ALH smoke at idle (diesel smell)

Overdrive0902

Active member
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Location
Frederick, MD
TDI
2001 Jetta MK4
Hey all,

I am new to TDIs as I recently purchased an 01 Jetta ALH with an automatic trans. I bought this car as a project for a commuter vehicle. It was in rough condition but the engine sounded fine.

I changed the engine oil, fuel filter, flushed the trans, new air filter, new maf sensor, started with a 1-2 second crank. The temp never rose so I replaced the thermostat/drained flushed coolant. In addition, I installed a pd150 intake manifold and deleted the EGR/ASV. Uploaded a Malone stage 1 tune w/EGR deleted. Then the last time I started the car long crank 3-4 seconds, the exhaust was smoking white strong diesel smell... then click click rattle rattle dropped valves....

Moving forward I replaced the head with a brand new AMC, new Mahler turbo, (idParts)timing belt kit with tool kit, new buzzken turbo back, bosio dlc 520 nozzles. Check piston protrusion with my deck bridge/dial (within spec). I chose not to replace the piston rings (could still see some cross hatching in the cylinders)

I imagine the previous owner had a run away type event. The ASV was clogged, I dumped about a cup of oil out of the intercooler (which cleaned prior to reinstall).

Finally.....went to prime the IP and bleed the injectors got the engine running and steady haze of white smoke (fuel smell). have VCDS the IQ is jumping any where from 0-10. I adjusted the pump close to center line. The next day stated it up to recheck and the line was too advanced to graph.

My assumptions

.1 bad injectors
.2 bad IP seals
.3 bad sensor

No codes present...

I apologize for any gaps in the time line I'm rushing to type this prior to my night class.
 

dweisel

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Location
Wheeling, West Virginia
TDI
dweisel isn't diesel anymore!
Sounds like maybe you're running into the same problem I have on an ALH engine. Lots of smoke with strong diesel smell.
I played with the timing and still had smoke.
Changed injectors. Still have smoke.
Timing is always WAY advanced because the N108 cold start valve is not operating as it should.
Trouble is a new n108 is quite pricey and even used are $100. Plus it's not accessible unless you pull the ip.
I bought a used ip and will either swap the pumps out or use the n108 off the used pump on the pump in question.
 

sisyphus

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2008
Location
Appleton, Maine
TDI
99.5, '01 A4 Jetta sedans, 5 sp box, Hamman mod, Joey mod, Bilsteins, 2.00" lift
You need access to VAGCOM. Adjust the IQ via computer or hammer mod it.
 

sisyphus

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2008
Location
Appleton, Maine
TDI
99.5, '01 A4 Jetta sedans, 5 sp box, Hamman mod, Joey mod, Bilsteins, 2.00" lift
have VCDS the IQ is jumping any where from 0-10. I adjusted the pump close to center line. The next day stated it up to recheck and the line was too advanced to graph.

My assumptions

.1 bad injectors
.2 bad IP seals
.3 bad sensor
Ignore my previous post. If your IQ is jumping around like that you've got a problem with the IP. It should be set at 4 and stay there. Not sure what sensor you're referring to. IIRC this is a mechanical problem inside the pump (broken rotor shaft or something like that. it happens).
 

Overdrive0902

Active member
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Location
Frederick, MD
TDI
2001 Jetta MK4
Thank you the posts!

I didn't hear any distinctive sounds from the IP that would indicate a shaft failure. I did how ever unplug the 3rd injector while it was running and heard an audible change in idle.

Is there any way to single out the N108 with the VagCom?

My next course of action was going to reseal the IP and prime it with a gravity bottle of fuel and return line to a secured bucket.

If I still get the same results I'll just pull everything send them to a VW fuel specialist.
 

Tdijarhead

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 10, 2013
Location
Lawrenceville PA
TDI
2003 TDI Jetta Daughters Car, 2001 TDI Beetle, Wife’s car, 2005 Golf TDI Mine, all 5 spds
It sounds like you're putting some money into this car. Make sure the auto transmission is working properly. The 01m's of those years were not know to be long lasting.
 

Overdrive0902

Active member
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Location
Frederick, MD
TDI
2001 Jetta MK4
Yes, I fully warmed the engine. At one point I had the IQ set at 6, and it would jump from 4-8. In addition to the timing graph almost centered, but even that would jump a little over an inch top to bottom.
*when I would depress the accelerator the graph would go off the chart.

After purging air I went back the next day to adjust the pump again. Had an initial long frank 4-5 seconds, made an adjustment, 1-2 second crank, made an adjustment, not start... a couple lines and had a bunch of air bubbles. Loosing prime it seems like

My overall goal is to get 100k out of the car. Currently sits at 250k
 

Overdrive0902

Active member
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Location
Frederick, MD
TDI
2001 Jetta MK4
Does any have a good wiring diagram?

I was probing all of the pump connections earlier and I was reading about 11.3v from the #3 injector harness. The injector itself read 99ohms.

The battery was full charged. Also I believe there is a draw on battery of about 3 amps (if my cables were hooked up right)
 

sisyphus

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2008
Location
Appleton, Maine
TDI
99.5, '01 A4 Jetta sedans, 5 sp box, Hamman mod, Joey mod, Bilsteins, 2.00" lift
If there are any mechanical issues with the pump you'll find them when you do the seals. There was a thread around here awhile back where someone had discovered that the rotor, sort of a vertical shaft inside the top of the IP, had broken off it's shaft but continued to work, though the car seemed to run okay. On that thread, someone else chimed in and had the same part fail and their car wouldn't run right. In both cases IIRC the posters stated that there was a loud ticking noise from that area of the engine compartment that seemed to coincide with the failure; though the amount of noise and clicking and clacking coming out of an ALH, especially when cold, can be kind of a wold goose chase/red herring.
 

Overdrive0902

Active member
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Location
Frederick, MD
TDI
2001 Jetta MK4
Alright here's my latest update...

1. Install the Nictane fuel filter kit
2. Resealed the IP head seal and quantity adjuster
3. Drained the fuel tank and replaced with fresh fuel
4. The fuel shut off clicks when power is applied

All appeared good inside the IP, I made sure not to pull the head out to far. Tried bleeding lines got a lot of air bubbles, the injection pump is full of fuel. So that tells me the pump is drawing from the tank.

Two of the injectors just dribbled fuel post bubbles and two of the injectors kinda puffed pressureized fuel out.

Still no start after cranking all injectors but the battery also died so that halted me for the time being.

In addition, I hooked up my extractor pump to the IP return line as well as the injector return line and get no fuel after suction is applied. Also, NO CODES via VCSD.
 

UhOh

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 24, 2014
Location
PNW
TDI
2000 & 2003 Golf GLS (2005 Mercedes E320 CDI)
Not having any codes is very curious...

If no codes then it's unlikely an electrical issue (fuel temp sensor, quantity adjuster etc.).

What does your IQ deviation look like? Just asking for a data point.

How an IQ jumping around like this and there not be any codes... Seems that this could only happen if it's being commanded by the ECU: the ECU is requesting and getting what it's requesting, though it's clearly struggling/hunting.

Crank position sensor? This would throw a code? Couldn't affect IQ!

This seems like a case for Oilhammer!
 

Overdrive0902

Active member
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Location
Frederick, MD
TDI
2001 Jetta MK4
I may have uncovered a new problem...

With my wife's assistance I was able to bleed the injectors and get it running and had very little smoke, but still have long cranks and sometimes no starts. The idle will slowly rise to about 3500 rpm....and smoke white diesel out of the exhaust.

1. Coolant temp sensor. OR
2. Something fuel related?
 

sisyphus

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2008
Location
Appleton, Maine
TDI
99.5, '01 A4 Jetta sedans, 5 sp box, Hamman mod, Joey mod, Bilsteins, 2.00" lift
Do a compression test. Thing is it needs to be at operating temperature though.
 

Overdrive0902

Active member
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Location
Frederick, MD
TDI
2001 Jetta MK4
Alright here are the results from the autoscan....

(Engine)
17978 - engine start blocked by immobilizer - p1570

(Airbags)
00532 supply voltage B+ signal too low - intermittent

(Instruments)
01039 coolant temp sensor - open or short to plus intermittent
01314 engine control module - no communication intermittent
 

Overdrive0902

Active member
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Location
Frederick, MD
TDI
2001 Jetta MK4
Changed the CTS and no change. Every time I start the car it climbs to 3-4K rpms. Not sure what to make of it. I think I read somewhere the IP plunger at the bottom can get stuck.

I'm one problem away from lighting it on fire purely out rage
 

sisyphus

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2008
Location
Appleton, Maine
TDI
99.5, '01 A4 Jetta sedans, 5 sp box, Hamman mod, Joey mod, Bilsteins, 2.00" lift
I'm having a hard time with the chronology here, lol... So you drove it home after you bought it or was it towed?
The cup of oil in the IC is a big red flag. You need to figure out how it got there. Maybe the old turbo was trashed, you have a bent rod or two and you're getting low compression, so the fuel isn't being combusted properly.
If the coolant temp issue isn't solved the ECU is still trying to deliver more fuel. Not sure how much more, but more.
When you get a no-start condition is it because of the immobilizer? The car would turn over but stop after about two seconds and the GP light will flash on the dashboard.
The 01314 code is going to take some investigation, like making sure the wiring harness isn't all chafed up or you might have something going on in the ECU itself but IDK.
You really need to find someone with VCDS and more experience with tunes and so on. There must be someone nearby I hope.
 

Overdrive0902

Active member
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Location
Frederick, MD
TDI
2001 Jetta MK4
When I bought the car it was in limp mode and would not go over 20 mph. The head failed shortly after. The timing bet was intact, so my best guess was out of time and preexhisting lifter damage.

Post head and timing belt - the exhaust was blowing white smoke that smelt of fuel. I installed nictanes fuel filter kit, drained the fuel which was BLUE mind you. Most likely some sort of additive 2 stroke oil which I occasionally run in my Cummins.

Post fuel drain and fuel filter kit - engine starts sounds like it misses for a second or two then the rpms slowly climb to 3-4K possibly redline if I let it.

With the current codes what could this mean?? Coolant temp sensor not communicating with the ECU cause massive fuel delivery???
 

sisyphus

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2008
Location
Appleton, Maine
TDI
99.5, '01 A4 Jetta sedans, 5 sp box, Hamman mod, Joey mod, Bilsteins, 2.00" lift
Some people use 2T oil to lube the pump, the PO that had one of my cars did. Shouldn't be an issue AFAIK.
The Immobilizer code is probably just a stored code. Delete it and see if it comes back, but that's not related to your current problem.
The fuel and air are metered via the ECU.
What happens if you unplug the throttle position sensor?
 

Overdrive0902

Active member
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Location
Frederick, MD
TDI
2001 Jetta MK4
i inspected the CTS plug, I believe the brown/white wire leads to the instrument panel. The wire is intact but looks a little suspect. should i be looking for specific volts or ohms out of the4 pin plug.

The throttle still responses to pressure, but the rpms rise as soon as its started. ill unplug and see what happens.

Deleted codes and the G2 sensor and ECU comm come back (instruments) now just need to isolate the wire

There is far less smoke at idle than previous starts.
 

sisyphus

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2008
Location
Appleton, Maine
TDI
99.5, '01 A4 Jetta sedans, 5 sp box, Hamman mod, Joey mod, Bilsteins, 2.00" lift
I don't get the increasing rpms thing. I have no idea why it should do that, short of the ECU.
IDK what sort of resistance you should see in the CTS; I would assume it's a variable resistance type sensor. The ECU has certain parameters that meter fuel and air based on coolant temperature to a point, but they aren't metered in such a fashion as to make the engine redline. It only increases fueling by an amount that you wouldn't even notice until your mileage went down a bit.
If the car had a cup of oil in the IC from a previous...event, there's likely a bunch of oil downstream in the exhaust as well that needs to burn off.
 

Overdrive0902

Active member
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Location
Frederick, MD
TDI
2001 Jetta MK4
Google VW code 01039. I'm experiencing that exact symptoms.

Well I chopped of the CTS plug and order a new plug pre-wired. Now I'm chasing wires through the harness. Apparently the brown/white strip wire from the CTS plug is a ground for multiple sensors.

We'll just out of curiosity I pulled the intake mani 90* bend to check for oil and there was none. Started with the pipe off and no change. RPMS go right up to 3-4K.
 

UhOh

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 24, 2014
Location
PNW
TDI
2000 & 2003 Golf GLS (2005 Mercedes E320 CDI)
If there's communication issues with the ECU then it wouldn't really log codes, would it? If this is the case then I could then see why the thing is totally screwed up- it has ZERO way of controlling anything. Really have to get this sorted first. Time to check all your grounds.
 

TomDecker

New member
Joined
Jul 17, 2016
Location
Poconos PA USA
TDI
2003 beetle
Why are the N108 IP valves so hard to find in stock? And is it only available as Bosch ? I have one ordered right now from ECS tuning
 

wonneber

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 12, 2011
Location
Monroe, NY, USA
TDI
2014 Jetta Sportwagon,2003 Jetta 261K Sold but not forgotten
I'm thinking you should check:
00532 supply voltage B+ signal too low - intermittent
Sounds like something is not getting enough power or has a bad ground.
Not sure if relay 109 has anything to do with this.
 
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