lost my oil plug after 4000 miles of driving?

Yes my baby of seven years and just out of warranty by a month. Driving to Klamath Falls Oregon from my home about a 35 miles drive, A bell went off and a flash and the dash ( lack of oil pressure turn off engine) so i did saw a line of oil on the road, got in towed to klamath to a trusted shop and found the plug with a un_crush washer. The shop cleaned it off and put VW Sin oil in and all sound good to them. But i can hear the Turbo now whirring up with gassing it when i could not before, it runs fine i believe just the sound of the turbo unnerves me now. The VW dealers in Medford Or. which i bought new is saying they don"t use crush washer and are washing there hands of this problem. I also bought the life time oil change when i purchase the car. Is the turbo going to blow soon or am i just hearing things. Thanks any help you can give!!Ps have less then 60000 miles on the car.

So who changed the oil? My guess is the plug was not tightened properly and finally after 4000 miles rattled loose.

Tdijarhead said:

So who changed the oil? My guess is the plug was not tightened properly and finally after 4000 miles rattled loose.

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Agreed. The oil pump jockey probably doesn't have a torque wrench and had been stripping out aluminum pans, so he went to barely tightening the plug to keep from damaging pans.

The gasket is an aluminum washer, not a crush washer and is usually sold with the plug or you can cut the aluminum washer off with a pair of dykes to replace it. One of my local dealers sells the aluminum washers separately.

If your dealer has been doing all of your oil changes and the oil plug fell out, well yes they have a problem. Since you bought "Lifetime" oil changes and they are not standing behind their work, I would be extremely pissed.

Lets see, "Your shoddy workmanship almost destroyed my engine, may have damaged my turbo and you take no responsibility?"

You may have caused some confusion by talking about a crush washer.

Almost forgot, the correct torque on these aluminum oil pans is 22 Foot Pounds (264 inch pounds) and if a torque wrench is not used, the plug will be either over tightened or under tightened causing problems like you experienced or a stripped out pan.

Guess I'll stay the heck out of Lithia Volkswagen in Medford. I did buy a battery from them back in 2007, and they installed it for free ... which was a surprise. Kinda hard to mess that up I suppose.

If they did ALL of your oil changes and now your turbo sounds different since the oil plug fell out, they owe you a new turbo.

File a complaint with VOA. You should at the very least be reimbursed for all the costs associated with the oil plug falling out. (tow, oil, etc.)

Ol'Rattler said:

If they did ALL of your oil changes and now your turbo sounds different since the oil plug fell out, they owe you a new turbo.

File a complaint with VOA. You should at the very least be reimbursed for all the costs associated with the oil plug falling out. (tow, oil, etc.)

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^^^^ Absolutely, they cannot shirk their responsibility here. I'd be on the phone to VWoA IMMEDIATELY.

They don't install drain plugs with the gasket washer??? Come. On. Please.

Not a gasket or crush washer in the usual sense. The sealing washer is captive to the plug and made of aluminum. VW's "wisdom" is to replace the drain plug/captive washer assembly every OC.

You can dyke the washer off and replace it so you don't have to buy a new plug every O/C. One of my local dealers does sell replacement aluminum washers as well as the plug/washer assemblies.

Sorry about your experience, Dieselfreak2. Can anyone recommend a decent torque wrench? Does anyone use a Fomoto valve?

Personally I use my Pela 6000 extractor.
I torqued a magnetic drain plug in 160,000 miles ago on the oil change after the the last of the "free" 36,000 miles service.
Never looked back.

higgledy said:

Sorry about your experience, Dieselfreak2. Can anyone recommend a decent torque wrench? Does anyone use a Fomoto valve?

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Cannot speak on the Fomoto, but I would recommend the following torque wrench:

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...roup_ID=675227&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

Expensive? Yes. Am I a tool snob? Yes. I pay my Snap on dealer in cash and he gives me 20% off list with no tax.

lol. you don't need a torque wrench to do this crap. i don't use a torque wrench in all but the most critical things like on the head. i've done plenty of oil drain bolts on my cars, all by hand. its super easy!

I put a Fomoto on my car, and it's worked absolutely perfectly. No drips, no leaks, no issues. Positive locking when you close it, and no signs of any issues after 4 sets of oil changes. You simply install it once, and you're done with it. with the hose spout you can put on a short piece of vinyl tubing and direct the oil right into your catch pan.

burpod said:

lol. you don't need a torque wrench to do this crap. i don't use a torque wrench in all but the most critical things like on the head. i've done plenty of oil drain bolts on my cars, all by hand. its super easy!

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Well yes you do. Ask the oil change jockey that severely under tightened the OP's drain plug. I would consider a steel drain plug into an aluminum pan to be a "critical operation." You cant judge how tight a steel plug is by hand into an aluminum pan. I'll bet your "Armstrong Torque" is no wear near the specified 22 foot pounds. You have been lucky so far............

I use my torque wrenches on every fastener that has a specified torque. Which, on these cars, equates to a lot of fasteners. In my opinion, a torque wrench is a necessary tool.

If I had spent nearly $300 for a Snap-On torque wrench I would use it for everything too. That includes properly setting torque on the lid for the pickle jar where I was saving quarters to be able to buy motor oil for my next interval.

0% of technicians use a torque wrench for everything. Why? Because you make no money being slow. Tty bolts lol

If you need a torque wrench for a drain plug, you probably shouldn't have a wrench in your hand in the first place.

It's called feel. Some have it, some don't. The latter are always preaching the TW gospel and how you must use one on every fastener. Until they strip one out using it.

Save the torque wrench for the more critical stuff, such as internal engine work.

The torque wrench you are supposed to use is Inch Pound not Foot Pound.
BTW I put a Fumoto on my 2012 Jetta which I traded. I just ordered one for my wagon. Although I do have an extractor.

PassatSE4me said:

If you need a torque wrench for a drain plug, you probably shouldn't have a wrench in your hand in the first place.

It's called feel. Some have it, some don't. The latter are always preaching the TW gospel and how you must use one on every fastener. Until they strip one out using it.

Save the torque wrench for the more critical stuff, such as internal engine work.

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Completely wrong thinking. If it was a steel pan were talking about, I would say sure.

I have been turning a wrench for many years and rarely use a torque wrench. However, at the first oil change on my aluminum oil pan I tightened the drain plug by feel, it was obvious that I could not tell the difference between too loose, properly tightened and stripped out.

No, you don't have to use a torque wrench on every fastener, but in this case, I would concede that you really should.

You are making no sense. How do you strip out a fastener by tightening it to the specified torque? Either you set the wrench wrong or the threads are deteriorated and need to be repaired if you stripped out a fastener.

ottomatic said:

The torque wrench you are supposed to use is Inch Pound not Foot Pound.

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No, the spec is 22 foot pounds, however at that low of a torque you will not find a torque wrench that can read 22 foot pounds accurately so what you do is use an inch pound torque wrench. Ideally, the torque wrench you want will read the 264 inch pounds (22 foot pounds) about mid scale.

Not really a fan of the Fumoto. What I think is wrong with it is that it hangs down below the pan just waiting to be busted off by road debris. Why make your fragile aluminum pan even more suseptable to road damage?

Ol'Rattler said:

Completely wrong thinking.

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Not in my experience. I've seen more than a few gung-ho techs turn the simplest of tasks into abortions because of their unwillingness to ditch the TW.

...it was obvious that I could not tell the difference between too loose, properly tightened and stripped out.

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Wow.

No, you don't have to use a torque wrench on every fastener, but in this case, I would concede that you really should.

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Well so far I haven't stripped out a drain plug in my life, aluminum pan or not, so I still won't'.

How do you strip out a fastener by tightening it to the specified torque?

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By over-tightening, even just one time. Or cross-threading then re-threading with the same bolt (instead of tapping anew and using a new bolt). Happens all the time. If it didn't, we wouldn't need taps and dies.

huh? How do you over tighten a bolt by torquing it to specified torque?

If you cross thread a fastener, well shame on you. Incorrectly installing a fastener does not negate the requirement for applying proper torque to a correctly installed fastener.

It's great that you have fumbled around and not stripped out a drain plug yet. Wouldn't want to buy a car from you. I can just imagine the "Easter Eggs" I might find...............

I'm one of those who uses a torque wrench for everything. Especially the steel plug into an aluminum oil pan.
I did use a Fumoto on the 01 Golf tdi and 98 NB tdi. They do not hang down too far. I did use them with the Panzer plate.

Well ya, but they do hang down farther then the OEM plug. Other than that, they are pretty friggin awesome.

You can't really go wrong by using a torque wrench every time. In the real world, some thing do get a pass. However, head bolts and pan plugs into aluminum need to be correctly torqued with a torque wrench every single time.

Ol'Rattler said:

It's great that you have fumbled around.

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Hard to say about someone you don't know isn't it? You have no idea what my experience is. Suffice to say your assessment is poor.

Actually buying a vehicle from me is about as good as it gets. Too bad you're off the list.

How do you strip out a fastener by tightening it to the specified torque?

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I did this last year. My mother bought me a nice clicker from Harbor Freight as a gift. Apparently the Chinese do not calibrate these things very well.

It's better to use a 3/8 drive so you don't over torque it, as it has better "feel."

Guys I am getting a good laugh out of this. I use my brain as torque wrench and translate that to the amount force i apply to any wrench. Why because there is so many variables that need to be taken into account. First of all I have bolt charts that provide proof loads at minimum strength for different grade bolts for DIN and ANSI. They also have 3 friction co-efficients to allow one to pick the correct one for different situations.
Then judge the length of your wrench and apply the correct force( force is weight) to reach the correct torque load in foot lbs. A fish scale is handy as well when you run into those situations that don,t feel right.

The don't feel right are those situations where the rigidity of the assembly is less than normal ( usually where compressive gaskets are used). The other where thread engagement or head or nut friction is not enough to feel tight(usually to thick an oil applied as well).

Edit: A torque wrench is necessary at some point but also the correct torque. In general aluminum vs steel has a different co-efficient of friction. Plated and oiled also affect this. If the thread length of the aluminum is not at least 2 x dia. then you need to take this into account. Feel is equal to "tight" relative to friction.
A reliable torque is stretching the bolt to its maximum without reaching yield and without stripping the thread. Good design is that the thread engagement strength is greater than the tensile strength of the bolt.

anything you are serious about doing quality work on, a properly equipped tool kit is a necessity, and that includes a torque wrench that is used regularly. Whether that be cars, machinery, power plants, ships, jet engines, etc, you can't do the work on a repeatable basis without proper tooling and expect continued reliability. And that includes torquing the oil drain plug after each oil change. My preference is to do a bottom drain each time and torque the magnetic plug with copper washer to a leak free and reliable seal that will endure until the next OC.

PassatSE4me said:

Hard to say about someone you don't know isn't it? You have no idea what my experience is. Suffice to say your assessment is poor.

Actually buying a vehicle from me is about as good as it gets. Too bad you're off the list.

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True. Don't really know your background either. I work in Aerospace were anything with threads is tightened to a specified torque.

Actually, my remark was more aimed at the concept that everyone should do their own maintenance. Not knowing your skill level shouldn't put you in the same boat with folks that shouldn't ever pick up a wrench.