A case of extreme sludge

Windex

Top Post Dawg
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Apr 1, 2006
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Cambridge
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05 B5V 01E FRF
Guy, I came across this article regarding Mercedes Benz's diesel Bluetec engine. But the writer, also,makes some statements that seem to apply to diesel engines across the board. Some of the things he described sounds like what happened to my engine. Just wondering if any of you came across this article and what were your thoughts?
http://www.stephensservice.com/bluetec-diesel-issuesproblems/
Maybe I should start a new thread for this?
That guys page is a vomited stream of consciousness rant explosion. :rolleyes:
 

Henrick

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So on your side of the pond it seems that 5w-30 is identified as "very low viscosity oil" whereas here in Europe 0w-20 is a normal weight for modern diesels.

Also, I'm not so sure that "drive like you stole it" way works fo DPF equipped cars well.
 

ronlove

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Michigan
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2006 Jetta TDI, Package 2
Okay, I thought it was an interesting read. But, if it's all bull, then I suppose it doesn't matter.

Because of the condition of my car I started exploring different options like looking around for a possible replacement. But I wasn't able to find any cars with the options I had in my '06 Jetta plus get 40 Mpg! (I'm driving my wife's minivan right now until I get my car fixed or replaced and I'm really noticing how much more I need to go to the gas station!)

I guess I'm spoiled. Any suggestions for a slight upgrade from a 2006 Jetta TDI? Where do you go from here? :)
 

ronlove

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2006 Jetta TDI, Package 2
Also, on another note anyone have an idea of what I can get if I sold it as is? Body's in good shape, no rust, interior is almost perfect, slight tear in the driver leather seat. Power everything. Tires less than 2 years old good tread.
 

ronlove

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Yeah, I'm gonna go ahead and cut my losses and sell it as is. Everything else is fine but the engine and turbo.
 

JETaah

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mi 48836
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It is not like what you have is not fixable.
It might make a great project for someone who cares to deal with cleaning it up and doing the internals.
 
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JETaah

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mi 48836
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UOA results

Here are the results of the UOA for RonLove's Jetta









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Well, the computer whiz in me can't figure out how to display this so that it is easily read.


I included the thumbnail so that you can view it in PHOTO.


lots of iron....no surprise here with the broken lifters and cam wear.
lots of fuel dilution and soot
no mention of coolant contamination
 
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whitedog

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Bend, Oregon
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2004 Jetta that I fill by myself
Thanks for getting this and thanks for showing the Schaeffer's report. I'll stick with Blackstone since I didn't like the way this was all reported.
 

Growler

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Being that its a PD, perhaps the injector mount/seal o-rings were allowing fuel contamination into the Oil pan? isnt there an area that is between two O-rings that has return fuel flowing around the outside of the injector bodies on those PD injectors with micro holes in the injector bodies themselves to allow fuel flow?

I admit its been a long time since I have seen how those injectors work so I may be completely wrong.
 
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oilhammer

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outside St Louis, MO
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There are just too many to list....
It usually goes the other way around, which is why PD fuel filters are always black, but the same filter on a VE or CR isn't.

But yes, there could be an issue of fuel getting into the oil too.
 

nicklockard

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Arizona
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Okay, I thought it was an interesting read. But, if it's all bull, then I suppose it doesn't matter.
Because of the condition of my car I started exploring different options like looking around for a possible replacement. But I wasn't able to find any cars with the options I had in my '06 Jetta plus get 40 Mpg! (I'm driving my wife's minivan right now until I get my car fixed or replaced and I'm really noticing how much more I need to go to the gas station!)
I guess I'm spoiled. Any suggestions for a slight upgrade from a 2006 Jetta TDI? Where do you go from here? :)
Lots of us have switched over to BMW 335d. Mine got 42 mpg on a 1600 mile trip from MS to AZ. Gets 29 mpg average on my 50/50 city/hwy commute style--but I like to pass everyone and cruise at 90+. Buy one for about 11k and drop 3k of goodies into it, then you're set.
 

JETaah

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Kind of interesting that there is an excess of fuel in the oil and the sample is too thick to test.


I did swap out the lifters with some less fubar'd ones just so that the car could be moved under it's own power. #2 cylinder still showed +2.99 deviation in group 13 so something was still amiss. You could feel this like a misfire.


The fuel-in-oil could also be due to tandem pump leakage. Although the oil level was close to being right, it could be a result of losing oil through the turbo and regaining the level with the fuel migration.



Good luck to Ron on getting over this.
 

ronlove

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2006 Jetta TDI, Package 2
Hey guys, if I want to go down the road of flushing the engine of this sludge, what would be the best way to do this?? Thanks in advance!
 

Windex

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On any other car I would recommend to drain the oil and refill and run it on auto transmission fluid (at idle only) or oil mixed with solvent, drain again and refill and run one more time. The challenge is the cam loading in the BRM engine - you would be at risk of damaging the cam when running any lube lighter than 505.01.

TO clean a BRM of sludge, I would pull the cam cover and pan and physically clean out the crap. refill with fresh oil of the right spec, and then do one more oil change at an accelerated interval.
 

oilhammer

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outside St Louis, MO
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There are just too many to list....
I'd take the oil pan off, take the oil pickup tube off, and manually clean those.

I'd take the valve cover off and throw it in the trash. The breather baffles inside are almost certainly beyond reasonably being cleaned, and how would you really know anyway?

With the valve cover off, and the oil pan off, I'd use kerosene or diesel fuel and liberally rinse it all down through the oil drain holes in the cam box area.

I'd take the oil filter/cooler housing off, take it all apart, and clean every last bit of it manually. Even better find a decent used one and use that.

Replace the turbo oil feed pipe... unless you feel reasonably sure you can get it clean. I wouldn't trust it. Take the turbo drain pipe off (inside the stand on the BRM), and make certain it is cleaned. make sure the drain fitting in the block (big banjo bolt) is clean, too.

Once you get it as clean as you can get it, put it all back together. I would fill it with oil, with a new filter, then manually crank the engine by either jumping power to the starter or disabling the engine from starting (removal of the injector plug on the head would be easiest). Crank the engine around for 20 seconds or so. Then reconnect the plug, and start it up. Make sure the oil pressure warning lamp remains off, and make sure the engine sounds like it is quieting down like the lifters are pumping up.

Then rev it to 2500 and hold it there with no load for a few minutes, shut the engine off, and drain/refill the oil and change the filter.
 

ronlove

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2006 Jetta TDI, Package 2
I'd take the oil pan off, take the oil pickup tube off, and manually clean those.
I'd take the valve cover off and throw it in the trash. The breather baffles inside are almost certainly beyond reasonably being cleaned, and how would you really know anyway?
With the valve cover off, and the oil pan off, I'd use kerosene or diesel fuel and liberally rinse it all down through the oil drain holes in the cam box area.
I'd take the oil filter/cooler housing off, take it all apart, and clean every last bit of it manually. Even better find a decent used one and use that.
Replace the turbo oil feed pipe... unless you feel reasonably sure you can get it clean. I wouldn't trust it. Take the turbo drain pipe off (inside the stand on the BRM), and make certain it is cleaned. make sure the drain fitting in the block (big banjo bolt) is clean, too.
Once you get it as clean as you can get it, put it all back together. I would fill it with oil, with a new filter, then manually crank the engine by either jumping power to the starter or disabling the engine from starting (removal of the injector plug on the head would be easiest). Crank the engine around for 20 seconds or so. Then reconnect the plug, and start it up. Make sure the oil pressure warning lamp remains off, and make sure the engine sounds like it is quieting down like the lifters are pumping up.
Then rev it to 2500 and hold it there with no load for a few minutes, shut the engine off, and drain/refill the oil and change the filter.
Whoa, no wonder @Jetaah says to just get another engine. Consequently, I just found someone selling an engine for $750 and he has Kerma camshaft that he's willing to part with for $350.
 

JETaah

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And...after all that work, hope that you run into what caused this mess. Bad injector, broken rings, hole in a piston, Vandalism...???

You would have to first replace the cam with something at least close to being usable enough to assess the rest of engine operation.
 
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Matt-98AHU

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Holy crap!

I've seen fuel contaminated engine oil before on a PD, but instead of turning into a thick goey mess, it usually just gets a lot thinner. You go to drain it and it's almost like water.

I wouldn't even know where to begin to place blame here unless there was somehow an ungodly amount of soot getting into the crankcase somehow, but I'm having a hard time seeing how!

Unreal.
 

ronlove

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Michigan
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2006 Jetta TDI, Package 2
Just found someone selling a BRM engine with 90k miles on it. But he has a new Kerma cam too and says he'll sell me both for $1000. I'm thinking I may give the Jetta another go!
 

Matt-98AHU

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Kind of wonder if the current engine has a cracked piston or something crazy. Enough to have OK compression numbers but allows some soot into the crankcase?

The post mortem would be interesting to see.
 

ronlove

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Michigan
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2006 Jetta TDI, Package 2
UPDATE!:

Well, I ended up selling it to a mechanic. I told him about this thread so that he knew what he was getting into. He planned on pulling the engine and taking it apart. He also found someone selling a BRM engine so he bought that too. Anyways, I recently texted him and asked him what he found and he texted me back: “Oil line plugged off”. I’m sure this means a lot more to you that are mechanically inclined. Maybe you can interpret that to us laymen one day. :)
 

JETaah

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Probably the turbo feed that I plugged since it was toast anyway. The engine was not to be run other than to move it in and out of the shop and I did not want it to run away on the oil.
 
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