fast opinions needed please, die hard manual drivers who switched to DSG...

peterdaniel

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Location
Campbell, CA
TDI
2003 Jetta GL 5 spd TDi, 2003 Jetta GLS Indigo blue 5spd wagon. 2003 Jetta GLS Candy white wagon 5 speed
Dang it.. been driving stick most of my life. Im 52 and live in the bay area

can either get a 6 spd manual no sunroof 23K miles 15K + taxes and fees

or DSG with sunroof, a little lower mileage most likely for 17K

UGh... worried about reliability, fun to drive durability over the long haul etc...

Hate driving in traffic.. many times would like to not shift...
then again, I love shifting... but it is getting old.

I will still have my MKIV wagon plus my toyota truck and miata which of course are 5 speeds...


Any die hard manual people here switch and never looked back?

Thank
Peter
 

KERMA

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Sep 23, 2001
Location
here
TDI
99 beetle and 04 jetta
DSG is an awesome transmission, especially after a tune.

If you like the car with DSG better, don't hesitate. it's not an "autotragic" at all
 

mishkaya

TDIClub Contributor
Joined
Mar 4, 2005
Location
Iowa
TDI
'06 Jetta 5MT, '10 JSW MT, '14 JSW 6MT
I drive a DSG on occasion when I have to, but much prefer a manual, no doubt about it.
 

ihatespeed

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Jan 12, 2013
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holbrook, ma
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11 tdi wagon 6mt 15 golf 6mt (Wife's) 2000 Ford 350 7.3l 6mt 4x4 (technically a TDI)
the sunroof in my opinion is a bigger liability than the dsg, mine binds when its hot and broke once, i got it closed and now i never use it. the dsg will also take more maintenance dollars than the manual, especially if you do your own maintenance and you don't have a habit of burning up clutches.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

TDIClub Enthusiast, Principal IDParts, Vendor , w/
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Location
South of Boston
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'97 Passat, '99.5 Golf, '02 Jetta Wagon, '15 GSW
I'd venture that if you get the DSG you'll always feel you've "settled." I live near Boston and drive in traffic all the time (drove to NYC today, in fact). I never mind driving a manual, and I never seem to adjust to automatics. I think that's at least one reason my TDIs get driven a lot and my BMW 335d (only available with an automatic) sits.
 

gmcjetpilot

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2008
Location
Memphis TN
TDI
2010 JSW TDI DSG Matalic Grey
Two answers.

1) If you drive a manual you are a Netherlander that can't get over 1920's technology. DSG is state of art used in super cars from Bugatti Veyron, to Ferrari to Lamborghini.... Therefore people who pick DSG are smarter, better looking and better lovers...

2) It takes a REAL MAN to drive a manual, which takes incredible skill, cordination, cunning to drive one. Anyone who drives a DSG is just not a real man or driver....

These answers are ridiculous as the whole debate. To "transition" to DSG is easy. The only relevent question is how hard is it to transition from DSG to a manual shift car... NOT HARD AT ALL.... I taught my 16 year old Niece in an afternoon, and she shifts better than half the real men I have seen who think their shifting is a gift to the universe ...

DSG is amazing race born technology and has almost no drawback... If there are any it adds 100 lbs and for some reason VW gives 6th gear an overall lower ratio than the manual, so the DSG will turn slightly higher RPM on the freeway. With that said (weight and gear ratio) you may give up a mile or two per gallon. I say MAY because some people shift like inefficient apes. If you are smooth, shift at the right RPM, use coasting to some degree manual will get better MPG.... Other wise people find shifting to be fun... It is work for me, and I want BOTH hands on the wheel when driving hard.... If cursing one hand on wheel and one on coffee cup...
 
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IndigoBlueWagon

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I'll agree with one of your points: If I were buying another track day car I'd consider a DSG. Because in those conditions a DSG is going to do a better job shifting than I do. I've spent enough time on the track to know that it's very difficult to drive at the limit, brake correctly, find the right line, and shift, including heel and toe downshifts so you don't upset the car and break grip. When you get to a car (and driver's) limits things happen real fast.

However, no one does that on the street. And for me manuals have no more to do with being a throwback than they have to do with masculinity. I simply prefer them, especially good ones. It's merely a matter of preference for me.

VW's DSG is a good automatic, but it's not perfect. Of the autos I've driven, I prefer torque-converter ones to the DSG for their smoother performance in traffic. But I still don't love either. It's odd how VW didn't bring in more manual TDIs, as many more customers wanted them than ended up owning them. But I guess that's all moot now, anyway.
 
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peterdaniel

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Location
Campbell, CA
TDI
2003 Jetta GL 5 spd TDi, 2003 Jetta GLS Indigo blue 5spd wagon. 2003 Jetta GLS Candy white wagon 5 speed
well, i rented one and these are my impressions so far.. IMHO, the DSG is nice BUT its still an automatic. And it behaves very much the same as others in its bottom line which is you lack the connection between you and the car. In that aspect you cannot change ultimately what will doom this for me. When I drive, I like to be a part of the car, engaged, thinking, planning executing. So far with the three that I have driven, i find myself amazingly tired.. brain dead. Always invigorating driving a stick... ( although not always pleasing). When driving a manual I feel like Im accomplishing something. And its always different.
 

ourvw

Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2016
Location
Cincinnati, OH
TDI
2002 Jetta TDI
I recently bought a 2011 Jsw Tdi with the DSG. I can see it's a diamond in the rough. It certainly needs a tune to bring out its true capabilities and I'm planning to do so Monday. Just got done driving my BMW Z4 over 300 miles today, which is a manual, and man did I miss the DSG. Threw my shoulder out at the furthest point from home and it killed me having to steer with that arm. Alsoi have knee issues on the clutch side occasionally. Point being, sometimes the autos come in handy when you least expect it. As fast as they shift there really is no point.
 

Ol'Rattler

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Jul 3, 2007
Location
PNA
TDI
2006 BRM Jetta
I say MAY because some people shift like inefficient apes. If you are smooth, shift at the right RPM, use coasting to some degree manual will get better MPG....
Coasting in neutral is a sure sign of someone that does not understand how to drive a manual. It does not save fuel, it is dangerous and illegal in many states. https://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/hybrid-electric/a5977/coasting-in-neutral-fuel-economy/

The most hilarious argument I have heard about coasting in neutral up to a stop is that brakes are cheaper to replace than clutches so they coast and don't even down shift when coming to a stop. If you never had to use a clutch to move from a stop and the only wear on your clutch was from down shifting, the clutch would last probably a million miles.

So, they had syncromesh and hydraulic clutches in the 1920's? So, why is something more technically complicated better than a tried and true simpler technology?

I suppose this must be an improvement and might even save the human race over what has worked flawlessly for thousands of years: http://www.mysmalt.com
 
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IndigoBlueWagon

TDIClub Enthusiast, Principal IDParts, Vendor , w/
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Aug 16, 2004
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South of Boston
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'97 Passat, '99.5 Golf, '02 Jetta Wagon, '15 GSW
Coasting in neutral is a sure sign of someone that does not understand how to drive a manual.
Um, no. Coasting in neutral is probably not a way to save fuel, but I don't think there's anything wrong with slipping the shifter into neutral as you slow to a stop instead of downshifting through all the gears. It's another version of stepping on the clutch.
 

Wilkins

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2005
Location
British Columbia
TDI
05 Jetta Wagon 5sp, 10 Sportwagen 6MT
With the CR, coasting in neutral to save fuel is understandable. The damn thing slows down quite quickly. Very different from an ALH where it almost feels like it is in neutral when you let off. BEW is somewhere in the middle.

If I am trying to hypermile I shift my CR into 6th and rumble down hills at 1000 rpm. Otherwise I have to keep power on to not slow down.
 

peterdaniel

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Joined
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Location
Campbell, CA
TDI
2003 Jetta GL 5 spd TDi, 2003 Jetta GLS Indigo blue 5spd wagon. 2003 Jetta GLS Candy white wagon 5 speed
Hmmm... the fuel savings is negligible and you risk being that kind of person that others want to smack upside the head for being incredibly petty.

2) . You are also probably the same person who keeps their clutch IN at stoplights and are the primary cause of throw out bearings going out at 40K...

3) I have driven stick most of my life driving. I promise you I can shift better and faster than the vast majority. And yes, brake pads are cheaper than a clutch

The issue arises from WHEN you shift to neutral. If you are one of those idiots that goes into neutral 100 yards before the light, its YOU that has the problem, NOT the ones that come up to a light using the gearing to naturally slow down (because you were in the right gear already, as you know how to drive stick) and then shift into neutral during the last 100 feet or so because like the kind and intelligent and considerate driver we know you are, it wont affect anyone else.

Whew...
 

nomadic

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 2, 2018
Location
So Cal
TDI
'15 Golf TDI S dsg
I test drove a manual '15 Golf TDI right before trying out the dsg. I'm more of a manual guy too but the manual in the TDI wasn't that enjoyable to me. First gear was completely limp and it felt way slower than the dsg.

I went with the dsg and have no regrets. I drive in manual mode most of the time and use the right paddle shifter a lot. It shifts very quick and has tons of torque. Has no "limp mode" like the manual seemed to have. I'd be happy with a manual too probably but I prefer the dsg in this car. If I sat in traffic a lot, I'm certain I would not have gotten the manual.
 
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Ol'Rattler

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Joined
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Location
PNA
TDI
2006 BRM Jetta
You are also probably the same person who keeps their clutch IN at stoplights and are the primary cause of throw out bearings going out at 40K...
I forgot that very excellent point. If you are waiting at a light, shift to neutral and let the clutch out and also don't ride the clutch like some people do.
The issue arises from WHEN you shift to neutral. If you are one of those idiots that goes into neutral 100 yards before the light, its YOU that has the problem, NOT the ones that come up to a light using the gearing to naturally slow down (because you were in the right gear already, as you know how to drive stick) and then shift into neutral during the last 100 feet or so because like the kind and intelligent and considerate driver we know you are, it wont affect anyone else.

Whew...
The usual lame excuse is that clutchs are cheaper than brakes, which is true, except they don't understand that downshifting puts very little wear on a clutch.

You can blame Drivers ED because when Drivers Ed ciriculum's were planned for they figured out that not teaaching kids how to drive a manual was cheaper.
 
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peterdaniel

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Location
Campbell, CA
TDI
2003 Jetta GL 5 spd TDi, 2003 Jetta GLS Indigo blue 5spd wagon. 2003 Jetta GLS Candy white wagon 5 speed
I forgot that very excellent point. If you are waiting at a light, shift to neutral and let the clutch out and also don't ride the clutch like some people do.

The usual lame excuse is that BRAKES are cheaper than CLUTCHES, which is true, except they don't understand that downshifting puts very little wear on a clutch.

You can blame Drivers ED curriculums were planned for they teaching that not teaching kids how to drive a manual was cheaper.
Fixed it for ya! ;):D
 

crustodd

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 19, 2015
Location
SoLame, Oregano
TDI
Buying an '09-'12 JSW
DSG or Manual?

I'm curious. Currently shopping cars and am pondering this issue. I'm a 23 year cdl holder, way too familiar with a manual. The semi-truck industry has autos, but they are sketchy on reliability. I've only driven manuals in big rigs. One thing that I've always found advantageous in a semi is the ability to "skip shift", that is go from 1st to 3rd-4th, 5th to 7th-8th, etc... as the load and terrain allow for it. I do this in my passenger car, a Subbie Outback, also. Less stirring the stick, and it just works. If you know you engine's operating range, it's no problem. Does the DSG manual mode function allow you to do this? Say 1st to 3rd for example? If I end up with the DSG, it will get the Malone tune anyway, if that matters.
 
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Ol'Rattler

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PNA
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2006 BRM Jetta
Fixed it for ya! ;):D
Thanks. You got what I meant. On the subject, so many people make assumptions about things that have no basis in fact. The Brakes -VS- clutch wear rationalization is one of my favorite brain dead assumptions.

My sister thought she was saving the planet with a Highlander Hybrid when she could have just bought a non Hybrid car that was smaller, way cheaper and had a smaller carbon foot print. She ended up trading in the Highlander for a smaller non hybrid car because she couldn't afford the Highlander payments.

What's really hilarious is the Chevy Suburban hybrid. For a real treat, try explaining the concept of MPG to people, or the fact that the less weight you have to move relates to how much fuel it takes to move that weight.
 
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Ol'Rattler

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 3, 2007
Location
PNA
TDI
2006 BRM Jetta
I'm curious. Currently shopping cars and am pondering this issue. I'm a 23 year cdl holder, way too familiar with a manual. The semi-truck industry has autos, but they are sketchy on reliability. I've only driven manuals in big rigs. One thing that I've always found advantageous in a semi is the ability to "skip shift", that is go from 1st to 3rd-4th, 5th to 7th-8th, etc... as the load and terrain allow for it. I do this in my passenger car, a Subbie Outback, also. Less stirring the stick, and it just works. If you know you engine's operating range, it's no problem. Does the DSG manual mode function allow you to do this? Say 1st to 3rd for example? If I end up with the DSG, it will get the Malone tune anyway, if that matters.
If you can, just see if you could lease one for a week. Some people love them and some people just plain old curse them. When they work right, I have heard they can be just fantastic but when they don't work right, they can be miserable to drive and just stupid expensive to fix.
 

peterdaniel

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Location
Campbell, CA
TDI
2003 Jetta GL 5 spd TDi, 2003 Jetta GLS Indigo blue 5spd wagon. 2003 Jetta GLS Candy white wagon 5 speed
I think its neat...
 
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Ol'Rattler

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 3, 2007
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PNA
TDI
2006 BRM Jetta
the Pano roof is just stupid beyond all comprehension. An option that somewhere down the road will cost thousands to fix which at some point it eventually will require repair.

Another really stupid option is the factory navi. For navigation, my smart phone works about 1000% better because it has routes based on real time traffic.

Some of the best engineering is usually very simple and who needs a tranny that will cost thousands of dollars to fix when it does start malfunctioning which DSG's do when they start racking up the miles.

I have saved probably a couple of thousand dollars already (185K miles) on required maintenance with a manual transmission and most likely it will go to 400K miles with zero problems if I just keep the fluid level right and don't drive like a lunatic.
 
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crustodd

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 19, 2015
Location
SoLame, Oregano
TDI
Buying an '09-'12 JSW
DSG or Manual?

Well, I jumped in and bought a 2011 with 68K, CPO, 1 owner local car, DSG, and so far, I like it just fine. It's nice just concentrating on traffic, my delivery rt, etc. Seriously, I was a bit tired of stirring the stick. I look for to trans and engine tuning. It's already pretty enjoyable as is. Oh yeah, $9990, all fees included :)
 

tsimon325

Active member
Joined
Dec 3, 2016
Location
Brentwood, norcal
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI Auto
I've been commuting in/through the SF Bay Area for 35yrs, mostly with 4spd and 5spd manual transmission cars. My current commute is 23 miles that takes 70minutes on average. My back is just tired of the shifting. I like it, and will always own a manual shift car I suspect, but another commute car with a clutch pedal. When I put together my wish list that led me too my '06 Jetta TDI DSG, the two things were on the top of the list: Automatic transmission, and 40+ mpg. I've never looked back.
 

INSW20

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 16, 2018
Location
Indiana
TDI
2012 Golf TDI 6MT
In driving my brother's 2011 Golf TDI DSG back to back with my 2012 Golf TDI 6MT, the DSG is sportier, faster, and easier. I'm sure a Sigma6 short shifter would help make mine feel more sporty, but the factory shift setup encourages leisurely shifting. Also, if I want to drive and shift fast, I have my MR2.

I get about 10% better fuel economy in mine than in his (I drove his for a few weeks), most likely due to gearing. Both cars have been fixed.

His has nearing 200k miles and has never had a DSG problem, but has made sure to do the service on the DSG every 40k miles.

Having three pedals is excellent anti-theft.
 
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