Just spoke to VW dealership on BUYBACK!!!

Just off phone Thought it would be interesting to speak to one of the ground troops in service and debrief them AGAIN now that a month has passed. So far i understand a buyback person is being assigned to each dealership. they start next week in PNW. They expect 8 buybacks/day and have a "secure" dedicated lots for interim storage before transport. Now they are espousing that all TdIs will not be crushed but fully "FIXED" and resold. They added that they have about 2 dozen new TDIs in storage unsold but "spoken for".

Last month another dealer service said most may be crushed and secure storage was unnecessary as buyback TDIs or parts thereof had little resale value. He also said TDI repair and servicing seems to have seriously fallen off.

Based on info so far, it is my engineering opinion, that any of the "FIXes" will result in significant reduced mileage and certainly increased maintenance. The fixes may have long term reliably issues as well. Just increasing the regen rates does not bode well. Used TDIS Going without service or maintenance for over a year now is a real consideration should a one be available in the future. Again all hearsay but sounds credible.

Cool story.

The reasons given in the OP -as well as a number of others- are why we are doing the buyback. I think that anyone hoping to buy a new 2015, even after the "fix," isn't really thinking things through. These things are two model years old RIGHT NOW, and will be three and possibly four years old before they're able to be fixed and sold. Are they going to provide documentation as to the regimen in the interval? Were these cars started and driven regularly? I wouldn't buy one for half the sticker price.

Rico567 said:

The reasons given in the OP -as well as a number of others- are why we are doing the buyback. I think that anyone hoping to buy a new 2015, even after the "fix," isn't really thinking things through. These things are two model years old RIGHT NOW, and will be three and possibly four years old before they're able to be fixed and sold. Are they going to provide documentation as to the regimen in the interval? Were these cars started and driven regularly? I wouldn't buy one for half the sticker price.

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Agreed. Furthermore i suspect all VW employees have been coached and warned about their future. I tend to believe many have and will intentionally abuse their cars in a sort on revenge scenario. One VW owner I know used to baby his and now he basically abuses it. He hauls whatever will fit regardless of being clean or overweight. Many have NOT even checked tires or changed oil since last September, The attraction to give it some swift kicks (after $ in hand) is strong.

I'm still servicing mine because who knows how long we'll end up with it. It's parked right now, but I'm starting it at least once a week and driving it around at work.

vintovka said:

Just off phone Thought it would be interesting to speak to one of the ground troops in service and debrief them AGAIN now that a month has passed. So far i understand a buyback person is being assigned to each dealership. they start next week in PNW. They expect 8 buybacks/day and have a "secure" dedicated lots for interim storage before transport. Now they are espousing that all TdIs will not be crushed but fully "FIXED" and resold. They added that they have about 2 dozen new TDIs in storage unsold but "spoken for".

Last month another dealer service said most may be crushed and secure storage was unnecessary as buyback TDIs or parts thereof had little resale value. He also said TDI repair and servicing seems to have seriously fallen off.

Based on info so far, it is my engineering opinion, that any of the "FIXes" will result in significant reduced mileage and certainly increased maintenance. The fixes may have long term reliably issues as well. Just increasing the regen rates does not bode well. Used TDIS Going without service or maintenance for over a year now is a real consideration should a one be available in the future. Again all hearsay but sounds credible.

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Perhaps you could expand why you think this is true? How much do you think mileage will be reduced? from 40 mpg to 37; or 40 to 30? And what would be the extra maintenance?

vintovka said:

One VW owner I know used to baby his and now he basically abuses it. He hauls whatever will fit regardless of being clean or overweight. Many have NOT even checked tires or changed oil since last September, The attraction to give it some swift kicks (after $ in hand) is strong.

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The flip side of this is that there are some that have been parked for months. Now if they had not been driven at all in that time, then it could be a problem, but the rest ought to be just fine.

BarryT82 said:

I'm still servicing mine because who knows how long we'll end up with it. It's parked right now, but I'm starting it at least once a week and driving it around at work.

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I just did the 30k service. It was free but would have done it anyway. Anytime you buy a used car you are taking a chance on whether people took good care of their car.

Happy to drive a 2002 GOLF TDI

South Coast Guy said:

Perhaps you could expand why you think this is true? How much do you think mileage will be reduced? from 40 mpg to 37; or 40 to 30? And what would be the extra maintenance?

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Starting with the obvious why would VW have risked cheating to get 40+ mileage in the first place? Wouldn't VW R&D folks have done everything they could to attempt a maximum mileage given the effect of full emission effects? Its painfully obvious they came to the conclusion they could not do it without cheating. Logic would also dictate the MPG/performance drop (with emissions controls) was so severe as to render the TDIs as "not competitive" with gassers of same weight and style. Maintenance issues may have also inspired the cheat with the stress and hassle/cost of increased re-gens. Even with the cheat the DEF and DPF problems have proven severe enough to warrant a recall. When someone gambles over 15 billion (and loses) one wonders if an "acceptable" fix is even possible. I'll bet upper 20's mpg after fix with lots of added costs and performance issues. My lifetime mechanical engineers background tells me "take the money and run".

vintovka said:

Starting with the obvious why would VW have risked cheating to get 40+ mileage in the first place? Wouldn't VW R&D folks have done everything they could to attempt a maximum mileage given the effect of full emission effects? Its painfully obvious they came to the conclusion they could not do it without cheating. Logic would also dictate the MPG/performance drop (with emissions controls) was so severe as to render the TDIs as "not competitive" with gassers of same weight and style. Maintenance issues may have also inspired the cheat with the stress and hassle/cost of increased re-gens. Even with the cheat the DEF and DPF problems have proven severe enough to warrant a recall. When someone gambles over 15 billion (and loses) one wonders if an "acceptable" fix is even possible. I'll bet upper 20's mpg after fix with lots of added costs and performance issues. My lifetime mechanical engineers background tells me "take the money and run".

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Probably just trying to keep their edge over gassers, since that is what attracts most people. For me it was the torque factor, but when you add the improved mileage, it became a no-brainer. But as gassers have gotten more and more efficient that gap was closing, so...they needed to do something to remain competitive and the Govt was on board with them being "green".

People who like the TDI won't care too much if they are getting about the same mileage as a gasser even though gas is cheaper than diesel. They just like the performance that much better, but that group is far smaller than those who are just in it for fuel costs.

and the 14Billion $ hit the media etc are expounding, will be a short term write down followed by a 12 Billion recoup in resales+VW smiling all the way to da bank..I bet

laminated said:

and the 14Billion $ hit the media etc are expounding, will be a short term write down followed by a 12 Billion recoup in resales+VW smiling all the way to da bank..I bet

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http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/28/b...ings-emissions-deception.html?ref=automobiles

laminated said:

and the 14Billion $ hit the media etc are expounding, will be a short term write down followed by a 12 Billion recoup in resales+VW smiling all the way to da bank..I bet

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There is no market for all of these cars used. The idea that they are going to sell for some kind of premium is pie in the sky.

There will be a market for the hard core guys that can buy one at a really great price and then gut them to make them the car they can be.

pknopp said:

There is no market for all of these cars used. The idea that they are going to sell for some kind of premium is pie in the sky.

There will be a market for the hard core guys that can buy one at a really great price and then gut them to make them the car they can be.

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Exactly. I would love to have a JSW, manual, no sunroof, gray......low miles, etc. I would delete the DPF, wait for the HPFP warranty to run out, put the better one in, and drive it for 20 years. It would still be cleaner than most other cars on the road.

Donald

dmarsingill said:

Exactly. I would love to have a JSW, manual, no sunroof, gray......low miles, etc. I would delete the DPF, wait for the HPFP warranty to run out, put the better one in, and drive it for 20 years. It would still be cleaner than most other cars on the road.

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I know exactly where you can find one . But you won't like the price.

pknopp said:

There is no market for all of these cars used. The idea that they are going to sell for some kind of premium is pie in the sky.

There will be a market for the hard core guys that can buy one at a really great price and then gut them to make them the car they can be.

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If you live where there's no smog tests/inspections or registration issues the idea of a TDI with ALL emission crap removed may be super appealing. I'll bet feds worry about it and with Mt Trump EPA may get ***** slapped down to where it should be. (FWIW EPA actully means Expanding Population Assistance/abetting )

vintovka said:

If you live where there's no smog tests/inspections or registration issues the idea of a TDI with ALL emission crap removed may be super appealing. I'll bet feds worry about it and with Mt Trump EPA may get ***** slapped down to where it should be. (FWIW EPA actully means Expanding Population Assistance/abetting )

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In Texas, an inspection of a diesel amounts to a "safety check" and a charge of $7. Gotta love it here.

Florida, at least in our county, inspections don't exist. The only time I've ever had my car "inspected" is when my insurance agent walked around it for 10 seconds to looks for any preexisting damage.

There's a beetle TDI that runs around here. 3" straight pipe, painted redneck camo, full 5% tint all around INCLUDING WINDSHIELD, and nothing but the 2 front seats and half a dash. Nobody bats an eye. Cops, too.