Syndiesel

Bob, my 27 year old dyno (son) just came back from a drive in the TDI. He asked what the hell did I do to the Golf. His words "it runs like a bat outta hell now!"

LGV2001 said:

Bob, my 27 year old dyno (son) just came back from a drive in the TDI. He asked what the hell did I do to the Golf. His words "it runs like a bat outta hell now!"

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And he had NO idea that the new fuel was in it?

Some 50 MPH to 80 MPH times in 4th gear comparing the two would be very nice to have.

He had no idea about the fuel and I will keep it that way. He drives a 2005 Duramax that has a few mods and I know what would happen if he finds my stash of fuel.

sebring96hbg said:

Hiperfuels claim that its Syndiesel has 20,500 more BTUs per pound than dino diesel. That said, dino diesel should have about 19,000 BTUs per pound. If the claims are true, then Syndiesel would have twice the energy content as dino diesel on a per pound basis.

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You must have read incorrectly. That part of the add reads:

"Syndiesel (R) Synthetic Diesel Fuel/Additive. 63 Cetane Number (highest of ANY Diesel fuel on the market today), 20,500 Btu/pound (20% more than standard Diesel),"

Diesel has 19,000 per pound (according to your post above), Syndiesel has 20,500 per pound.

20,500/19,000 = 7.9%

Not sure where 20% comes from....

I'm told there's no real benefit to taking the cetane level of our fuel much over 49: the ECU doesn't take advantage of a higher level. So the mix I suggested was designed to get to 50 or so cetane with a good dose of bio for lubricity. You could probably reduce the bio to 10% and increase the D2 with not much change in performance. I guess I should get some of this before the MIVE event in April.

IndigoBlueWagon said:

I'm told there's no real benefit to taking the cetane level of our fuel much over 49: the ECU doesn't take advantage of a higher level. So the mix I suggested was designed to get to 50 or so cetane with a good dose of bio for lubricity. You could probably reduce the bio to 10% and increase the D2 with not much change in performance. I guess I should get some of this before the MIVE event in April.

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Can tuners change the ECU so it does though?

Bob_Fout said:

Can tuners change the ECU so it does though?

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That's the same thing I was thinking.

Sootman, that is what I said in laymans terms..Reduced lube because of the sulfur being removed.

The mixture should be less then 50% to keep the cetane around 50..

LGV, we are having a dyno on the 19th of April, come join in..The lack of lube is something you want to keep track of..Use whatever means are availible to keep the lube up. smooth power..

NO increase in mileage...I dont think the 20,500 btus claims, mean squat compared to my fuel mileage testing..I am still testing and I dont see it..

Mach1 said:

Sootman, that is what I said in laymans terms..Reduced lube because of the sulfur being removed.

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Whoops, sorry I missed that. I've run into a number of folks who will tell me it is the sulfur that lubricates the fuel and that's how I read your post. Thanks for clarifying.

I often hear that Bio lubricates, but at the same time I hear there is water (moisture) in the fuel that screws up our fuel pumps (I'm on my third pump after running lots of Bio in the past). What's the common belief about this?

Sootman said:

I often hear that Bio lubricates, but at the same time I hear there is water (moisture) in the fuel that screws up our fuel pumps (I'm on my third pump after running lots of Bio in the past). What's the common belief about this?

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OK, so how often do you get to answer your own question. The thing about the Bio was bugging me so this is what I found:

Based on the HFRR testing run by Stanadyne, and testing from other laboratories showing similar results, Stanadyne Automotive has stated:
“….we have tested biodiesel at Stanadyne and results indicate that the inclusion of 2% biodiesel into any conventional diesel fuel will be sufficient to address the lubricity concerns that we have with these existing diesel fuels. From our standpoint, inclusion of biodiesel is desirable for two reasons. First it would eliminate the inherent variability associated with the use of other additives and whether sufficient additive was used to make the fuel fully lubricious. Second, we consider biodiesel a fuel or fuel component—not an additive…Thus if more biodiesel is added than required to increase lubricity, there will not be the adverse consequences that might be seen if other lubricity additives are dosed at too high a rate.”-this from the National Biodiesel Board. So it looks like 2% bio is good enough.

The best news is that a new plant is producing Bio at the rate of 30,000 gallons per week nearby. Hopefully I can buy it direct (home heating oil of course) and run 2%-5% in the car.

Lightflyer1 said:

You must have read incorrectly. That part of the add reads:

"Syndiesel (R) Synthetic Diesel Fuel/Additive. 63 Cetane Number (highest of ANY Diesel fuel on the market today), 20,500 Btu/pound (20% more than standard Diesel),"

Diesel has 19,000 per pound (according to your post above), Syndiesel has 20,500 per pound.

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Sorry, my mistake. I rushed through that post - really bad.

Sootman said:

I often hear that Bio lubricates, but at the same time I hear there is water (moisture) in the fuel that screws up our fuel pumps (I'm on my third pump after running lots of Bio in the past). What's the common belief about this?

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Good bio does not contain water.

Sootman said:

The best news is that a new plant is producing Bio at the rate of 30,000 gallons per week nearby. Hopefully I can buy it direct (home heating oil of course) and run 2%-5% in the car.

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Unless they've already done what quite a few biod plants have done - already contracted most of thier production to European customers.

I've stopped using the biod that's available within a reasonable driving distance. Quality has went from good to bad to absolute crap within the past year. Last time I bought any 6 months ago, pulled a sample in a quart jar - by the time I got home 45 minutes later, it already had a 1/4" layer of glycerin and water settling out of it.

retmil46 said:

Unless they've already done what quite a few biod plants have done - already contracted most of thier production to European customers.

I've stopped using the biod that's available within a reasonable driving distance. Quality has went from good to bad to absolute crap within the past year. Last time I bought any 6 months ago, pulled a sample in a quart jar - by the time I got home 45 minutes later, it already had a 1/4" layer of glycerin and water settling out of it.

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I imagine that's the kind of thing that got my pumps. To bad too, hopefully the local producer here in maine will fare a bit better.

CTL Process

Found this pdf about a proposed Alaska CTL project that explains the process.
Link http://www.aidea.org/PDF files/BelugaCTLoverview9-20-06.pdf

dbLog and I are getting some of this for the Mive event in April. Perhaps we'll have time to try a session on straight dino and then on a blend. We can share some comparative lap times (assuming our cars hold up!).

I stopped the bio stuff as well, because they are using recycled waste oil instead of virgin oil, I would suspect that 2-5% mixture of bio with the syn-diesel would be the way to go..

I just dont care for the modern bio/waste oil that is going around right now, I am glad the gvernment clamped down on this..The acidiness of the bio/waste oil will take out some fuel pumps, I lost a couple on my diesel truck.

All yes, ALL diesel and bio has water in it...

Lightflyer1 said:

Looks like 5, 15 and 55 gallon jugs/drums. $55, $90 and $225 respectively. Run it empty and get the 15 gallon and fillup. Call ahead to make sure they have some.

http://www.hiperfuels.com/catalog.aspx?Merchant=highfuelsn&DeptID=81049

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Yep....you buy it in 5, 15, and 55 gallon containers. I bought 1-5 gallon jug....$35+tax, for testing.

I have an update on the Syndiesel mileage numbers.
1331 miles, 26.93 gal=49.42
Looks like I am getting 3 mpg less running about 50% ratios but I am pleased with it!

maybe your switch to syndiesel causes your foot to fluctuate more frequently

I am seeing the same as well, I dont get the MPG's out of it that the #2 gets..

Its quieter, runs better, smoother, and has more pep to it.

It does burn clean though..

It makes sense it would give less mileage - less BTU if its cleaner.

What about lubricity - anyone have any HFRR test on this stuff.

If the lubricity is good and its needs 0 additves then this itself is worth as much as .20 per gal

wjdell said:

It makes sense it would give less mileage - less BTU if its cleaner.

What about lubricity - anyone have any HFRR test on this stuff.

If the lubricity is good and its needs 0 additves then this itself is worth as much as .20 per gal

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I'm resurrecting this because I've not seen any answers to this yet.

Syndiesel's site does not have any lubricity data, and makes the claim of 10% more BTU than regular diesel. 60 cetane is great, that's better than most biodiesel, and way better than the pump diesel trash of 40 cetane (for low rpm OTR engines AFAICT)

I'd love to get some and check the mpg, as B100 gets me 10% more mileage than D2, on both my NB and my Liberty CRD. This tells me the BTU content of the D2 is quite a bit lower than what is commonly published, so syndiesel could have the potential of even better mileage than biodiesel....

A half-gallon of pure SVO B100 should alleviate any and all lubricity concerns, shouldn't it?