Turbo Charger gone again??

1alfie · Dec 26, 2012

About six weeks ago I posted a thread regarding my 2012 Passat TDI breaking down about 3 km's from my home. The car was towed to the dealership who in turn informed me the turbo had to be replaced. About a week later the car was returned to me.

About an hour ago, my wife left our home in the car and got to the same stop sign as per the original occurence, when the car developed a sudden loss of power with the glow plug flashing on an off. These were the exact same symptoms as was observed the last time.

I can understand a problem of this nature happening once but I'm having a huge time believing that the replacement turbo has also malfunctioned.

Something, however, that I've noticed over the past couple of months is that the adblue pump seems to be running considerably longer when shutting the car off than it did when new. I had written that off to much colder temperatures now than when we took delivery of the car. Now, I'm not so sure. The car has about 25,000km on it. Anybody else out there experienced similar problems or any ideas as to what the problem could possibly be??

By way of an update... December 29th, it was confirmed by the dealer that the replacement turbo was indeed defective with the entire unit needing to be replaced. With no turbos in either Canada or the US, the part is having to be brought in from Germany and with the holiday season upon us the car will not be ready for at least a week. The saga continues...

TomB · Dec 26, 2012

Turbo wasn't the issue to start with?

VeeDubTDI · Dec 26, 2012

TomB said:
Turbo wasn't the issue to start with?

^^ This ^^

Mbmaring · Dec 27, 2012

TomB said:
Turbo wasn't the issue to start with?

Starting to wonder how many turbos are being replaced as they did not have one in North America When our 12 Passat TDI went in last week and we still do not have our car back. But around the Holidays it is hard to get much done so didn't expect to get it back till after new years.

Jayg · Dec 27, 2012

Dealers replace the entire turbo assemblys way more often than necessary. Rather than track down the specific culprit.

aja8888 · Dec 27, 2012

You would think that when a dealer removes a good turbo thinking it is bad, they would at least have a look at it to confirm its condition. I wonder what they do with all the "bad" (really good) turbos they remove?

JaredC01 · Dec 27, 2012

aja8888 said:
You would think that when a dealer removes a good turbo thinking it is bad, they would at least have a look at it to confirm its condition. I wonder what they do with all the "bad" (really good) turbos they remove?

Usually warranty work requires them to send the parts back (to VWoA I would imagine in this case) to evaluate what went wrong... In some cases with consumable items (such as defective tires) the dealership is supposed to make sure the item can't be reused and then discard it.

Mbmaring · Dec 27, 2012

1alfie said:
Something that I've noticed over the past couple of months is that the adblue pump seems to be running considerably longer when shutting the car off than it did when new. I had written that off to much colder temperatures now than when we took delivery of the car. Now, I'm not so sure. The car has about 25,000km on it. Anybody else out experienced similar problems or any ideas as to what the problem could possibly be??

According to my farm fuel dealer the ad blue freezes into a solid when it gets real cold is that true you think? We had trouble with the what was supposed to be turbo trouble after leaving the car out overnight when it was below zero.

1alfie · Dec 27, 2012

I asked the Service Consultant this morning whether or not VW check "defective" turbos to determine what exactly caused the part to fail. I was told that they are sent by VW Canada to VW Germany to be examined. When asked if VW Germany ever got back to them providing a reason as to what caused the original turbo to fail, I was told they have heard nothing as yet. I still have a huge problem believing that the replacement turbo blew about six weeks after the original failed especially when the glow plug light started to flash with the engine going in to safe mode at exactly the same number of kilometers driven from my home as in the first incident. This seems to be way too much of a coincidence for my liking. If it is confirmed the replacement turbo is actually defective then VW must have a huge problem with their turbos or there must be some underlying reason that caused the original as well as the replacement to break down.

VeeDubTDI · Dec 27, 2012

VW has been doing this same thing (replacing turbochargers willy nilly) since I joined the forums back in 2000. Anytime there is an issue with the boost system, whether it be a sensor, solenoid, check valve, leaking vacuum line, or other, dealers start by replacing the most expensive part - the entire turbocharger.

Just because the service department replaces a turbo doesn't mean the turbo failed.

JaredC01 · Dec 27, 2012

If you had a Micro-CAN VCDS cable, you could see what errors are being thrown... I too have a hard time believing there's that many Passats with 'defective' turbos installed.

1alfie · Dec 27, 2012

Thanks for the interest Mbmaring... When I had the original problem, the tow truck operator told me that he had towed two vehicles exhibiting the same symptoms as my car had to different VW dealers. He advised that he had later learned that the problem with one of the cars was directly related to the adblue system. I mentioned this to the service consultant this morning and was told that, had had this been the case, a fault would have been indicated during the scanning process... this apparently was not the case. In any event, the temperature was above freezing on both occasions.

Softrockrenegade · Dec 27, 2012

FYI adblue freezes at 12* f (-11c)

Mbmaring · Dec 27, 2012

Softrockrenegade said:
FYI adblue freezes at 12* f (-11c)

So if ad blue freezes at 12 degrees and our average temp is below Zero for a few weeks in January will the car still run without the ad blue?
Starting to think I bought the wrong car and should have kept the old jetta and passat TDI's

Lightflyer1 · Dec 27, 2012

I seem to remember reading this isn't that much to worry about. The lines themselves are primed/evacuated at every start/stop and there is a small heater around the pump in the tank. Don't know where the lower limit is though.

VeeDubTDI · Dec 27, 2012

The tank and all of the AdBlue lines are electrically heated. You don't have to worry about it freezing, as it will thaw very quickly when you start the vehicle and the heaters will maintain the desired AdBlue temperature while the vehicle is in operation.

Unfortunately, troubleshooting has been reduced to scanning the computer for trouble codes. There is very little skill or deductive reasoning involved.

Mbmaring · Dec 29, 2012

VeeDubTDI said:
.

Unfortunately, troubleshooting has been reduced to scanning the computer for trouble codes. There is very little skill or deductive reasoning involved.

That is kind of sad the good old mechanic's are few and far between The ones that could listen or feel the vibrations or symptoms and tell you by thier experience what was wrong with your car. I hope the mechanics today are still learning by mistakes and not leaving everything up to the computer diagnostics.

tdiatlast · Dec 29, 2012

1alfie said:
Thanks for the interest Mbmaring... When I had the original problem, the tow truck operator told me that he had towed two vehicles exhibiting the same symptoms as my car had to different VW dealers. He advised that he had later learned that the problem with one of the cars was directly related to the adblue system. I mentioned this to the service consultant this morning and was told that, had had this been the case, a fault would have been indicated during the scanning process... this apparently was not the case. In any event, the temperature was above freezing on both occasions.

I'm not sure I'd believe a tow truck driver. I've only been towed 4 times (3 flatbed, once just the front wheels up) in over a million miles of driving, and each time, I wasn't sure the driver knew which end of my car was the front end...

Mbmaring · Dec 31, 2012

1alfie said:
About six weeks ago I posted a thread regarding my 2012 Passat TDI breaking down about 3 km's from my home. The car was towed to the dealership who in turn informed me the turbo had to be replaced. About a week later the car was returned to me.

About an hour ago, my wife left our home in the car and got to the same stop sign as per the original occurence, when the car developed a sudden loss of power with the glow plug flashing on an off. These were the exact same symptoms as was observed the last time.

I can understand a problem of this nature happening once but I'm having a huge time believing that the replacement turbo has also malfunctioned.

Something, however, that I've noticed over the past couple of months is that the adblue pump seems to be running considerably longer when shutting the car off than it did when new. I had written that off to much colder temperatures now than when we took delivery of the car. Now, I'm not so sure. The car has about 25,000km on it. Anybody else out there experienced similar problems or any ideas as to what the problem could possibly be??

By way of an update... December 29th, it was confirmed by the dealer that the replacement turbo was indeed defective with the entire unit needing to be replaced. With no turbos in either Canada or the US, the part is having to be brought in from Germany and with the holiday season upon us the car will not be ready for at least a week. The saga continues...

Sorry to here that I should have read your first post again to see your update I see it did need to be replaced again did they say why all the turbo replacements? I am starting to wonder if there is another issue.

1alfie · Dec 31, 2012

There's no doubt in my mind that there are underlying problems that caused both turbos to blow.

JaredC01 · Dec 31, 2012

So if the turbo really is gone (and twice now), then VW has yet another serious issue on their hands with the Passat's CR engine... Twice now they've dropped the ball on the CR, first on the HPFP and now on the turbo. What's next?

I wonder what the chances of a runaway on the new Passat when the turbo blows? I'd rather face an HPFP failure with the car dying on the side of the road than a runaway engine from a blown turbo any day of the week.

Mcgink · Dec 31, 2012

VeeDubTDI said:
The tank and all of the AdBlue lines are electrically heated. You don't have to worry about it freezing, as it will thaw very quickly when you start the vehicle and the heaters will maintain the desired AdBlue temperature while the vehicle is in operation.

I think my main concern about freezing would be if anyting would be damaged when/if it freezes. If the NMS didn't get used for a month in a really cold winter for example, would It need some type of anti-freeze type solution in it? or would it be OK?

TomB · Dec 31, 2012

Mbmaring said:
Starting to wonder how many turbos are being replaced as they did not have one in North America When our 12 Passat TDI went in last week and we still do not have our car back. But around the Holidays it is hard to get much done so didn't expect to get it back till after new years.

Not an indicator of anything. You can wait months for a part from Europe, even a minor one. The just don't keep them in stock in huge inventory since that costs $$$$$. Just in time delivery is the way they do it now.

TomB · Dec 31, 2012

Usually boost system failures that cause a Code to be thrown were piping issues in the system. They were/are plastic snap together systems usually and when one leaks it causes a boost failure message.

They need to inspect all the lines. I doubt it was the turbo, but instead something simpler that they just did not take the time to truly investigate. "just throw a new turbo in it and see what happens."

VeeDubTDI · Dec 31, 2012

That shouldn't be a concern at all. The entire system is heated electrically.

tdiatlast · Dec 31, 2012

JaredC01, 12/27: "I too have a hard time believing there's that many Passats with 'defective' turbos installed."
JaredC01, 12/31: "So if the turbo really is gone (and twice now), then VW has yet another serious issue on their hands with the Passat's CR engine... Twice now they've dropped the ball on the CR, first on the HPFP and now on the turbo. What's next?"

Quite a bit of sensational over-reaction here. The Passat CR-TDI has been out for what, over 18 months, with virtually no issues, and a couple of turbo "failures", with no specific information as to WHAT failed, and you think VW has "yet another serious issue on their hands".

OP: Please keep us posted, with as many details as possible.

1alfie · Jan 1, 2013

I spoke with the Service Manager again yesterday. He explained that the original turbo was totally seized. As for the replacement unit, although not seized, was not moving fast enough to do anything. He feels, as do the mechanics, there is an underlying problem causing the turbos to blow. On speaking with VW Canada, there's no question they want to get to the bottom of this as much as I do.

JaredC01 · Jan 1, 2013

tdiatlast said:
Quite a bit of sensational over-reaction here. The Passat CR-TDI has been out for what, over 18 months, with virtually no issues, and a couple of turbo "failures", with no specific information as to WHAT failed, and you think VW has "yet another serious issue on their hands".

If the turbo issues in the Passat really are completely nuking the turbocharger, then it's not just a sensor issue. The fact that they don't have an answer yet, and the fact that there are zero replacement turbos left in the US would tell me that yes, there is a serious issue here.

Let's also not forget that it's happened to the same person more than once in this thread already... Considering the sample group side here versus the rest of the US, I would say it's probably a safe bet that there have been more people with multiple failures as well.

There hasn't been a CR model released yet without a multi-thousand dollar failure associated with it.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2

mikeyinpa · Jan 1, 2013

Bit of a "sky is falling" response there. From what I see this is the only "total turbo failure" I've noticed on the forum, and I would suspect there is an underlying issue with this person's car causing his problems. Not that VW has a massive problem with turbos and all of our Passats will need a new turbo in the next few days.

As Manny Cabalero said, "people have a poor grasp of statistics and probability". Hence casinos, lotteries and extended warranties.

It will be instructive to keep an eye on this issue as it unfolds.

Mbmaring · Jan 1, 2013

TomB said:
Not an indicator of anything. You can wait months for a part from Europe, even a minor one. The just don't keep them in stock in huge inventory since that costs $$$$$. Just in time delivery is the way they do it now.

Wow if I have to wait months for the car to have a turbo shipped from Germany I think they can keep the car.
I'm starting to think I should have bought the wife a ford taurus instead. Never have had to wait more than a day or 2 for a ford part

Turbo Charger gone again??

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