 10K, everyone else is half our interval, we are superior. The NY State attorney is right on one thing, VW is arrogant to an extreme.
 

fredthe

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compu_85

Gadget Guy
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Location
La Conner, WA
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... None :S
There's this gem on page 53:

171. At that September 3, 2015 meeting, Volkswagen admitted for the first time that the Generation 2 ECUs had two calibrations: one for real world driving (Calibration 1) and one for testing (Calibration 2).

Volkswagen disclosed that in Calibration 1, the urea dosing, EGR and the Rail Pressure were lower. In Calibration 2, Volkswagen disclosed that the urea dosing, the EGR and the Rail Pressure were higher.
 

MrSprdSheet

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East Coast
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'09 JSW TDI
Apparently. More of a marketing gimmick. Look we only require service every 10K, everyone else is half our interval, we are superior. The NY State attorney is right on one thing, VW is arrogant to an extreme.
Don't forget nitrogen oxides aren't pollution, in VW's eyes, per the letter they sent Fortune. No proof, they argued.

The other logic to the 10,000 mile SCR refill cars is that they were readying compliance for Euro 6 regs, and had to have an engine that would approach .08gr/km NOx, in ~2014. Twice as much as U.S., but another reason to dump LNT for SCR.
 

Bisoned

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13 Passat
That is some great reading right there.... Definitely confirms what I thought about VW...

Pure arrogance, deception. Criminal..... this should be required reading for any potential future customer. I would love to see this company suffer even more. I've warned more than a few colleagues about VW. I know at least one was looking at a Passat and instead chose an Accord. Gotta love it
 
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