fuel filter micron rating and bypass oil filters

Any of you guys know what the factory fuel filter micron rating is? I've been learning a little more about the common rail systems on the diesel pickups, and it is highly recommended to upgrade them to a 2 micron fuel filter. Also, another common upgrade is a bypass oil filter of similar rating, that takes the soot out of the oil. Or a small centrifuge which does the same thing, like the spinner 2. I am now wondering if inadequate filtration in addition to inadequate lubricity with the diesel is another contributing factor to hpfp failures. Also, I don't like that the oem setup has no provision for a water drain. Anyone here upgrade their fuel filtration or run bypass oil filters?

There was discussion about fuel filter some time ago. IIRC it's something less than 10 microns with efficiency at ~95%. Do a search for that, there were quotes on official response from MANN.

I have never found water in the fuel filter canister when doing a filter change, neither on my old PD engine, nor CR.

hpfp are failing due to bosch defects not the no lube or trash in fuel, the parts are not mated on hardness, springs fatique or the plungers breaking

The 2 Micron system actually functions like a bypass oil filter since the return oil passes through a 2 micron to keep trash from a dying HPFP from contaminating the fuel system.
Since the Diesel has a pretty high bypass especially at idle the fuel in the tank gets filtered three times(at least).
Once where I buy the fuel through the water excluding filter on the pump. Secondly through the VW fuel filter going to the HPFP. Thirdly through the 2 micron 2 Micron filter back to the tank to make the trip again and again until the tank is low and we start over. In the industrial maintenance game we call this "polishing" the oil.

wrenchman30 said:

hpfp are failing due to bosch defects not the no lube or trash in fuel, the parts are not mated on hardness, springs fatique or the plungers breaking

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When you make a statement like that, citing no sources, giving no arguments to support it, why would anyone accept that at face value? If you have massive experience with TDIs, and a 500 whp tdi, you're not telling us.

I have read maybe 100 pages on the hpfp failures, and of those who have had their hpfps replaced, almost none of them were running any lubricity additive. One guy even had his replaced 3 times, still didn't run any lubricity additive.

But anyway, when the cummins/duramax guys are running 1-3 micron filtration in their common rail motors, we probably should be too. I know on the common rail cummins, inadequate filtration is a definite cause of injector failure. Injector failure easily leads to a melted pistons, check out this video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_BkDzxo6UNo

redbarron55 said:

The 2 Micron system actually functions like a bypass oil filter since the return oil passes through a 2 micron to keep trash from a dying HPFP from contaminating the fuel system.
Since the Diesel has a pretty high bypass especially at idle the fuel in the tank gets filtered three times(at least).
Once where I buy the fuel through the water excluding filter on the pump. Secondly through the VW fuel filter going to the HPFP. Thirdly through the 2 micron 2 Micron filter back to the tank to make the trip again and again until the tank is low and we start over. In the industrial maintenance game we call this "polishing" the oil.

Click to expand...

Yeah, of course ideally the fuel would see 2 micron filtration before and after the pump, so there would never be any chance sub 7 or 10 micron particles going into or leaving it. At least the lubrication side, I realize no filter is going to be on the 26kpsi side.

I started a thread on this very topic about a year ago.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=410062

Regardless of what the nay sayers go on about I agree with the very real need for better filtration being needed for our entines.

I linked a couple articles in that thread as well. I'm sure you will find them a very good read.

2011tdiproject said:

When you make a statement like that, citing no sources, giving no arguments to support it, why would anyone accept that at face value? If you have massive experience with TDIs, and a 500 whp tdi, you're not telling us.

I have read maybe 100 pages on the hpfp failures, and of those who have had their hpfps replaced, almost none of them were running any lubricity additive. One guy even had his replaced 3 times, still didn't run any lubricity additive.

But anyway, when the cummins/duramax guys are running 1-3 micron filtration in their common rail motors, we probably should be too. I know on the common rail cummins, inadequate filtration is a definite cause of injector failure. Injector failure easily leads to a melted pistons, check out this video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_BkDzxo6UNo

Click to expand...

I haven't been following the hpfp stuff lately, but did a couple years ago. As folks started reporting their failures, there didn't seem to be any rhyme or reason as to why they were failing. Additive use didn't seem to be a factor. And if it was due to insufficient filtering, there should have been a trend where failure rates increased with increased miles. But we didn't see this. We saw failures at 15k miles, and we saw failures at 80k miles.

To my thinking, it had to be something to do with the metallurgy, with the manufacturing of the pumps (i.e. tolerances), or of the run-in of the pumps at the factory. Some argued that the fuel-lubricated pump was a poor design (rather than oil-lubricated like some other common CR pumps are), and that that was causing the failures, but even there, we saw folks climbing up into the 100k+ mark with no problems. And even recently, a local courier running a 2010 JSW racked up 370k miles on her original pump before her car was totalled in an accident. She didn't use any additives.

oops sorry I posted something I am just this dillweed that works at a busy truckshop my last closing of a warranty claim on a hpfp failure was 8k, the fuel filter should already be a 2 micron, the water trap for the fuel filter is by design the bottom of the canister, you can unbolt it and dump out any water and or use a paper towel and a long screw driver to mop it out, sorry I cant link stuff you know those pesky things at the bottom of service bulletins that have all that legal stuff saying not to share the info is a bummer, vw and all other engine manufactures are picking up the bill on hpfp because bosch knows of the issues, I for one hope they get the problem fixed as I am getting really tired of fixing all those nice metal pieces in the fuel system and engines

ATR said:

I started a thread on this very topic about a year ago.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=410062

Regardless of what the nay sayers go on about I agree with the very real need for better filtration being needed for our entines.

I linked a couple articles in that thread as well. I'm sure you will find them a very good read.

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Yeah, I would like to run the cat 2 micron filter myself too.

Read this thread:


http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=432807

Same stuff, different day.

Bill

EDIT, wrong link, Fixed now.

wrenchman30 said:

oops sorry I posted something I am just this dillweed that works at a busy truckshop my last closing of a warranty claim on a hpfp failure was 8k, the fuel filter should already be a 2 micron, the water trap for the fuel filter is by design the bottom of the canister, you can unbolt it and dump out any water and or use a paper towel and a long screw driver to mop it out, sorry I cant link stuff you know those pesky things at the bottom of service bulletins that have all that legal stuff saying not to share the info is a bummer, vw and all other engine manufactures are picking up the bill on hpfp because bosch knows of the issues, I for one hope they get the problem fixed as I am getting really tired of fixing all those nice metal pieces in the fuel system and engines

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Yeah, the fuel filter should be a 2 micron, but according to what I've found, it's not. The water trap is a trap that you can't drain unless you take it apart, talk about a stupid design from vw. You want to call yourself a dillweed, go ahead. I'm just saying when you make a statement like you did you have to back it up with something at the time. But please not with a paragraph long run on sentence, I haven't taken enough adderall to process that.

40X40 said:

Read this thread:
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=437102

Same stuff, different day.

Bill

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Yeah, literally the same stuff, nice sense of humor linking this thread back to itself!

2011tdiproject said:

The water trap is a trap that you can't drain unless you take it apart, talk about a stupid design from vw.

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Then VW is stupid for not installing buggy-whip holders in our cars, too.

I did all of my own fuel filter changes for 280k miles on my 2000 Golf TDI. The filters had a proper water separator drain spigot on them.

Know what? I NEVER found any water. Haven't found any in my JSW's, either.

And that's why we don't have a water separator in our fuel filter housings.

Per the VW schedule, the fuel filter is to be changed every 20k miles. If you'd like, when you're doing a filter change, take a pickle jar and a dollar store turkey baster with you. Suck out all the diesel and put it in the jar. Reinstall filter and add fill the canister with additive (which is primarily diesel fuel), or close it up and prime with VCDS. Let pickle jar sit for however long you'd like, and inspect for water. You're not likely to find any.

Under a flashlight, I did find sparkly bits in the fuel at 20k, 40k, and 60k miles as the fuel pump bed in. Haven't seen any since.

Actually on my 2009 you can drain the water from the bottom with a small tune and a suction pump like the adapted Pela oil extractor. You pull the access screw, run the tube from the top to the bottom of the filter and pull out a few ounces of fuel (or water if there is any).
I think the failures are the in the surface treatment of the parts in the cam part of the pump.
I personally don't think the fineness of the filter is a contributor. Water would be.
I have 230,000 miles on my 2009 and used some additive early on, but not a great deal and not at all for the last 5 years.
Probably the initial running of the pump is important to break-in.

Here's something I have been wondering about. Since the little electric engine compartment pump pulls fuel from the filter housing, sends it through the system on the motor, then back into the filter housing, and then it goes back to the tank, what would happen if it were sent to the supply side of the filter instead. Like if #4 were T'd back into #1 in the pic, the line from the lift pump. In other words, doing the 'contain flow' setup with one filter. I may be missing something here, but I've wondered about this since I first read about that setup. What I would like to do is set it up to function that way with the cat filter.

40X40 said:

Read this thread:


http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=432807

Same stuff, different day.

Bill

EDIT, wrong link, Fixed now.

Click to expand...

Uhhh..no, you've now linked it to a different thread that I started. What are you trying to do? Haha.