How much egt's can these engines handle in short burst? I pegged mine at well over 1600(I would gues close to 1800) only for a minute. Can the engine handle those kind of temps? I was at WOT at 140 MPH. I usually dont stay on the gas once the temp hits 1600 but when you race sometime good logic goes out the window.
Highest EGT reading
- Thread starter KROUT
- Start date
jsrmonster
Veteran Member - TDIClub Enthusiast
- Joined
- Apr 22, 2002
- Location
- Red Lion, PA
- TDI
- 15 Golf SW DSG, RC3 piped, 99.5 Jetta Rocket PD150 6spd 4motion, 2000 ASV110 RC6 "Silverbullet" 5spd Race Car, 2003.5 Cummins QCLB 4x4 "Blue Monster" Jeep CRD juiced, MB Sprinter van juiced up
Hi,
I wouldn't worry too much about egt for a short blast, but you'll waste your new pump if you over-rev it. It's only good for about 4000 rpm before the piston starts to float. If it floats, the cam plate can come out of the drive pin and whammo.
Do the 5th gear nose job if you need to go that fast, better yet the DRW 6spd is awesome. You'll have bigger axles too.
cya,
Jeff
I wouldn't worry too much about egt for a short blast, but you'll waste your new pump if you over-rev it. It's only good for about 4000 rpm before the piston starts to float. If it floats, the cam plate can come out of the drive pin and whammo.
Do the 5th gear nose job if you need to go that fast, better yet the DRW 6spd is awesome. You'll have bigger axles too.
cya,
Jeff
[SIZE=-1]Not to argue with Mr. RC, here's what I dug up doing googles:
If you get the turbine too hot, it can damage the turbo. At 1270 degrees F, the tips of the turbine blades begin to glow. If you get them too hot, they'll straighten out or even melt and you'll ruin the turbo. The factory Garrett turbocharger will pull all day long at 1250 degrees, but in our opinion, 1270 degrees is the DO NOT EXCEED temp for sustained use. (I know we don't run Garret's, but it has to be similar technology with similar operating constraints...)
I can relate to the "heat of the battle" brain fade... I always tell myself during the first few laps of the day to take it easy. Cold brain, cold track, cold tires, CHILL!!! Then I get into it with another rider and it's all out... I almost had the rear tire come around on me one morning when I couldn't keep "it" in check...
[/SIZE]
If you get the turbine too hot, it can damage the turbo. At 1270 degrees F, the tips of the turbine blades begin to glow. If you get them too hot, they'll straighten out or even melt and you'll ruin the turbo. The factory Garrett turbocharger will pull all day long at 1250 degrees, but in our opinion, 1270 degrees is the DO NOT EXCEED temp for sustained use. (I know we don't run Garret's, but it has to be similar technology with similar operating constraints...)
I can relate to the "heat of the battle" brain fade... I always tell myself during the first few laps of the day to take it easy. Cold brain, cold track, cold tires, CHILL!!! Then I get into it with another rider and it's all out... I almost had the rear tire come around on me one morning when I couldn't keep "it" in check...
[/SIZE]
Last edited:
jnecr
Veteran Member
According to Drivbiwire our turbos exhaust side is made from Inconel. It's a high heat alloy that can resist very high temps. Do some searches for it, I'm too lazy... Not sure if this applies to the VNTs or the KP39s....
Drivbiwire
Zehntes Jahr der Veteran
- Joined
- Oct 13, 1998
- Location
- Boise, Idaho
- TDI
- 2013 Passat TDI, Newmar Ventana 8.3L ISC 3945, 2016 E250 BT, 2000 Jetta TDI
The temps listed below are the maximum temps that the turbo can operate at without limitation of time. Above these temps the turbine is no longer strong enough to withstand the spinning forces of the wheel. As far as I know ALL turbo's used in the TDI engine line are made from Inconel of various grades. The latest version is a cutting edge alloy that set the standard of "1080C" which is required in the latest emissions compliant turbo charged cars.
1Z - GT-15 1550F / 850C
AHU - KKK-03's 1650F / 900C
ALH - VNT-15 1650F / 900C
BEW - KKK-VGT 1980F / 1080C
All temps are continious ratings. IF you exceed the temps the turbine rapidly loses its strength although you may not have immediate failure you are causing the blades to "Creep" or elongate due to the spinning forces.
1Z GT-15 turbo after being subjected to excessively retarded timing (10/140) due to improper timing settings by a dealer. Maximum continious temps on this particular turbo are 1550F. I suspect the temps on this turbo hit 1700F
DB
1Z - GT-15 1550F / 850C
AHU - KKK-03's 1650F / 900C
ALH - VNT-15 1650F / 900C
BEW - KKK-VGT 1980F / 1080C
All temps are continious ratings. IF you exceed the temps the turbine rapidly loses its strength although you may not have immediate failure you are causing the blades to "Creep" or elongate due to the spinning forces.
1Z GT-15 turbo after being subjected to excessively retarded timing (10/140) due to improper timing settings by a dealer. Maximum continious temps on this particular turbo are 1550F. I suspect the temps on this turbo hit 1700F
DB
Drivbiwire
Zehntes Jahr der Veteran
- Joined
- Oct 13, 1998
- Location
- Boise, Idaho
- TDI
- 2013 Passat TDI, Newmar Ventana 8.3L ISC 3945, 2016 E250 BT, 2000 Jetta TDI
The newer Garrett turbos (not the current VNT-15/17/20 etc) will have 1050C limits. KKK has an extra 30C margin on the turbine alloy.
DB
jnecr
Veteran Member
Damn, almost 2000F for the KP39s... But can the head, pistons, and exhaust mani take temps like that??
Edit: I guess the first two are cooled by oil, but what about the manifold?
Edit: I guess the first two are cooled by oil, but what about the manifold?
Drivbiwire
Zehntes Jahr der Veteran
- Joined
- Oct 13, 1998
- Location
- Boise, Idaho
- TDI
- 2013 Passat TDI, Newmar Ventana 8.3L ISC 3945, 2016 E250 BT, 2000 Jetta TDI
There is a reason why the TDI pistons have oil cooling passages cast within the piston dome. Also the reason why the TDI MANDATES synthetic oil.
The piston domes require the oil cooling jets to keep things under control.
Aluminum is capable of handling the temperatures in the exhaust ports. The gasses simply do not have the mass needed to melt the aluminum or cast iron.
The higher temps in the newer motors is related to the injection timing being so retarded to meet the NOx emissions. Imagine how hot things are going to get with CRI (Common Rail Injection) that injects a shot of fuel prior to exhaust valve opening to enrichen the combustion gasses and further reduce NOx by reducing the available oxygen which allows cheaper catalysts to be used that can handle the higher sulfur fuels.
DB
The piston domes require the oil cooling jets to keep things under control.
Aluminum is capable of handling the temperatures in the exhaust ports. The gasses simply do not have the mass needed to melt the aluminum or cast iron.
The higher temps in the newer motors is related to the injection timing being so retarded to meet the NOx emissions. Imagine how hot things are going to get with CRI (Common Rail Injection) that injects a shot of fuel prior to exhaust valve opening to enrichen the combustion gasses and further reduce NOx by reducing the available oxygen which allows cheaper catalysts to be used that can handle the higher sulfur fuels.
DB
jsrmonster said:Hi,
It's only good for about 4000 rpm before the piston starts to float. If it floats, the cam plate can come out of the drive pin and whammo.
Do the 5th gear nose job if you need to go that fast, better yet the DRW 6spd is awesome. You'll have bigger axles too.
I didn't know about the pump only running 4000 rpm. It runs great at 4500 but I gues I need to keep and eye on that. I do have the taller 5th .717. If I ever need to replace my tranny I see a6 speed in my future.
My temps would never go that high berfore the 11mm pump. But then again I dont normally push the car like I did yesterday. Thanks for the info Drivebywire.
jackbombay
Top Post Dawg
The 11mm should not be spun over 4000 RPm (crank)?
diesel des
Veteran Member
- Joined
- Aug 19, 1999
- Location
- Belfast,NI
The 11mm pump ran weel to 5500 rpm in my car. 8000 was too much though.
This is precisely the problem the Dodge guys are experiencing on their "600" common rail Cummins (04.5+). These guys run HOT. And the fuel economy suffers because of the post-injection.Drivbiwire said:
I remember a couple of years ago at a Chevy event (Dieselpage Rendevous) one guy ran 2000+ EGT for a full mile uphill towing 15,000 lbs. Didn't hurt a thing. The DuraMaxes have aluminum block/heads (and piston oil jets if I'm not mistaken.)
jackbombay
Top Post Dawg
But krout just installed an 11, I've read that about the 12s before though.KERMA said: