OBDeleven

Millennium Falcon

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2016
Location
Central pa
TDI
2003 jetta wagon, 1949 willys cj3 ALH TDI swap
I am new to this whole VAG thing. I recently did a 5 speed swap on my 03 alh wagon and decided to go with obd eleven to change the engine coding to save some money. I know Ross-tech is more in-depth but I am cheap and wanted to see what OBD11 could do. It worked well to change the coding, but now im trying to learn how to read the data blocks. I want to know how timing and IQ is doing. Here are some screen shots of where I am at. Can you Gurus help me know how things are looking. I know my coolant temp is low. the car hadnt been running long.





 

Matt-98AHU

Loose Nut Behind the Wheel Vendor
Joined
Apr 23, 2006
Location
Gresham, OR
TDI
2001 Golf TDI, 2005 Passat wagon, 2004 Touareg V10.
It helps greatly to have your display units in metric, as that's the default display VCDS and VW use anyway. So every reference on this site, with Ross-Tech's great knowledge base and in the repair manual, will all be in metric.

So with the live data, you have measured value block 1 displayed on one of your screenshots. In field 2 of that block is the injection quantity. On your OBDeleven deal it's displayed as gr/h. Every reference from Ross-Tech, this forum and the repair manual will have it in mg/st for example. And that is something I often DO have to adjust after a manual swap, as the fuel system is normally calibrated to inject a lot more fuel at idle with the automatic than what the manual trans actually needs, so I commonly run into slow down shudder issues post-swap as the engine warms up because the way the pump is calibrated, it's actually bumping up against the bare minimum of how little fuel it can accurately inject to maintain the idle speed the ECU wants to see... A hammer mod is required typically to correct it, and use that measured value block 1, field 2 to help confirm that you're in the correct range.

So, with that out of the way, originally OBDeleven did a poor job with basic settings on rotary pump cars. I informed the developers of this and they seemed to have improved the situation with a more recent update, however other basic settings still are not working correctly on rotary pump cars, so proper diagnosis is a little difficult to do with certain functions still.

With that in mind, the way you would check the pump base timing, as outlined in the repair manual, is to login to the engine computer, select basic settings, enter 000.

This will bring up the display with 10 values, basically the same as you displayed with the live data block 0, except when you do that block in basic settings, the glow plug light will flash and it will deactivate the timing advance solenoid inside the injection pump. By doing this, you can see where the pump's base mechanical timing is and make a judgement on if it needs to be adjusted or not.

The second field from the top is the raw, digital reading of what the pump timing is (or more accurately, when the injector #3 needle lift sensor pops in relation to crank position). You are supposed to plot that timing number on a chart found in the repair manual, with the second value found in field 9, which is fuel temp in raw digital format.

What I normally do is simply aim for that field 2 number to be anywhere between 55-70 for the most part. At some temps, low 40s numbers are in spec, but I tend to like to keep it on the advanced side of spec, so my goal is always to have field two reading between 55 and 70 to keep it where I like it to be. A hair over 70 is fine, too, realistically.

But, I'm still not confident that the basic settings work 100% right still. The blink rate of the glow plug light is a little off, I've had a couple cars earlier when doing basic setting 0, that field 2 timing number would jump all over the place. The last couple cars I've checked, it's been much steadier, but I have not yet compared it to what VCDS would display to verify accuracy.

Lastly, if you do any other basic settings for diagnostic purposes (I commonly use 03, 04 and 011 on rotary pump cars for diagnostics as well) I have noticed erratic behavior with OBDeleven with those as well. In basic settings 011 for example, with the engine at idle, the computer will cycle the N75 that controls the vacuum supply to the turbo's actuator full on to full off. I can watch the turbo actuator to verify it goes through its whole range of movement or even just measure the vacuum coming out of the N75 to verify it does in fact go from system vacuum (ideally 25" mg or more) when "on" to 0 vacuum when "off".

When doing that basic setting with VCDS, it will be very stable, very predictable, ever several seconds cycling between on and off and back again. When I do this same test with OBDeleven, it stays on for quite awhile, then for half a second switches to off before immediately switching back to the on position for quite awhile. It switches to off so fast, the N75 doesn't even complete purging the vacuum!

So yeah, definitely not ideal quite yet. It seems to work better on PDs and later cars, but the glow plug flash rate on those is still a little off signaling to me that there's still a communication timing issue of some kind happening.

I want to make a video of the issues and include a comparison of how each of those functions work with VCDS compared to OBDeleven and send it to OBDeleven's developers. They have a very promising product that should be as capable as VCDS, but it's not perfect yet. So, one can only hope that by providing feedback with any issues that eventually they'll get it sorted and it will be a genuine competitor for capability at a fraction of the price.

I definitely won't be giving up my VCDS cable anytime soon... Hell, I might even buy a backup when I have the extra funds just because I do still rely on it so heavily, that and I appreciate the many years worth of contributions and research Ross-tech has done for us and how user-friendly they've managed to make their product. Definitely deserves support from someone like me.

So, for me at this point, OBDEleven is nice for when I'm doing a hammer mod and it's handy to have a wireless communication so I don't have to continually run back to the car to get the readings.

It's also nice for doing transmission services where you need monitor transmission temperature in the scantool to get the fluid level just so... And I've got a hoist where I can stand up underneath the car while doing the job, so it's a little less than practical to have a corded device in the car during such a procedure. So, it's nice to give me that capability for a couple little jobs, but it is not anywhere near as user-friendly as VCDS at this point. Promising, but Ross-Tech has got them beat and for a professional, the extra money is well worth it for how much easier it makes our jobs.
 

Millennium Falcon

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2016
Location
Central pa
TDI
2003 jetta wagon, 1949 willys cj3 ALH TDI swap
I really thought I broke something when the glow light started flashing. I didnt know that was supposed to happen. :) Typical TDI noob!
 

Millennium Falcon

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2016
Location
Central pa
TDI
2003 jetta wagon, 1949 willys cj3 ALH TDI swap
I would really like to get Ross-tech and I know it is worth the money I just cant afford it right now.... And OBD11 did what I needed for my 5-speed swap. Maybe after tax season I will upgrade.
 

Millennium Falcon

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2016
Location
Central pa
TDI
2003 jetta wagon, 1949 willys cj3 ALH TDI swap
Yes mine is the pro version.... What else would i need to make your ross tech work for my car? I am interested.
 

astonishedboy

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2003
Location
pickinoutthetitsburgh, PA
TDI
Y2k Golf, Black Mariah
You just need to download the software from their website. I don't believe there is a charge to download it, but I'm not sure what OS it works with. I have it on an old windows XP laptop. The cable acts as the activation code. I have the Hex-Can version of the cable.

How about the OBD eleven? I understand they use credits that you have to purchase. How does that work? are certain functions available without credits?
 

Millennium Falcon

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2016
Location
Central pa
TDI
2003 jetta wagon, 1949 willys cj3 ALH TDI swap
So..... my iq on my 03 alh is 0.8 I am trying to raise it using OBD11. Every time I try to view channel 1 it says control module "interruption" and wont let me view the data or enter a new value. It lets me see channel 2 and change data to raise and lower the idle. So Im not sure why I cant change the IQ. I have the "pro version.... any ideas?
 

Millennium Falcon

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2016
Location
Central pa
TDI
2003 jetta wagon, 1949 willys cj3 ALH TDI swap
I figured it out! there was a security code! 12233. Now it can adjust my IQ. So obd11 works after all!

Now my IQ is at 2.9 still should be higher but Its still better than .8

 

Owain@malonetuning

Associate Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Jul 1, 2016
Location
Vancouver
TDI
PD jetta wagon
Don't be a gorilla and only loosen it as much as you need to. Sometimes they don't need to be loosened.

And when you tighten it down the values will change.
 

Xpdite

Member
Joined
Dec 22, 2014
Location
Whitby, Ontario
TDI
2013 Passat TDI
VAG Newbie with Questions

Hi Guys
Let me apologize right off the bat if this question has already been asked\answered somewhere. I have been reading the forums and the more I read the more confused I get.

I currently have a Canadian 2015 Passat TDI. I would like to do some very basic tweaks (At least to start) as I have no automotive experience. The original thing I was looking to do was change the fan speed on Auto setting on the climate control. Also would be nice to monitor any fault codes. Not sure what else I can \ should do.

I am thinking that the VCDS is to much tool for me so I was looking at maybe getting the VCD11. It looks like the one touch programming may be perfect for a noob like me.

Anyone have any suggestions? Maybe I should just not mess with it at all being a noob or maybe this is not the tool I should use. Also, Is there a site somewhere that may list the mods I can or should do for this particular car?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 

BobnOH

not-a-mechanic
Joined
May 29, 2004
Location
central Ohio
TDI
New Beetle 2003 manual
If you must buy a tool, get the VCDS. Better yet make some friends you can borrow from, you don't need it all that often. It will not replace mechanical knowledge.
Search out local VW groups, the gas cars use the same device.
 
Top