2005 TDI Passat excessive drive train vibration

I am experiencing a weird vibration related to motor rpm for the second time since I owned this vehicle. I had worse than normal vibration 40K and the dealer replaced motor mounts. Then about 2 months ago, I felt a similar vibration and took it to a non VW mechanic who replace the water pump, timing belts, idlers and serpantine motor mounts for the 80K tune up.

I told the mechanic / service manager not to replace the motor mounts unless needed. I said to validate with me in case it was not the problem.

The service manager call back and told me the mounts were OK but asked if I wanted to have them changed anyway. I misunderstood and thought she said they were bad and agreed to replace.

I picked up the vehicle on Monday and took it back because the vibration had increased by 100%. THe technician rode in the car and felt the vibration coming through the console, floor. The low torque noise came from the dashboard. The noise drops when I shift to neutral but it does not disappear.

He adusted one mount and told them I would be back if the problem was not resolved.

Now I am on the road and notice my mileage has drop 5 mpg! It sounds like a truck , feels like truck and have made arrangements to take it back to the garage.

In the meantime, I called two VW service centers and they have no Passat vibration tech notes. One suggested the EGR but they are telling me to drop it off at 99.00 an hour so they can look. Wonderful...

I hope other people can respond to this mysterious vibration issue!!!

redmax said:

I am experiencing a weird vibration related to motor rpm for the second time since I owned this vehicle. I had worse than normal vibration 40K and the dealer replaced motor mounts. Then about 2 months ago, I felt a similar vibration and took it to a non VW mechanic who replace the water pump, timing belts, idlers and serpantine motor mounts for the 80K tune up.

I told the mechanic / service manager not to replace the motor mounts unless needed. I said to validate with me in case it was not the problem.

The service manager call back and told me the mounts were OK but asked if I wanted to have them changed anyway. I misunderstood and thought she said they were bad and agreed to replace.

I picked up the vehicle on Monday and took it back because the vibration had increased by 100%. THe technician rode in the car and felt the vibration coming through the console, floor. The low torque noise came from the dashboard. The noise drops when I shift to neutral but it does not disappear.

He adusted one mount and told them I would be back if the problem was not resolved.

Now I am on the road and notice my mileage has drop 5 mpg! It sounds like a truck , feels like truck and have made arrangements to take it back to the garage.

In the meantime, I called two VW service centers and they have no Passat vibration tech notes. One suggested the EGR but they are telling me to drop it off at 99.00 an hour so they can look. Wonderful...

I hope other people can respond to this mysterious vibration issue!!!

Click to expand...

For one, check the "oil pump chain failure link" & "oil pump chain survey" listed a bit lower down in the posts. There is a balance shaft module in the oil pan area. If the chain starts to go, the engine vibrates a lot because the shafts get out of syn with the crank. I think the guys say it makes some sort of sound too, but I can not speak for this. It could be other problems as well. But perhaps get your mechanic to put a stethescope to the oil pan encase it is the oil pump chain. Also, could we get your engine production number and date to track this, if it is. It is located on the upper timing belt cover.
0XX, XXX format. You can see a pick of them in the photos.

Some of the other guys here will have some good ideas on some of the other possabilities.

I dropped the vehicle off at the mechanic who put on the timing belt and will need to call them in the morning with your recommendation.

Thanks and hope to share the engine production number. Another person in Canada is experiencing the same issue.

redmax said:

I dropped the vehicle off at the mechanic who put on the timing belt and will need to call them in the morning with your recommendation.

Thanks and hope to share the engine production number. Another person in Canada is experiencing the same issue.

Click to expand...

Not anymore
traded the car before warranty was out and became my problem.

I've got a vibration as well, but it's intermittent, and I don't know if I want to attribute it to the oil pump chain or not. I'm not hearing any noises, it's just as if there is a bit more vibration at idle than normal sometimes. I know I've got the right oil in there and it's really few and far between that this happens.

What's the warranty period on 05 Passat TDIs?

4yr/50k for bumper-to-bumper
5yr/60k on powertrain?

I'm assuming oil pump chain is considered powertrain.

Same Problem

TDIsyncro said:

For one, check the "oil pump chain failure link" & "oil pump chain survey" listed a bit lower down in the posts. There is a balance shaft module in the oil pan area. If the chain starts to go, the engine vibrates a lot because the shafts get out of syn with the crank. I think the guys say it makes some sort of sound too, but I can not speak for this. It could be other problems as well. But perhaps get your mechanic to put a stethescope to the oil pan encase it is the oil pump chain. Also, could we get your engine production number and date to track this, if it is. It is located on the upper timing belt cover.
0XX, XXX format. You can see a pick of them in the photos.
Some of the other guys here will have some good ideas on some of the other possabilities.

Click to expand...

Hi there ,

I have the same problem in my 2004 jetta, as well as i have been through 2 upper and 3 lower egr stainless tubes from the turbo{they crack on the expansion joint}, the vibration is intermittent and not there all the time. The only answer I get from VW is "those never wear ouT" Any ideas would be appreciated,

Thanks,

Shane

vibration

I have the same complaint on my 04 Jetta PD. The vibration is intermittant, but mostly when the engine is warmed. It started immediately after the EGR cooler recall was done. VW service and regional rep cannot explain and are unwilling to replace the cooler again. This has been going on for the past 22,000 miles. It is quite irritating. The vibration occurs from 2000-2500rpms. Different exhaust tone is also present. It is really no fun to drive the car as is.

Those of you with Jettas should go post it in the A4 forum. You have a different engine than the one found in the B5.5 Passats.

It's just the engine straining against the transmission and the resultant vibration setting up some resonance in the dash and HVAC components (big culprit is the HVAC duct behind the glove box). I managed to attenuate some of that by judicious damping of the duct with a good damper.... in this case a tennis ball

It's been getting a little warm here and my wife has been running a/c a bit since our passat is black. I definitely notice the vibration when sitting at a stop light in gear. If you put it in neutral, the vibration will go away. It almost as if the engine is idling slightly higher than it normally does when the vibration occurs. I can duplicate it by leaving the a/c off, and then very lightly power braking (just enough to raise the engine rpm 500 rpm) and the vibration starts. Let off the throttle and it goes away.

Passat Vibration When In Gear Solved!

Hey all with vibration problems in your Passat TDI....I just solved mine. My 2005 Passat PD 2.0 was vibrating like mad when in gear and foot on the brake. It would also vibrate when in park if it was on a hill.

I spent $1000 replacing all the motor and tranny mounts including the snub mount....no change

THEN, I read someone post about their same problem. They said that their driveaxle was causing a vibration with similar symptoms to mine....since I and every VW 'expert' in the area was at a loss (someone actually wanted to tear down the bottom end of my motor and look at the harmonic balance shaft timing to the tune of $800 with no guarantees), I said why not try it.

So I bought two driveaxles on RockAuto.com for $52 each and had my local mechanic install them. He insisted that driveaxles can't possibly cause a vibration in gear at idle but installed them anyway.

HE WAS WRONG!!!! The vibration is GONE! No vibration in gear, no vibration in park on incline....NONE. Apparently the INNER CV joint was bad on one side (I don't know or care which side it was) when torque was applied to the driveshaft. This caused expansion of the joint and the strange vibrating that rattled things in my glovebox and map pockets.

So if you have the same symptoms, replace your CV axles FIRST....it will be a lot cheaper than any motor mounts and in hindsight that was a HUGE waste of money, though now I have new motor and tranny mounts that shouldn't give me a bit of trouble for a long time.

Your mechanic may insist that this can't cause the vibration....baloney. I had two VW specialists AND the dealer look at it...none of them could figure out the real reason for the vibration and none of them suggested replacement of the driveaxles or that the inner CV joint could cause such symptoms. The dealer said that my idle pulley was bouncing around too much on the motor and that it was causing the vibration....wrong. I never replaced that idle pulley and the car now runs smooth as silk.

By the way, my vibration started after going over potholes on a nasty dirt road....so apparently you can damage your inner CV joint on bad road surfaces. Be careful! I hope this info saves anyone else some grief and money in solving their vibration problems.

Don't let anyone tear apart your motor looking for vibration from the balance shaft and don't replace your motor mounts if they aren't obviously leaking (they are fluid-filled) or damaged. All of those mechanics who looked at my engine in gear told me: "Boy that motor sure moves up and down a lot when you put it into gear...must be your motor mounts" .....wrong....I have brand new mounts and it still moves up and down nearly and inch when you put it in gear and NO vibration. Good luck!

Interesting...

Vibration at idle in gear is exactly what mine is doing, at 66,000 miles. It sounds normal at idle, and drives fine, so I don't think I have signs of BS disease yet.

Was there a test that showed your axles were bad before you replaced them?

This thread goes to show you that these cars are unique and have quirks that you only will discover on these forums!

Hmmmm....interesting indeed! Will have to save that bit of info for future reference. Thanks Treypt!

Mine has always had that typical, slightly more than your average gas car, vibration at idle, but I'm sure the level of my cars vibration is just the nature of the beast. Question for some, which ones are past that fine line of what is regular vibration, and what is too much. One thing is for sure, even on a 100% healthy BHW equipped Passat TDI, there is no such thing as no vibration on a stop at idle, with foot on brake and gear selector in drive. No such thing at all.

treypt said:

Hey all with vibration problems in your Passat TDI....I just solved mine. My 2005 Passat PD 2.0 was vibrating like mad when in gear and foot on the brake. It would also vibrate when in park if it was on a hill.

Click to expand...

I can understand the process by which the transmission in drive, engine idling, foot on the brake might allow idle impulses to be fed through the transmission, but no such power transmission takes place with the transmission in park.
I accept your assertion that replacing the axles fixed your vibration when in drive.
But I can not accept that the axles were the cause of your vibration when in park. Your vibration is gone now so you shouldn't really care what I think, but I believe some other action, perhaps as a result of the work performed while replacing the axles, was the true remedy.

unless excess play in the CVs allowed the whole shaft to jiggle around loosely?

Whatever the actual cause for the vibration, I can vouch that this is the true fix...I replaced both mine this past fall and am very pleased with the amount of vibration that is no longer there...Litterally my dashboard would shake while in drive at a stop light or stop sign...Now, as TreyPT said, smooth as silk (for a diesel that is)...

I still have that nagging feeling that something loosened up between 5-10k miles that made mine vibrate more than when it was brand new. I think mine is normal for a diesel, but not as smooth as when new.

Hey,
I have the 2005 PD and I,m in the process of changing the engine mounts. I usually do my own oil and filter changes but Last oil change I took it to local guy as I have the skid plate and wanted the oil drained. I get the 40k service kit fom www.worldimpex.com . While on the lift (this is small shop) the guy noticed some oil from engine mount had leaked onto skid plate. That was between Thanksgiving and Christmas. Over the holidays my lovely wife hit one of those NY potholes but didn't tell me until I noticed a vibration around 75 on highway. Then she had the ah ha oh yea pot hole announcement.
Anyways I suspect i will need an alignment but after reading your post and noticing the slight clik click sound coming from front while turning left I suspect the cv joint and axle may need attention as well.
Is this the same axle http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/raframecatalog.php
I have 127K on it and I love it. If you have the exact link or part # it would be appreciated as I am scheduling this work with Jason in Port jervis and when it's on the operating table I want to address this as well. I,m changing the engine mounts and doing the Tranny flush.
Thanks again,
Chris , Brewster NY
__________________
No Tree is so foolish as to have it's branches fight among themselves. (old Indian proverb)

New Indian Proverb: ? anyone.
B5 2005 Pasatt GLS. Avon Techs.

DPM said:

unless excess play in the CVs allowed the whole shaft to jiggle around loosely?

Click to expand...

In drive, perhaps the impulse was enough that the force normally attempting to cause the car to creep forward was becoming negative between power strokes. In that situation the 'hammering' on the CV would be noticed as a vibration.
In Park? The output is locked, the input is segregated and not connected hydraulically. There is no means of getting engine impulses to the CVs.

Back to treypt's last clue: "In park on an incline." The gravity force attempting to move the car but the park pawl is preventing that. The final drive is loaded and causes the engine and transmission to shift slightly on it's mounts, just as it would in drive with the brakes applied, but the load in that case is from the engine.
Too late to try this now, but I'd have bet that setting the parking brake on an incline, shifting to neutral and then back to park, would not have made the vibration.
I'll go further and bet that this vibration in park on an incline condition was only when nose up, and that nose down had none.
treypt's vibration is gone now. That's what mattered to him.

the tranny is locked, but the engine is free to move on it's mounts.

from post #11:

HE WAS WRONG!!!! The vibration is GONE! No vibration in gear, no vibration in park on incline....NONE. Apparently the INNER CV joint was bad on one side (I don't know or care which side it was) when torque was applied to the driveshaft. This caused expansion of the joint and the strange vibrating that rattled things in my glovebox and map pockets.

Click to expand...

So even though the transmission was locked and no torque could be applied from the engine, torque was being claimed as the cause of the vibration at the inner CV joint.

By the way, my vibration started after going over potholes on a nasty dirt road....so apparently you can damage your inner CV joint on bad road surfaces.

Click to expand...

I still see nothing in the description of the symptoms, nor of when / how the problem first was noticed, to change my belief that the labor to remove and replace the axles was the remedy, not the new axles themselves. I'm still of the opinion that something shifted from the pot-hole and that the R&R of the axles put things back to where they should have been.
I'm somewhat perplexed that, although the issue was apparently attributed, from the onset of the symptoms, to a suspension impact, the motor mounts were considered suspect.

there's still plenty of torque on the axles in park on an incline.. depending on the incline there might even be MORE torque on the axles in park than when it's in drive with the brakes applied...

But when it's in park there is no impulse from the engine passed through to the axles to cause vibration at the CV joints. There is no change of the torque applied to the axles.
The torque force created by gravity is not intermittant. It does not come and go. There is no means of gravity creating "vibration" in the inner CV joint of a level sufficient to cause it, in treypt's words, to "vibrate like mad".

OK, I am aware of the theory of "gravity waves", but these are minor even on a cosmological scale. Any fluctuation that might change the gravity of the car would equally change the gravity of the earth and result in no change relative to each other.

The degree of slop or of back-lash needed in the axle to create vibration in drive when the engine is applying a light pulsating load, or when parked on a slope when gravity is applying some constant degree of load, would certainly be noticed during transmission shifting or during the operator induced transition from acceleration to coasting, yet neither of these two blatantly obvious analogs that replicate the act of loading and unloading the axles are mentioned as conditions under which the vibration was present.

Unless there is something unique about our auto tranny setup, wouldn't this situation have appeared on other tdi's with auto trannys?

Lug_Nut said:

But when it's in park there is no impulse from the engine passed through to the axles to cause vibration at the CV joints. There is no change of the torque applied to the axles.
The torque force created by gravity is not intermittant. It does not come and go. There is no means of gravity creating "vibration" in the inner CV joint of a level sufficient to cause it, in treypt's words, to "vibrate like mad".

OK, I am aware of the theory of "gravity waves", but these are minor even on a cosmological scale. Any fluctuation that might change the gravity of the car would equally change the gravity of the earth and result in no change relative to each other.

The degree of slop or of back-lash needed in the axle to create vibration in drive when the engine is applying a light pulsating load, or when parked on a slope when gravity is applying some constant degree of load, would certainly be noticed during transmission shifting or during the operator induced transition from acceleration to coasting, yet neither of these two blatantly obvious analogs that replicate the act of loading and unloading the axles are mentioned as conditions under which the vibration was present.

Click to expand...

the torque from gravity and the parking pawl holding it will cause the engine to move slightly on its mounts.. even a slightly bad mount will let it transmit engine vibration to the cabin when it does this..

Personally I can't understand how a bad CV will cause a vibration when the car is at a standstill, regardless of gravity..

not to hijack, but my 05 with 42K only shakes in reverse. This is a relatively new quirk that i only noticed after installing my Thor skid plate.

Check the small cutout in the front of the plate for contact with the engine. I had to open up this cutout slightly on my a dieselgeek skid plate to prevent contact, but I can't remember if I only had it in reverse.

Mine vibrates like crazy in gear. I had a migraine yesterday and the vibrating was driving me nuts. Of course it didn't help that I sat on the expressway going nowhere for about an hour. Hopefully, some of this will disappear when I have the BS issue taken care of.