Looking at 2011 Sportwagen, A/C issues?

So my wife put a deposit on a 2011 Sportwagen, TDI 6 spd. 98k miles, hasn't moved much in the past 6 months according to carfax. I wanted to look it over before we buy it, car is in great shape. It was a chilly day here in New England (maybe 50 deg) but it didn't seem as if the A/c kicked on while in the lot.

Cooling fans did not turn on, felt the lines where I could reach under the hood and they were both same temperature, about same temps as outside. Did look like the a/c center was spinning like the clutch pulled in. Didn't drive the car.

Do the fan(s) kick on automatically like on my MK4? Car is at a local used dealer/garage. They told my wife it has a timing chain and never needs changing.... so I question what they say. Unfortunately it will be chilly tomorrow as well, and we were hoping to sign papers on it. Just dont want to fall for any BS.

Thanks,
Matt

You don't have a clutch, the compressor stays on all the time. It's a variable displacement compressor and at idle the compressor moves very little freon

And you do have a timing belt, it's due at 120,000.

Gotcha. Thought I saw a chart that said 130k on the belt.

How about fan operation, does one or both come on with ac turned on or is it based on something else?

Those require refrigerant pressure to make the fans come on, then their speed will ramp up as necessary. If it is cool out, the A/C won't likely require much of them.

The RCV is a very common issue on these, the part in the compressor that controls the stroke. It is difficult to properly evaluate the system's ability to remove heat from the cabin on a cool day, though. But the low side line should get cold feeling. You can also check the pressure with a scan tool.

Chances are the RCV is bad. Easy simple fix, no big deal.

In not too worried about it either, so long as I dont foot the bill for a new compressor right after I buy it. I have means for evacuating r134a and vacuum/recharge at home.
My only problem is, wifey put a deposit on the car. AC check is on the dealer checklist, and their mechanic is just a general mechanic. I would almost rather do it myself anyhow, but dealer doesn't want to budge in price (under 8k, btw). And ac working is on his checklist, right on the deposit contract.

I hate buying from dealers.

Well if it is a Volkswagen dealer, you can remind them there is a TSB for this issue.

If not, I'd not let them touch it. While a clutchless variable displacement compressor is hardly new, nor exclusive to VAG products, it is amazing how many people, including people in the automotive world, have never heard of one nor have any clue as to high to properly evaluate the system.

Well the sun came out and it was nice and toasty when we went to pick up papers for the bank. A/C cooled down quickly while parked so I guess it is ok

Thanks all.

Brought the car home, what a difference over our little ALH. Nice car, hopefully it turns out to be as reliable as the 1.9. Love the 6 speed.

Glad it is cooling!

My CPO '12 was not cooling at all unless I was on the freeway. First they tried to pass off a low refrigerant charge to me (not CPO) and charged me $155, before I even drove off I showed my advisor it still was not cooling at idle. Refunded my $155 and rescheduled me for another visit - initially told me they were replacing the compressor but ended up doing the TSB.

Ended up replacing the RCV valve (super common issue highlighted above) and it is ice freakin cold and I love it. After the fix their temp measurements from the center vent are 42 at idle and 35 while driving and I can honestly back that up - have not measured but the car will freeze me out if I need it.

If it pops up the TSB # is 87-18-05-AS - part # for the RCV on my car (understand there are 2 different compressors with 2 different RCV's) is 1KO 260 839 which retails for ~$135 looking online.

Great info, thank you.

Great info. RCV explains my system operation to a tee. This will be very helpful with my next dealership trip. I just wish I found this before the last trip, when they claim the system was empty so they evacuated added dye & recharged (found no leaks). Really had no way to test operation until recently, when it operates with RCV symptoms.

JELLOWSUBMARINE said:

Great info. RCV explains my system operation to a tee. This will be very helpful with my next dealership trip. I just wish I found this before the last trip, when they claim the system was empty so they evacuated added dye & recharged (found no leaks). Really had no way to test operation until recently, when it operates with RCV symptoms.

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Same boat here. Dealership tech told me at 130k my compressor needed replacement because "they're always on and wear out right about now."

One of the many reasons we opted for the buyback...that was 3 years ago.

JELLOWSUBMARINE said:

Great info. RCV explains my system operation to a tee. This will be very helpful with my next dealership trip. I just wish I found this before the last trip, when they claim the system was empty so they evacuated added dye & recharged (found no leaks). Really had no way to test operation until recently, when it operates with RCV symptoms.

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What year models are affected by the RCV TSB? Is it '10-'14?

S1C EM said:

What year models are affected by the RCV TSB? Is it '10-'14?

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Any VAG product with a clutchless compressor.... so essentially every A5, A6, A7, B6, NMS, NCS/B, etc.

I just did one this week on a 2014 Jetta S 2.slo. I've done them on lots of the 2.5L cars, BRM, CBEA,CJAA TDIs, lots of EA888s (provided they run long enough).

I cannot say I have done it on any of the VR6 cars, nor any of the T'reg/Q7s or any of the longitudinal Audis.

oilhammer said:

Any VAG product with a clutchless compressor.... so essentially every A5, A6, A7, B6, NMS, NCS/B, etc.

.

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So how does this "constantly engaged" pump keep from freezing up? Does the RCV do all the work like a variable orifice to regulate? I'm only used to the temp regulated orifice or fixed orifice systems

The shaft is always spinning, but the compressor is regulated from "0%" to "100%" by the RCV.

A clutched variable displacement compressor does not start at 0%. It may go as low as 25% or so, but still relies on the clutch to turn it off.

Lots of modern cars have clutchless compressors. It isn't anything new nor VAG exclusive.

The only VAG products that use an orifice tube system are the B5 Passats, the Phaeton, and some Audis. Everything else, including your car, use an expansion valve system.

Variable displacement compressors on VAG products came along in 1993, with R134a, the only exception being the 1993 Cabriolet, which held on to the old cycling compressor R12 system for that last year sold here.

oilhammer said:

The shaft is always spinning, but the compressor is regulated from "0%" to "100%" by the RCV.

A clutched variable displacement compressor does not start at 0%. It may go as low as 25% or so, but still relies on the clutch to turn it off.

Lots of modern cars have clutchless compressors. It isn't anything new nor VAG exclusive.

The only VAG products that use an orifice tube system are the B5 Passats, the Phaeton, and some Audis. Everything else, including your car, use an expansion valve system.

Variable displacement compressors on VAG products came along in 1993, with R134a, the only exception being the 1993 Cabriolet, which held on to the old cycling compressor R12 system for that last year sold here.

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Don't ever quit this forum, your my hero! ha

You remember my 04 Passat, you helped me through a few jams

Ha, I'm not going anywhere.

oilhammer said:

Ha, I'm not going anywhere.

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Good!


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ss_mini14 said:

And you do have a timing belt, it's due at 120,000.

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the manual for my 2011 says timing belt due at 80k?

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asgoodasdead said:

the manual for my 2011 says timing belt due at 80k?

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No way, 130k. My old 2011 had book that said 130. I have 2014, same thing.


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So jumping back to this thread as it was 90 degrees yesterday, wife called me and said AC was barely working.


I got home, hooked up gauges and turned on AC full blast, temp was down to about 85, fairly humid out. Low side was around 50 psi, high side was around 140 I believe, seemed high and low. Both fans were spinning, front of condenser from what I could see looked clean. Air out vents was just slightly cooler than outside. I don't have VCDS for this car yet.


Anything else to check, or just order a new control valve?

https://www.motor.com/magazine-summary/diagnosing-variable-displacement-compressors/ . I don't have much experience diagnosing variable displacement compressors but this article is helpful.

ss_mini14 said:

https://www.motor.com/magazine-summary/diagnosing-variable-displacement-compressors/ . I don't have much experience diagnosing variable displacement compressors but this article is helpful.

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Great read