What oil next in my 2006 TDI. BRM 1.9l

patter98

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TC, Michigan
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2015 Jetta TDI SEL, 2015 Touareg TDI Lux
Hello everyone,

I know there has been many threads about which oil and everyones opinions. I am at 43k right now and plan to do an oil change at 45k. Yes i am still under warranty. The only oil my dealer carries is still the oil Castrol TXT 505.01. I am aware that oil is not even full Syth...I have looked at putting Motul 100% Syth 505.01 in it next, i havent read to much on it or seen a ton of information. What are everyones opinions on using a 506.01 or a 507 oil in it? Has there not been letters approving it for my engine under warranty? Here is the real question i have....Mobil 1 TDT 5W40...Seems to be the flat out non warranty option does it not? I am under warranty on my powertrain till next september (2011) or 60k. Which will be about the same time on my driving schedule. Is it not worth the risk of using TDT and then something happening which would not be the oil's fault and then they blame it? I am really at a lost of what oil to use that will help protect the cam the most while hopefully retaining my warranty i seem to be using more and more lately.

What is the best warranty oil for my 1.9l PD BRM? 505.01, 506.01, 507?

Best overall oil warranty or not based on OA? Worth voiding warranty?

Thanks,
Justin
 

Joe_Meehan

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Any oil that meets VW's specifications is just fine. Any oil that does not is NOT GOOD. The dealer uses whatever he can get the cheapest. There really is no reason you should not, unless it makes you feel better to pay more.

The only way you can do it wrong is to not change it when you should or use an oil that fails to meet VW's specifications.

We worry a lot about oil, but we very seldom if ever see an engine damaged due to using any oil that meets VW's specifications.
 

GoFaster

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Location
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2006 Jetta TDI
Avoid Xw30 oils in this engine regardless of specification approvals. That rules out 506.01 and 507.00.

Use either a 5w40 505.01 oil (any of them) if you want to keep your warranty valid.
 

ruking

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patter98 said:
Hello everyone,

I know there has been many threads about which oil and everyones opinions. I am at 43k right now and plan to do an oil change at 45k. Yes i am still under warranty. The only oil my dealer carries is still the oil Castrol TXT 505.01. I am aware that oil is not even full Syth...I have looked at putting Motul 100% Syth 505.01 in it next, i havent read to much on it or seen a ton of information. What are everyones opinions on using a 506.01 or a 507 oil in it? Has there not been letters approving it for my engine under warranty? Here is the real question i have....Mobil 1 TDT 5W40...Seems to be the flat out non warranty option does it not? I am under warranty on my powertrain till next september (2011) or 60k. Which will be about the same time on my driving schedule. Is it not worth the risk of using TDT and then something happening which would not be the oil's fault and then they blame it? I am really at a lost of what oil to use that will help protect the cam the most while hopefully retaining my warranty i seem to be using more and more lately.

What is the best warranty oil for my 1.9l PD BRM? 505.01, 506.01, 507?

Best overall oil warranty or not based on OA? Worth voiding warranty?

Thanks,
Justin
Actually these are good questions. The essential issue: snap shot base line (is what is the condition of your BRM camshaft,... NOW).

Get a hold of your local guru.

1. I would basically start with a visual inspection of the camshaft (the critical piece in question on the PD).

2. DIY if you know what you are doing. POP the valve cover.

3. In the VERY remote case that it is indeed starting to wear irregularly, NO oil will repair that ! Obviously this would be the correct time to submit it to a VW dealer/Corporate for the fix.


http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=205814

Assuming no issues, the above link is a good place to start for your research to come up with your top 5 oil list. Mobil One 5w40, Total, Castrol , etc.

I personally would use the Mobil One 5w40 TDT (5w40 is almost critical for PD camshafts) . I have been doing so for 128,000 miles and with 20,000 to 25,000 OCI's, BUT... in a ALH engine (2003). So from that point of view, I have "no skin in the game. ". Next on my list would be Total.
 
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Dimitri16V

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DE
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01 Golf, 04 Golf
it is a dilemma

use a GroupIII 505.01 with low levels pf ZDDP for the warranty period and possibly cause accelerated cam wear which will show up at 100K
OR
bite the bullet and use a non 505.01 oil PAO oil like M-1 TDT that probably is better for the cam but its use voids the warranty

If I had to do it again I would go with the second option. In your case , you should add some ZDDP additive and use 505.01
 

patter98

Veteran Member
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Location
TC, Michigan
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2015 Jetta TDI SEL, 2015 Touareg TDI Lux
Dimitri16V said:
it is a dilemma

use a GroupIII 505.01 with low levels pf ZDDP for the warranty period and possibly cause accelerated cam wear which will show up at 100K
OR
bite the bullet and use a non 505.01 oil PAO oil like M-1 TDT that probably is better for the cam but its use voids the warranty

If I had to do it again I would go with the second option. In your case , you should add some ZDDP additive and use 505.01
Thats exactly what I am asking about. I feel like its russian roulette either way.....BUT you bring up a good point. I could keep with the 505.01 and use an additive. Now the question is. What is the best 505.01 and what is the best additive and how exactly do i use it (qty?).

Thanks everyone. You are all a wealth of knowledge.
 

dieselstein

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use the cheapest 505.01 for now but cut your OCI by 1/3 or 1/2 to be safe. after that, go nuts. try whatever. if the cam is going to fail, its the design and the cam itself, not the oil that'll save it. i'm running Mobil 1 TDT 5w40 which is NOT 505.01 (yet highly regarded as a good oil for the PD) but my car has almost 90k miles on the odo. no issues as of yet but i did an early change at 2500 miles and now i'll drain and fill at another 5000 miles and keep that oci until the car is done.
 

patter98

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dieselstein said:
use the cheapest 505.01 for now but cut your OCI by 1/3 or 1/2 to be safe. after that, go nuts. try whatever. if the cam is going to fail, its the design and the cam itself, not the oil that'll save it. i'm running Mobil 1 TDT 5w40 which is NOT 505.01 (yet highly regarded as a good oil for the PD) but my car has almost 90k miles on the odo. no issues as of yet but i did an early change at 2500 miles and now i'll drain and fill at another 5000 miles and keep that oci until the car is done.
Since owning the car (starting at 30K) i have changed it with Castrol TXT 505.01 every 5k. The previous owner looks like he changed the oil ever 7-10k with the same oil. As of now i plan to change to Mobil 1 TDT 5W40 in Sept of 2011 or 60k unless there is something better then of course.

Anybody have a good additive i could use?.... wouldn't that void my warranty? Just wondering

Thanks.
 

MPLSTDI

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Champlin, MN
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06 Jetta DSG
I personally ran Motul 100% Syth 505.01 5w40 while I was under warranty, at 10k intervals. I started using Mobile TDT 5w40 at 60K, make sure it's the CJ-4 group oil(it should all be by now).
If I would have known at the time, (The CAM issue hadn't come up yet) I would have used TDT while I was under warranty too.
 

Dunno513

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Mirror Lake, NH
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2006 NB PD-TDI DSG
Gry water used as oil will get these cars past the warranty period without issue... so using the "under warranty" as an angle to keep with requirements is a gamble...

1. Do you choose the better oil (proven here time and time again) and risk having a random failure which VW will want you to provide documentation for each OCI before they cover the cost.... or

2. Do you use VW spec oil during the warranty period only to realize that once again VW's spec protects them, not you, and now you have an engine that will most likely fail before others. But as a parting gift you have that warm fuzzy feeling that you were covered should anything have gone wrong, but didn't.

Step up... Use the better oil regardless is my take. If you have an issue.. I'm sure someone on this thread will gladly toss you some receipts for the "correct oil" Not like an oil analysis of the oil in the crank is going to determine the "brand" of oil used or "spec" As long as you have oil in there.. you're good.

And yes.. I'm pro-screw VW.. because they are pro-screw the owner. (proven here time and time again)
 

Joe_Meehan

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Dunno513 said:
...Step up... Use the better oil regardless is my take. If you have an issue..
Do you have any empirical data to indicate that this or that oil is better than what VW recommends? Better meaning longer life. Of if you like better in some other meaningful way.

I only ask this because I have not been able to find the data, and the usual response I get is someone did an oil test and found that under this or that lab test this or that oil was superior under the test conditions; which may or may not be reflected in longer overall life in the real word. Longer life meaning a meaningful longer life for that part and for the overall life of the engine/car?

I am not suggesting that lab test results may be an indication, but looking at all the adds on TV and in print for all kinds of products, I find that 90.57% of them pick a single factor which may or may not be material to sell a product. Sort of the Billy Maze proof.
 

Dunno513

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2006 NB PD-TDI DSG
8/25/09
Average wear for API ---- 4.10 ppm TWM
Average wear for VAG --- 8.38 ppm TWM

For the top 24 users in each catagory shows that API oils are 26% lower in wear over VAG oils.


As for which brand of oil is better within each spec... Mobil, Amsoil, Shell, etc... I think you are splitting hairs but for the most part... VAG spec isn't the cat's meow as they would like you to think.
 

Joe_Meehan

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Dunno513 said:
8/25/09
Average wear for API ---- 4.10 ppm TWM
Average wear for VAG --- 8.38 ppm TWM

For the top 24 users in each catagory shows that API oils are 26% lower in wear over VAG oils.


As for which brand of oil is better within each spec... Mobil, Amsoil, Shell, etc... I think you are splitting hairs but for the most part... VAG spec isn't the cat's meow as they would like you to think.
OK. Now is the difference in wear meaningful? Yea, it is 50%, but is 50% meaningful. If say 2 out of a million cars fail with API over their life time compared with say 10 out of a million with VAG, is it meaningful? I would say no.

I am not saying that is the case, but the numbers I see, including what you just presented, does not really say much with out knowing more about the real world live cycle results.
 

raybo

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Dunno513 said:
8/25/09
Average wear for API ---- 4.10 ppm TWM
Average wear for VAG --- 8.38 ppm TWM

For the top 24 users in each catagory shows that API oils are 26% lower in wear over VAG oils.


As for which brand of oil is better within each spec... Mobil, Amsoil, Shell, etc... I think you are splitting hairs but for the most part... VAG spec isn't the cat's meow as they would like you to think.
This means very little - WHICH Vag oils are being compared with the API oils???? 505.00??? 505.01??? (if so, 5w30 or 5w40, which brand, the "old" spec or "new" spec, etc.), 507.00???

Ray
 

40X40

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raybo said:
This means very little - WHICH Vag oils are being compared with the API oils???? 505.00??? 505.01??? (if so, 5w30 or 5w40, which brand, the "old" spec or "new" spec, etc.), 507.00???

Ray

Nice point.

OP, listen to the fellow on the first page that is a moderator. Ignore anyone that has been a member less than two years and anyone whose advice would void your remaining warranty or who does not have the same model car as you do.

AFTER your warranty is up consider using Mobil 1 TDT, it has a good rep around here.

JMO.


Bill
 
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hid3

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Why to wait until warranty is over? Just start using TDT NOW! If you have any engine/oil/etc issues then just pour out TDT and pour in 505.01.

Besides, the practice shows that VW almost never asks about 505.01 usage history when it comes to warranty claims about cams and etc..
 

40X40

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hid3 said:
<SNIP> If you have any engine/oil/etc issues then just pour out TDT and pour in 505.01.

<SNIP>


If one did that they would be acting dishonestly, wouldn't they?

Read the forum rules.


Bill
 

Kier

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I have been using Mobil-1 ESP 5W-30, 504.00/507.00 for the past 4 oil changes with very good results. After using the Pella oil extractor, I am pulling out 4L of dirty oil. I only add 4L for my oil changes since the dip stick reads full with 4L. So I am not burning a drop of oil. The 507.00 is backward compatible with 505.01. I also have been buying the Mobil-1 product at Pep boys for $6.99 per liter. I used to buy Motul online, but the price plus shipping was over the top. Make sure you buy the 5W-30 with the Gold Caps in 1-Liter bottles. The 5W-40 is for MB 229.3 spec only.
 

Joe_Meehan

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hid3 said:
And what illegal activity did I encourage? TDT usage? ...
Why to wait until warranty is over? Just start using TDT NOW! If you have any engine/oil/etc issues then just pour out TDT and pour in 505.01.


That would be an illegal activity.
 

patter98

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Joe_Meehan said:
Why to wait until warranty is over? Just start using TDT NOW! If you have any engine/oil/etc issues then just pour out TDT and pour in 505.01.


That would be an illegal activity.
I agree what he is implying is indeed illegal but he actually never says "pour out TDT put in 505.01 and THEN take it to the dealer for a warranty claim" i agree it is suggested/implied but he doesnt actually say take it to the dealer after swapping and making a false claim.

I am really up in the air about what to do so far....all good information just seems i have a choice to make.

I searched the MX records from the first owner and he was using the Castrol 505.01 5W30 oil. I have been using the TXT 505.01 (5W40) since then (two changes in 10k).


-Justin
 

hid3

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Look here: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showpost.php?p=2928997&postcount=24

VW denied a claim due to cam problem even not asking about oil usage history. What are the chances you'll be asked for it? And also, what are the chances VW will cover the repairs? I guess close to zero. Still, why not start using TDT now and avoid possible problems in the future?

If not, then what's the purpose of this thread then? If you can't use anything apart 505.01 why to start a thread and ask for advice? All opinions should be heard, if aske for.
 

mlemorie

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Where do you guys get the TDT? Ive been using Castrol SLX Professional OE 5w30 for my oil changes so far, but thats due in part because I get most of the oil I need for free lol. I want to go to a better 5w 40 since I replaced the cam and lifters once, and I would like to not have to do it again if possible. I havent looked much online, and the only compression ignition oil that my local advanced auto/autozone carries is Rotella T, which I have used in my chevette. Im about 400 miles away from my next oil change and I just want to use something a bit better.
 

raybo

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The correct questions are: Which 505.01 oil is best, or which 507.00 oil is best.

I'm on my second change with Mobil ESP 5w30 507.00/229.51/LL04 in my '01 Golf with 243K miles - in 3K miles since the last change, the dipstick still shows full. At this rate, it will be the best oil I have ever used re: usage - much better than the Elf 507.00 where I added approx 1/2 liter over 10K. The only other oil that came close was Elf Full-Tech 0w30.

Ray
 

hid3

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raybo said:
The correct questions are: Which 505.01 oil is best, or which 507.00 oil is best.
All 505.01 oils are good and also all 507.00 oils are good. You need to do a really scientific research (test at least a few thousands of engines with same mileage, same driving habbits, same conditions, climate, fuel, load, etc etc etc) in order to say which one 505.01 oil is the best from the 505.01's oil group and which one is the best from 507.00 group. Anything else is just a wild guess/coincidence or mathematical statistics.
 

Dimitri16V

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hid3 said:
And what illegal activity did I encourage? TDT usage?

Is 505.00 oil usage in a PD encouragement is also illegal activity? It should be. Then you should show these rules to Dmitrij too.

You're a typical average american id**t. You need to see your psychiatrist ASAP.
using a non conforming oil or an addtive and hiding from VW is not illegal
"activity".
 

damnyankee

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VAG oils are only good for the emissions equipment, not good for the camshaft. And, 507.00 IS NOT backwards compatible to 505.01....it has even less ZDDP than 505.01.

Of course one can use that junk and stay with the warranty guidelines.....or one can use an oil with ample amounts of ZDDP or add ZDDPlus to 505.01/507.00.

Oh, and what's more illegal.......using a non 505.01 or 507.00 oil or VW knowlingly screwing its costomers with poorly made camshafts and/or oiling design?
 
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