Buyback car purchases

I'd like to share some information to folks who are looking to take advantage of some of these 2009-16 bought back and fixed and now for sale cars that are popping up all over the country.

These are a great value, and the last of their kind. This is not at all meant to discourage anyone from purchasing one, and I myself wish I could justify buying one (or five) for my own fleet.

However, please do yourself a favor and look them over. Many of these cars have been sitting, often in areas that are not necessarily friendly to cars.

Here is some pics from one I had today, and while this is not the first one I have seen in here like this, it is probably one of the worst:



The fuel filter screws are broken, I tried two, they both immediately snapped off. It'll need a totally new fuel filter ASSEMBLY.



Several of the air filter screws also broke, they literally stuck inside the plastic and rotted away, and it needs a whole new air cleaner ASSEMBLY.



The tires "looked" OK tread wise, but upon further inspection, they are dryrotted, and are from 2014, and have flat spots on them. It will need a new set of TIRES.



Rear subframe bolt, badly rusted, as are all the brakes... and really in order to make the car stop correctly, it will need all new BRAKES, including possibly rear calipers and cables, as the parking brake mechanism is all stuck.



Except for the new lean NOx trap, EGR tube, and exhaust flap, which are all new from the 'fix', the EXHAUST SYSTEM looks like it will fall to pieces if you stare at it hard enough.



Every single nut, screw, bolt, clamp, clip, casting, flange, etc. that is made of metal is either badly corroded or rusted.

On top of that, the cabin filter was PACKED with debris, some of it from critters, the oil service indicator was reset, but the oil clearly had NOT been changed, as the drain plug was full of rust, there were dust marks over the top of the filter cap, and it had some collapsed no-name filter in it.

Literally all this car got was a new battery plopped in it, the 'fix' applied, and it was shoved out on the for sale lot. This is a 2012 sedan with only 62k miles, and Carfax shows that the car was essentially parked right when Dieselgate exploded, and has been sitting somewhere that clearly had high humidity ever since.

So please, do yourself a favor and look it over closely. This car looks fine from the top. Engine starts, sounds, and runs OK. But the underneath is what is going to be the real indicator. This car all said and done is going to need a couple thousand dollars thrown at it to get it really in reasonably good useable shape, and it still is going to likely be plagued with problematic fasteners down the road.

Now some of you in the rust belt may see this to be more of the norm, and I feel sorry for you guys. But not all of us have this problem, and also keep in mind the history of these cars, as they have been moved all about the country. And I suspect very little if any real valuation changes happen due to details like I am presenting. So a car that was from Texas and sat in Oklahoma for three years may be a much better car to buy than one that is from Michigan and sat in Ohio for three years, despite being the same color, equipment, and comparable mileage.

And another key thing to make note of as it relates to prescribed maintenance on these cars:

- TB service is due at or by 130k, so if you are looking at a car with 120-ish to 150-ish miles on (or more reasonably priced), please be aware that most of these previous owners who knew they were taking advantage of the buyback option, DEFERRED their prescribed maintenance (why would you spend money on a car your giving back).

So, consequently just plan on doing a TB service if you are buying one (unless you can get docs to prove it was done, obviously)

- same goes for the DSG trans service, most of them have been deferred as well, so plan on that too.

Just my two cents worth on these cars,

Kirk

Thanks Oilhammer, great advice that hopefully many prospective buyers will take advantage of.

Having bought mine on Carvana, I carefully checked its history. I think I got lucky with a California car, low mileage and one owner, it looks great under the hood and under the body.

Great info. What''s best of these 2009-16? Seems I've read the 2009 was problematic, but I'm not familiar with any of these.

I just bought a 2012 with 68k miles on it, 6mt,sunroof,fender stereo, leather etc...I payed $7500 for it at a dealer, was not a cpo but at the time of the emissions fix, they went through and replaced everything that was wrong and did a complete service on it before listing
they replaced wipers, wiper washer motor,random light bulbs,tires,battery...all in all it was like $2500 in little repairs before they advertised it for sale

not sure if other dealers do this before they sell, but im pleased this dealer did

That looks like every other car in the rust belt. I am thinking this car likely came from a salt area and was turned in when it had salt on it and then parked in a field.


That car is a LOT cleaner underneath than my 09 gasser.

these cars are flooding the market and the prices are dropping. Not all of them are rusty like the one Brian is showing. Those are probably northern cars.

I posted this one as an extreme example, they do not all look like this. But from the top, this car looked pristine. Hence my thread to look deeper. Because this car needs a couple grand worth of work to get in order, and nobody expects that when purchasing one of these. I have yet to hear back if the guy got any restitution from the seller.

My ‘13 came from a storage lot in California and fortunately doesn’t show any signs of rust. However, when I pulled back the front fender liners to install some clear side marker lights, I found an inordinate amount of sand. I’ll have to hose all that out. I also worry about sun damage that has yet to manifest itself after sitting exposed day after day for who knows how many years. The cargo liner is bleached except for where the floor mats were thrown back there. Will the clearcoat start to peel in two years? Or the dash start cracking? Who knows. Just part of the deal I suppose. The car is immaculate otherwise.

Just looking at all that corroded crap gives me anxiety. It reminds me of all the times I've witnessed DOT crews paving the roads with salt overnight when the following day's forecast is 40+ degrees. I'm headed to the car wash ASAP to wash off the last of the salt spray from this winter.

Did this guy buy the car sight-unseen? A quick glance after popping the hood would've been an immediate red flag begging you to delve deeper.

Seems to me most of that corrosion is from where the car was driven rather than from storage.

But regardless of the source of the rust, good advice.

I made a couple trips to Colorado in '16, passed a couple fields between Pueblo and Colorado Springs that were covered with cars that I think were VW's.

Sun damage there would't have been so bad but I wonder about rodents setting up in them.

Those corroded items look like what a daily driver has in Michigan.
I might add to the list that the brake dust tins and springs are usually history or near to it on the 2005.5-2006 cars and will most likely be the case for the 2009> cars as well in a short time.

Yeah, it would suck that when your very first air filter was due, you had to replace the whole air cleaner assembly because the screws were so rusted they snapped off. I stopped trying after the third one.

This car should have had its fuel filter replaced thrice by now, but those too just broke/spun.

I feel for you guys in rust salt belt states, as it would be impossible to ever own anything nice if driven all year round. But this car obviously SAT unused since 2015. This isn't JUST from spending three years in the rust belt, but that certainly didn't help, I agree.

My 1996 F150 sat from 2000 to 2014 when I got it. Never moved an inch. But it was inside, and had never been driven in any winter weather. Other than some spider webs and a musty smell, it cleaned up nicely. You'd never know by looking at it.

Great info here for less mechanically inclined people, I searched online for weeks to find what I was looking for and when I finally decided I went and looked it over and under to find out it looked exactly like oilhammers pictures, I was pretty bummed. But ultimately ended finding one that was super clean and I’m very happy with the car! There’s plenty of clean cars out there, don’t let some shady salesman talk you into something that looks like the pics above!

Useful info Oilhammer and thank you for the heads up. The 2015 I bought did not have any rust issue, but most of the air-filter screws were over tighten stripping the thread on the housing assembly. I plan on getting a new air filter housing before any damage to the turbo/engine.

Definitely a good thread with much food for thought. Another note on timing belts, I believe it is a five year recommendation to change irregardless of mileage. The belt sitting in one spot can deform just like tires.
Contrary to popular belief, a person can have a nice daily driver in the rust belt, just not the same one for very long, col.

[try #2]
OH-
What''s best of these 2009-16? Seems I've read the 2009 was problematic, but I'm not familiar with any of these.Thinking I might buy.

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BobnOH said:

[try #2]
OH-
What''s best of these 2009-16? Seems I've read the 2009 was problematic, but I'm not familiar with any of these.Thinking I might buy.

__________________

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I’d stick with 2010+.

The 2009 had a balance shaft module... well, technically all the CBEA engines do (so that means the Audi A3 through 2014 as well). They have been found to strip the hex shaft out of the oil pump drive.

The other thing is, although a moot point post-Dieselgate, is the 2009's DPF and catalyst assembly were all one piece from the factory, so failure of either meant replacement of both to retrofit it to the newer design. They also have a couple different sensors and some slightly different software.

Not many of these buyback/resale cars are 2009s. But if you stumbled across an unusually nice one and the price was right, I'd not pass it up.

But this does make the 2010 Jetta sedan rather unique in that it was the last of the "real" Jetta (Golf with a trunk) but the first for the CJAA engine.

The 2015 cars have a very different engine, and long term is still up in the air. At least the CJAA engine we know pretty well by now, it doesn't really have any secrets left, although post-Dieselgate stuff has given some headaches.

BobnOH said:

[try #2]
OH-
What''s best of these 2009-16? Seems I've read the 2009 was problematic, but I'm not familiar with any of these.Thinking I might buy.

__________________

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If I were to choose, I'd go with 2009/2010 Jetta 6M. The 2009 and 2010 Jettas had the same chassis and engines, but the emissions components were different as Oilhammer explained. Again, this may be a non-issue since the catalyst/DPF can was replaced with new unit by VW as a part of the required fix. Starting with 2011 model year Jetta, VW "cost-reduced" the design, which meant cheaper materials throughout the car, but also significant changes in the construction of the chassis. On some models (I'm not sure if these were diesels), VW went back to drum brakes on rear wheels and 1980's style rear axle, doing away with the independent suspension (much cheaper to make). The 2011 and newer models simply didn't compare to the 2009/2010 quality, in my humble opinion. To illustrate this point - just look at Oilhammer's picture of the rusted fuel filter can from a 2012 vehicle: cheap zinc-plated steel, eaten away by road salt. Well, I assume it was zinc-plated at some point. On my 2010 Jetta, the entire can was made of stainless steel and after 9 years of service, it looked exactly the same as it did when I took delivery. My advice would be: find a low-mileage 2009 or 2010 model that lived its entire life in the deep south, and go with that. The problem with that advice is that the 2009 and 2010 models were prime candidates for the crushers due to the high cost of performing the required repairs.

So, a follow up to this. The owner went back to the selling dealer, armed with my pictures and my assessment of the car, and when they tried to push back, he threatened a lawyer, so they let him step up to a 2013 JSW with half the miles, and it is here now and it is FLAWLESS other than some tire issues.

He did have to pay more, but he is getting a FAR better car.

Nice. I think a lot of that corrosion is from sitting unused. My '11 saw plenty of salt, and it never corroded under the hood like that. When the car is used it gets a chance to dry out.

I'd say the owner owes you a 6-pack at least, oilhammer.

Potentially saved him/her many headaches and $$$ in the future.

So many good infos

EDIT: Removed comment as not in-line with TDI 101 section rules. Started new but related thread here:
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?p=5494604#post5494604

Is there a best year of 13-15? My budget is $15k for a DSG JSW and of course I'd like the best deal.

13 and 14s are pretty much the same, 15s of all TDIs have different engines. '15 Golfs and GSWs have a different platform, entirely different car. '15 Jettas were updated from the '14s, which included better offset crash protection.

Honestly they're all good, which year you buy may depend more on the specific car you find instead of the model year. I prefer the engine in the '15s, but that's me.

As you can see from this thread, one thing to watch out for is how long the car has sat since buyback. Most of these cars are outside in dirt lots. That means rust in the North, sun and rodent damage in the South. The buyback deadline was Jan 30 of this year, if I recall correctly, so I would try and look for a car that was turned in right at the end of the window. Look at the Carfax and see when the title was shifted to Michigan. That's the turn in date, more or less.

IndigoBlueWagon said:

13 and 14s are pretty much the same, 15s of all TDIs have different engines. '15 Golfs and GSWs have a different platform, entirely different car. '15 Jettas were updated from the '14s, which included better offset crash protection.

Honestly they're all good, which year you buy may depend more on the specific car you find instead of the model year. I prefer the engine in the '15s, but that's me.

As you can see from this thread, one thing to watch out for is how long the car has sat since buyback. Most of these cars are outside in dirt lots. That means rust in the North, sun and rodent damage in the South. The buyback deadline was Jan 30 of this year, if I recall correctly, so I would try and look for a car that was turned in right at the end of the window. Look at the Carfax and see when the title was shifted to Michigan. That's the turn in date, more or less.

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Great info. Thank you

Get a car fax. It shows the title to VW date and thus the buyback.

I've been super busy doing service work on these thanks to some strategic advertising. Water pumps are a HUGE concern as they tighten up and fail. 50/50 on them once they have been sitting for more than six months, especially if they are approaching the service interval.

Prices are 8-9K for 100K mile wagons of the 10-12' range and 10-13' wagons with 25-50K can be bought for 10-13K all day long.

r90sKirk said:

And another key thing to make note of as it relates to prescribed maintenance on these cars:

- TB service is due at or by 130k, so if you are looking at a car with 120-ish to 150-ish miles on (or more reasonably priced), please be aware that most of these previous owners who knew they were taking advantage of the buyback option, DEFERRED their prescribed maintenance (why would you spend money on a car your giving back).

So, consequently just plan on doing a TB service if you are buying one (unless you can get docs to prove it was done, obviously)

- same goes for the DSG trans service, most of them have been deferred as well, so plan on that too.

Just my two cents worth on these cars,

Kirk

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... or worse. My coworker bought a TDI and within a month of so of ownership the whole scandal broke. He never changed the oil, not once.

I feel sorry for whoever buys that car.

This is the risk. If the Carfax doesn't show service visits I would be inclined to pass on the car, even thought Carfax is far from accurate or complete.