Clutch Master Cylinder

Herm TDI

Vendor
Joined
Nov 21, 2001
Location
Richmond, Maine...The far side of Witsend
TDI
2002 Golf GLS Malone Stage 3, P+520 nozzles, 11MM Inj pump, Sachs VR6 clutch, Stelth Race Pipe, Immo Deleat, EGR Deleat
Car info: 2002 Jetta GLS TDI 5Sp
Issue: R&R Clutch master cylinder

Question: Does the ABS controler have to be removed to access the hoses on the Clutch Master Cylinder (CMC).
I need to replace the CMC and this is looking like its about to turn into a real headache unless someone can share some info.

TIA
Herm
 

Herm TDI

Vendor
Joined
Nov 21, 2001
Location
Richmond, Maine...The far side of Witsend
TDI
2002 Golf GLS Malone Stage 3, P+520 nozzles, 11MM Inj pump, Sachs VR6 clutch, Stelth Race Pipe, Immo Deleat, EGR Deleat
I have made some progress with this event. The Bentley manual leaves a lot to be desired on this procedure. I'll share my tips and a few photos. Maybe this will develope into a "How To" to be added to the list.

Tip #1:
There is a black relay box mounted onto the fire wall above the CMC. This box is designed to slip upwards and off of its mount. Removing this box will give you a bit more access to the CMC (every little bit more room helps).

Tip #2:
The Bentley manual meantions you need some special tools to disengage the CMC rod from the pedle. I just used two 4" straight-slot screw-drivers to come in from either side of the clip and depressed the lock-tabs. The rod seperated from the lock position.

Tip #3:
The major hurtle to over come is sperating the the pressure line from the CMC to the slave cylinder. On the CMC there is a spring lock which secures the pressure line to the outlet port on the CMC. Releasing this spring lock is a real PITA if you don't know the "trick".

On the CMC there is a verticle slot intened to access and release this lock device. Using a long slender pick or a small screw driver insert the tool into the slot and then slide the spring-lock sideways (towards the driver's side). You just need to slide this spring-lock about 4 MM and it will come to a resting position (do not remove this lock-spring) photos coming.
 

Herm TDI

Vendor
Joined
Nov 21, 2001
Location
Richmond, Maine...The far side of Witsend
TDI
2002 Golf GLS Malone Stage 3, P+520 nozzles, 11MM Inj pump, Sachs VR6 clutch, Stelth Race Pipe, Immo Deleat, EGR Deleat
CMC photos

Here is a photo of the CMC lock-spring. Sorry for the blured image. You can just makeout the slot to release the lock-spring:


Here is a photo of a small screw-driver inserted into the verticle slot to release the lock s
pring:

Lastly a photo of the lock-spring in the resting position (released). This is a far as you need to move the lock-spring. Once in the rest position the pressure line can be seperated from the CMC.

 
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Herm TDI

Vendor
Joined
Nov 21, 2001
Location
Richmond, Maine...The far side of Witsend
TDI
2002 Golf GLS Malone Stage 3, P+520 nozzles, 11MM Inj pump, Sachs VR6 clutch, Stelth Race Pipe, Immo Deleat, EGR Deleat
The job is done except for the bleeding / flush.
The most difficault part was releasing and installing the pressure line for the slave cylinder. The connection point on the CMC is in a tight location.
Once you understand how the lock-spring works you are half way through the battel. Release the lock-spring then you have to reach under the ABS control module (find the line for the slave cylinder) and seperate the line from the CMC by flexing, tugging (gently)in a downward direction.
The same for re-connecting this line. Have the spring lock released and reach under the ABS control module and work the line back into its connection while at the same time with your other hand press the spring lock home to secure the pressure line.
 
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Herm TDI

Vendor
Joined
Nov 21, 2001
Location
Richmond, Maine...The far side of Witsend
TDI
2002 Golf GLS Malone Stage 3, P+520 nozzles, 11MM Inj pump, Sachs VR6 clutch, Stelth Race Pipe, Immo Deleat, EGR Deleat
more photos

Here are a few more photos I thought worth posting.
This is fuzzy butyou get the general idea of what and where the CMC release tabs are located. The small white rectangle is the plactic tabs to be depressed to release the CMC rod


Here is another photo of the CMC rod disengaged from the pedle


Another photo of the CMC removed from its mount:


This next photo of the installed CMC with the spring-lock released. You need to have this lock in this position to seat the pressure line into its connector.


There is another "trick" to this making this connection. With one hand reached under the ABS control module find/ locate the line and press, the line squarely into its seat. Then with your other hand reach down and press the spring-lock home to secure the connection.

Here is a photo of the slave pressure line connected to the CMC.


This is about all of the major elements to the CMC replacement.
I'm glad that I have the car on a hoist as I was able to do the work under the dash standing at the driver's door. :)
 

deadend9009

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Location
Val-David, Qc
TDI
'03 Wagon
i hate the bentley for this reason. It doesn't always tell the whole story.

On the other hand, i think this deserves to be stickied as it could be useful for others.

Thanks herm!
 

Herm TDI

Vendor
Joined
Nov 21, 2001
Location
Richmond, Maine...The far side of Witsend
TDI
2002 Golf GLS Malone Stage 3, P+520 nozzles, 11MM Inj pump, Sachs VR6 clutch, Stelth Race Pipe, Immo Deleat, EGR Deleat
Gear shift

greengeeker said:
What symptoms was the car showing that pointed towards a failed CMC?
The very first day the owner came to me with the complaint of difficault shifting. Not always the same gear and some problems upshifting through the gears during acceleration.

With the current mileage I started with a gear lube replacment (VWoA gear lube) and a linkage adjustment. This seemed to help but did not resolve the probelm. A few days later additional gear shift ddifficaulties.
I recommended replacing the clutch slave cylinder. I did that and as soon as I compleated the bleed I felt a strange / different feel to the clutch pedle. The feel was like a softness mid-way to depressing the clutch.
Then the next day a total failure where he could not shift gears with the engine running. At that time I said to replace the CMC. Which did not solve the problem ( Can not shift into any grear with the engine running).
 

greengeeker

Vendor
Joined
Feb 8, 2006
Location
Cambridge, MN
TDI
2002 Jetta GLS
I'm guessing the softness went away after you replaced the CMC? Before you changed it out, was the softness at hte top or bottom of the travel? Did the slave have fluid in the protective boot?

What was the brake fluid flush history on the car?

Still isn't fixed? :confused:
 

Herm TDI

Vendor
Joined
Nov 21, 2001
Location
Richmond, Maine...The far side of Witsend
TDI
2002 Golf GLS Malone Stage 3, P+520 nozzles, 11MM Inj pump, Sachs VR6 clutch, Stelth Race Pipe, Immo Deleat, EGR Deleat
answers

greengeeker said:
I'm guessing the softness went away after you replaced the CMC? Before you changed it out, was the softness at hte top or bottom of the travel? Did the slave have fluid in the protective boot?

What was the brake fluid flush history on the car?

Still isn't fixed? :confused:
CMC replaced no further softness
The intial softness was at the bottom
No fluid evident in the slave boot
 

MikeoMe

New member
Joined
Dec 2, 2008
Location
Chicagoland
TDI
do not own
Thanks Herm, Joined TDI club just to see your pictures after finding your thread with a Google search. Planning to replace the slave and master on my daughter's jetta this coming weekend. Your pictures are just what I needed. Thanks much!
 

Herm TDI

Vendor
Joined
Nov 21, 2001
Location
Richmond, Maine...The far side of Witsend
TDI
2002 Golf GLS Malone Stage 3, P+520 nozzles, 11MM Inj pump, Sachs VR6 clutch, Stelth Race Pipe, Immo Deleat, EGR Deleat
Clutch

greengeeker said:
How did this turn out Herm? Did it end up being the DMF or clutch coming apart?
The clutch plate fell apart. We also replaced the flywheel and went with a single mass...vr6 set-up
 

rbptdi

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 14, 2006
Location
Cape Cod, MA
TDI
2001 Golf TDi 2-door - no mods unless you count missing parts and a leaking sunroof
Hmm I usually pull the whole clutch pedal assembly as one.
how do you do that??
I am in the middle of replacing CMC on a 2001 Golf TDi
replaced the slave already, and that did not do the trick
like Herm says, CMC is in a very tight location up against the firewall - I was able to remove the clip, the hydraulic line, and under the dash unclip the CMC pushrod from the clutch pedal (no special tool, just one regular screwdriver, one side at a time and pull the pushrod out of the pedal)
also removed the 2 nuts securing the CMC w/o much trouble
where I am stuck is: at the top of the CMC above the 2 nuts that secure it to the firewall is the white nylon cup that the main clutch spring rests in
and that cup has a tab which extends down OVER the top of the CMC, holding the top edge in place
now I am not sure WHY it is there, but it is preventing me from pulling the CMC out (I notice in Herm's pics there is NOT a clip extending over the CMC - guess the 2001 just got lucky)
anyone have any suggestions? there IS a nut above the white cup and I will try removing that (I did remove the clutch spring, but that did not release the cup)
help?
thx
Rolf in MA
 
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